SDA and failed prophecies

[BobRyan]

Until you read your Bible and start testing doctrines "sola scriptura" instead of "sola man-made-tradition ad populum".

1 Cor 15 "We shall not ALL sleep -- but we shall ALL be changed in a moment in the twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet"

Turns out they did ALL asleep from Paul's day onward.


Notice that these texts are so "offensive" to the bible intolerant that they will not respond to them or deal with them "as if we were on a Catholic board".

How is it that sola-scriptura testing and evaluation is so offensive to those posting on this thread?? They avoid Jeremiah 18 like it was scripture.

They avoid Jonah 3 -- like it was scripture.

They avoid the example given in the Exodus -- like it was scripture.

they avoid discussing the principle of these 2 cases ... one for calamity and one example for blessing deferred - like it was scripture.

Wait! I know why... because "it is scripture" and it does not please their "preference of the moment".

 

[targus]

Bob Ryan, we get it. We know about conditional prophecies.

The question which has been asked over and over without an answer from you is "How do SDA's know that the specific prophecy referred to in the OP is a conditional prophecy and not a false prophesy?"

 

[BobRyan]

Bob Ryan, we get it. We know about conditional prophecies.

The question which has been asked over and over without an answer from you is "How do SDA's know that the specific prophecy referred to in the OP is a conditional prophecy and not a false prophesy?"

The question you avoid is - how did you imagine to exclude any prophecy from Jeremiah 18 doctrine on prophecy?

To dance around that question as if the Bible teaching on prophecy "does not matter" is where your entire argument falls apart.

again.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

Until you read your Bible and start testing doctrines "sola scriptura" instead of "sola man-made-tradition ad populum".

1 Cor 15 "We shall not ALL sleep -- but we shall ALL be changed in a moment in the twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet"

Turns out they did ALL asleep from Paul's day onward.


Notice that these texts are so "offensive" to the bible intolerant that they will not respond to them or deal with them "as if we were on a Catholic board".

How is it that sola-scriptura testing and evaluation is so offensive to those posting on this thread?? They avoid Jeremiah 18 like it was scripture.

They avoid Jonah 3 -- like it was scripture.

They avoid the example given in the Exodus -- like it was scripture.

they avoid discussing the principle of these 2 cases ... one for calamity and one example for blessing deferred - like it was scripture.

Wait! I know why... because "it is scripture" and it does not please their "preference of the moment".

In 1Thess 4 "We who are alive AND remain will be caught up together with THEM in the air".

Paul did not live past the first century - neither do any of his contemporary readers.

1Cor 15 "WE shall not all asleep - but we shall all be changed".

 

[matt wade]

The systematic way the original question has been avoided is very telling. If one isn't able to defend what they believe, then either they lack the knowledge to do so or (more likely) the belief can't be defended.

This is an absolutely pitiful display going on here and solidifies the SDA status as a cult in my mind.

 

[targus]

In 1Thess 4 "We who are alive AND remain will be caught up together with THEM in the air".

Paul did not live past the first century - neither do any of his contemporary readers.

1Cor 15 "WE shall not all asleep - but we shall all be changed".

The "we" referred to in these passages is the Church - not only Christians living at the time that those Scriptures were written.

Your prophet was specific in speaking about those who attended the conference.

 

[BobRyan]

So then Paul "meant to say" --- "THOSE who are alive and remain will be caught up together with US/WE who have died and then will have been raised"??

Someone should inform him of that.. at the resurrection.

 

[BobRyan]

Until you read your Bible and start testing doctrines "sola scriptura" instead of "sola man-made-tradition ad populum".

1 Cor 15 "We shall not ALL sleep -- but we shall ALL be changed in a moment in the twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet"

Turns out they did ALL asleep from Paul's day onward.


Notice that these texts are so "offensive" to the bible intolerant that they will not respond to them or deal with them "as if we were on a Catholic board".

