SBC on Stewardship versus Preachers

[mes228]

I agree 100% with the SBC positition on stewardship ie giving/tithing and disagree just about 100% with every Baptist sermon I've heard on the subject. The "Baptist Faith and Message" Section XIII "Stewardship" (as it's too long to post here I'll post only portions) "Christians have a spiritual debtorship to the whole world... A binding stewardship in their possessions....they are under obligation to serve Him with their time, talent, and possessions and should recognize these as entrusted to them for the glory of God and helping others... Christians should contribute of their means cheerfully, regularly, systematically, proportionately, and liberally....

Please notice, not one word about percentages, stealing from God, under a curse,
first ten percent, etc.. The SBC has not a word of whom to "give" to - none of "if you don't tithe to God (meaning "me") your stealing, etc.Not one word of tithing being necessary for membership in any church body etc. ad nauseaum. The SBC statement is balanced, proper use of scripture, and a correct understanding of scripture. Incendentally, also a position that other Christians teach and embrace ie Methodist, Lutheran, Presbyterian.

Most Baptist preachers teach a most rank kind of legalism when it comes to money. Freedom in everything except support of whatever his particuliar "work" is. They lay burdens on mens shoulders that are in some cases difficult to bear. Also you never hear a word that not all monies are tithable ie retirement, social security, insurance, etc.etc. Even by the most legalistic scripture twisting only "increase" by your labor would be tithable (all other main stream Christian groups recognize this).

Why is this imortant to me? I am Baptist and have a friend that recently had open heart surgery. He is Baptist, and a Sunday School Teacher and interim pastor on ocassion. Forced into Bankruptcy over medical bills, and barely living on Social Security, he feels he must tithe. They have nothing and have already tithed themselves into bankruptcy with the health issue. And no one has ever explained to them that not all monies are "increase". I suspect some Preachers will have a tough time explaining to God the burdens they have placed on this kind elderly couple. Is this not evil?? All idolatry is- is a false belief of who and what God is ie his nature. Scripture taught wrongly is enslavement. Tithing as taught by most Baptist preachers is enslavement. The SBC has it correct. It's a shame my friend never knew the true Baptist doctrine on tithing, only the mouthing of Preachers.

 

[Allan]

I agree 100% with the SBC positition on stewardship ie giving/tithing and disagree just about 100% with every Baptist sermon I've heard on the subject. The "Baptist Faith and Message" Section XIII "Stewardship" (as it's too long to post here I'll post only portions) "Christians have a spiritual debtorship to the whole world... A binding stewardship in their possessions....they are under obligation to serve Him with their time, talent, and possessions and should recognize these as entrusted to them for the glory of God and helping others... Christians should contribute of their means cheerfully, regularly, systematically, proportionately, and liberally....

Please notice, not one word about percentages, stealing from God, under a curse,
first ten percent, etc.. The SBC has not a word of whom to "give" to - none of "if you don't tithe to God (meaning "me") your stealing, etc.Not one word of tithing being necessary for membership in any church body etc. ad nauseaum. The SBC statement is balanced, proper use of scripture, and a correct understanding of scripture. Incendentally, also a position that other Christians teach and embrace ie Methodist, Lutheran, Presbyterian.

Most Baptist preachers teach a most rank kind of legalism when it comes to money. Freedom in everything except support of whatever his particuliar "work" is. They lay burdens on mens shoulders that are in some cases difficult to bear. Also you never hear a word that not all monies are tithable ie retirement, social security, insurance, etc.etc. Even by the most legalistic scripture twisting only "increase" by your labor would be tithable (all other main stream Christian groups recognize this).

Why is this imortant to me? I am Baptist and have a friend that recently had open heart surgery. He is Baptist, and a Sunday School Teacher and interim pastor on ocassion. Forced into Bankruptcy over medical bills, and barely living on Social Security, he feels he must tithe. They have nothing and have already tithed themselves into bankruptcy with the health issue. And no one has ever explained to them that not all monies are "increase". I suspect some Preachers will have a tough time explaining to God the burdens they have placed on this kind elderly couple. Is this not evil?? All idolatry is- is a false belief of who and what God is ie his nature. Scripture taught wrongly is enslavement. Tithing as taught by most Baptist preachers is enslavement. The SBC has it correct. It's a shame my friend never knew the true Baptist doctrine on tithing, only the mouthing of Preachers.

Is God not able to sustain him?
His heart shows his passion for one who gives him all and IF he gives his all to God, will God not honor his sacrifice and adoration?

Did His preacher go to him to let him know that he must still tithe?
THEN and ONLY THEN do you have an argument, particularly with the SBC if THEY told him that.

I believe he should tithe because that is what his heart desires (regardless of your opinion, which is worthless between him and God) But I also believe the Church should come along side and give all the finacial help it can must and if it can't do much seek the help of other churches during his time of need.