How is it that sola-scriptura testing and evaluation is so offensive to those posting on this thread?? They avoid Jeremiah 18 like it was scripture.

They avoid Jonah 3 -- like it was scripture.

They avoid the example given in the Exodus -- like it was scripture.

they avoid discussing the principle of these 2 cases ... one for calamity and one example for blessing deferred - like it was scripture.

Wait! I know why... because "it is scripture" and it does not please their "preference of the moment".

How sad that the catholic tactics of the dark ages for avoiding scripture are being used here to avoid the scriptures listed in this example.

The systematic way the original question has been avoided is very telling. If one isn't able to defend what they believe, then either they lack the knowledge to do so or (more likely) the belief can't be defended.

Finally! Someone sees the point I have been making from scripture!

It is about time.


Only to "flip flop.... flop" back in the pail.

This is an absolutely pitiful display going on here and solidifies the SDA status as a cult in my mind.

Well it is short-lived but at least sparky.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[Yeshua1]

Until you read your Bible and start testing doctrines "sola scriptura" instead of "sola man-made-tradition ad populum".

1 Cor 15 "We shall not ALL sleep -- but we shall ALL be changed in a moment in the twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet"

Turns out they did ALL asleep from Paul's day onward.


Notice that these texts are so "offensive" to the bible intolerant that they will not respond to them or deal with them "as if we were on a Catholic board".

How is it that sola-scriptura testing and evaluation is so offensive to those posting on this thread?? They avoid Jeremiah 18 like it was scripture.

They avoid Jonah 3 -- like it was scripture.

They avoid the example given in the Exodus -- like it was scripture.

they avoid discussing the principle of these 2 cases ... one for calamity and one example for blessing deferred - like it was scripture.

Wait! I know why... because "it is scripture" and it does not please their "preference of the moment".

The bible CLEARLY teaches that those who have died in Christ will right at that moment be present with the lord, and they shall return with Jesus and have their physical bodies reunited with them and to get glorified...

SDA errs on the sleeping, as that is JUST a metaphor used by paul to describe that to one saved, death id like falling asleep in outwatd appearances , but not that the soul sleeps!

 

[targus]

So then Paul "meant to say" --- "THOSE who are alive and remain will be caught up together with US/WE who have died and then will have been raised"??

Someone should inform him of that.. at the resurrection.

Bob Ryan, you must forgive me for being so much less intelligent and scripturally knowledgeable than you most obviously are.

Concerning a conference in 1856 Ellen White declared: "I was shown the company present at the conference. Said the angel, 'Some food for worms, some subjects of the seven last plagues, some will be alive and remain upon the earth to be translated at the coming of Jesus.'

So please explain in the most direct way that you are able - citing chapter and verse to support your explanation - how this "prophesy" could possibly be true considering that every single person present at the conference in 1856 is no longer alive and are all now "food for worms"?

 

[targus]

Bob Ryan, you must forgive me for being so much less intelligent and scripturally knowledgeable than you most obviously are.

Concerning a conference in 1856 Ellen White declared: "I was shown the company present at the conference. Said the angel, 'Some food for worms, some subjects of the seven last plagues, some will be alive and remain upon the earth to be translated at the coming of Jesus.'

So please explain in the most direct way that you are able - citing chapter and verse to support your explanation - how this "prophesy" could possibly be true considering that every single person present at the conference in 1856 is no longer alive and are all now "food for worms"?

Bumped to give Bob Ryan another chance to enlighten us.

 

[targus]

Bob Ryan,

Concerning a conference in 1856 Ellen White declared: "I was shown the company present at the conference. Said the angel, 'Some food for worms, some subjects of the seven last plagues, some will be alive and remain upon the earth to be translated at the coming of Jesus.'

So please explain in the most direct way that you are able - citing chapter and verse to support your explanation - how this "prophesy" could possibly be true considering that every single person present at the conference in 1856 is no longer alive and are all now "food for worms"?

Bumped to give Bob Ryan every chance to defend SDA heresy.