That is my nickle...*clink*

 

[mes228]

Sbc

Allan, by that reasoning a non-christian that feels it's O.K. to blow you up is justified in the eyes of God. Or if he gives to Alquaida because he fervently believes it's the godly thing to do is honored by God?? Or a brain washed person in a "christian" cult that has been taught wrongly - but believes as he was taught, dosen't suffer for a his wrong beliefs?? Perhaps I'm being too harsh on Preachers but many people teach convenient half-truths that are self serving when it comes to money. Especially the telvision evangelist.

 

[Allan]

Allan, by that reasoning a non-christian that feels it's O.K. to blow you up is justified in the eyes of God. Or if he gives to Alquaida because he fervently believes it's the godly thing to do is honored by God?? Or a brain washed person in a "christian" cult that has been taught wrongly - but believes as he was taught, dosen't suffer for a his wrong beliefs?? Perhaps I'm being too harsh on Preachers but many people teach convenient half-truths that are self serving when it comes to money. Especially the telvision evangelist.

Agreed SOME do because they are the ones in it for the money.

But you weren't speaking of Alquaida, non-christians, or cult members. You asked a question about a believer (assumed from you post about this friend of yours) and him not having enough money but feels he should still be giving a tithe. You never said anything about the pastor coming to him and reminding him to tithe or the SBC doing anything equivalent. I for one believe the tithe scriptual and have lived by it (due to MY OWN STUDIES of it and resolve of stewardship) even when I had bills, in GREAT need of groceries for family, and no gas for my car to go to work for that week. And yet I gave the tithe according to my understanding of scripture and do you know God met my EVERY need and some much so I was able to help others in some measure that were also in need. :godisgood:

 

[AresMan]

The SBC statement of stewardship is correct. There is nothing in the Bible about "tithing" money to a church. The only tithing commands from the Bible were the Levitical tithe laws which were annual tithes of crops and livestock from the Promised Land in seven year cycles in which

Years 1, 2, 4, and 5 were eaten by the tithers (and shared with the Levites) in a large feast conglomerately in Jerusalem;
Years 3 and 6 were laid outside the gates for the Levites and poor (later these third-year tithes were brought to storehouse chambers in the Temple);
Year 7 eaten by the tithers locally; and
on the year of Jubilee (the year after seven cycles) there was no tithing.

There is nothing about tithing to a church in the Bible. The early church evidenced abundant giving, meeting needs, selling possessions, and having all things common. If the SBC statement of stewardship properly teaches stewardship of the church and meeting needs, without "tithing," there is no need to correct it.

 

[Allan]

The SBC statement of stewardship is correct. There is nothing in the Bible about "tithing" money to a church. The only tithing commands from the Bible were the Levitical tithe laws which were annual tithes of crops and livestock from the Promised Land in seven year cycles in which

Years 1, 2, 4, and 5 were eaten by the tithers (and shared with the Levites) in a large feast conglomerately in Jerusalem;
Years 3 and 6 were laid outside the gates for the Levites and poor (later these third-year tithes were brought to storehouse chambers in the Temple);
Year 7 eaten by the tithers locally; and
on the year of Jubilee (the year after seven cycles) there was no tithing.

There is nothing about tithing to a church in the Bible. The early church evidenced abundant giving, meeting needs, selling possessions, and having all things common. If the SBC statement of stewardship properly teaches stewardship of the church and meeting needs, without "tithing," there is no need to correct it.

Which tithes? There was more than one type of tithe.

 

[AresMan]

Which tithes? There was more than one type of tithe.

If by more than one "type" of tithe you are referring to the tithe of the herd and the tithe of the crops, the tithe of the crops could be redeemed for its value + 20%. The tithe of the herd could not be redeemed, because the priests needed the herds for burnt offerings.

If by more than one "type" of tithe, you are referring to "the Levites' tithe," "the poor tithe," and "the festival tithe," it is debatable as to whether these tithes are additional or are the same one used for different purposes at different times. I tend to think they were the same tithe used for different purposes at different times.

There was an obvious seven year cycle:

On years 1, 2, 4, and 5 the tithes were brought together in Jerusalem and eaten by the tithers (and shared with the Levites) in a large feast of praise. The people were allowed to eat unclean animals and drink strong drink during these annual tithe festivals.

On years 3 and 6, the tithes were laid outside the gates locally for the Levites and poor to glean. Later, under king Hezekiah, these third year tithes were brought to the Temple storehouse chambers instead.

On year 7 (Sabbatical year), the tithes were eaten by the tithers locally instead of conglomerately in Jerusalem.

After seven of these cycles (forty-nine years), on the fiftieth year, the year of Jubilee, there were no tithes.