 

[BobRyan]

Bumped to give Bob Ryan another chance to enlighten us.

Very kind of you.... here is your "enlightened again" list ... again.

Jonah 3
Now the word of the Lord came to Jonah the second time, saying, 2 “Arise, go to Nineveh, that great city, and preach to it the message that I tell you.” 3 So Jonah arose and went to Nineveh, according to the word of the Lord. Now Nineveh was an exceedingly great city, a three-day journey in extent. 4 And Jonah began to enter the city on the first day’s walk. Then he cried out and said, “Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown!” 5 So the people of Nineveh believed God, proclaimed a fast, and put on sackcloth, from the greatest to the least of them. 6 Then word came to the king of Nineveh; and he arose from his throne and laid aside his robe, covered himself with sackcloth and sat in ashes.



What is it about the details in the prophecy that leads you to conclude that his 40 day prediction did not fail?

Is it Jeremiah 18? A Bible principle of some sort??

-- what Prophecy is immune from the Jeremiah 18 principle for prophecy in your mind??

Are we supposed to turn a blind eye to these key Bible principles on prophecy "for the sake of this thread"???

Until you read your Bible and start testing doctrines "sola scriptura" instead of "sola man-made-tradition ad populum".

1 Cor 15 "We shall not ALL sleep -- but we shall ALL be changed in a moment in the twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet"

Turns out they did ALL asleep from Paul's day onward.


Notice that these texts are so "offensive" to the bible intolerant that they will not respond to them or deal with them "as if we were on a Catholic board".

How is it that sola-scriptura testing and evaluation is so offensive to those posting on this thread?? They avoid Jeremiah 18 like it was scripture.

They avoid Jonah 3 -- like it was scripture.

They avoid the example given in the Exodus -- like it was scripture.

they avoid discussing the principle of these 2 cases ... one for calamity and one example for blessing deferred - like it was scripture.

Wait! I know why... because "it is scripture" and it does not please their "preference of the moment".

In 1Thess 4 "We who are alive AND remain will be caught up together with THEM in the air".

Paul did not live past the first century - neither do any of his contemporary readers.

1Cor 15 "WE shall not all asleep - but we shall all be changed".

 

[targus]

Concerning a conference in 1856 Ellen White declared: "I was shown the company present at the conference. Said the angel, 'Some food for worms, some subjects of the seven last plagues, some will be alive and remain upon the earth to be translated at the coming of Jesus.'

So please explain in the most direct way that you are able - citing chapter and verse to support your explanation - how this "prophesy" could possibly be true considering that every single person present at the conference in 1856 is no longer alive and are all now "food for worms"?

Bumped to give Bob Ryan another chance to actually address the above.

 

[BobRyan]

Bumped to give Bob Ryan another chance to actually address the above.

Very kind of you.... here is your "enlightened again" list ... again.

Because these "Bible details matter" -- even if you find them inconvenient.

They are specific to the Bible doctrine on prophecy and predictions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobRyan
Jonah 3
Now the word of the Lord came to Jonah the second time, saying, 2 “Arise, go to Nineveh, that great city, and preach to it the message that I tell you.” 3 So Jonah arose and went to Nineveh, according to the word of the Lord. Now Nineveh was an exceedingly great city, a three-day journey in extent. 4 And Jonah began to enter the city on the first day’s walk. Then he cried out and said, “Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown!” 5 So the people of Nineveh believed God, proclaimed a fast, and put on sackcloth, from the greatest to the least of them. 6 Then word came to the king of Nineveh; and he arose from his throne and laid aside his robe, covered himself with sackcloth and sat in ashes.



What is it about the details in the prophecy that leads you to conclude that his 40 day prediction did not fail?

Is it Jeremiah 18? A Bible principle of some sort??

-- what Prophecy is immune from the Jeremiah 18 principle for prophecy in your mind??

Are we supposed to turn a blind eye to these key Bible principles on prophecy "for the sake of this thread"???

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobRyan
Until you read your Bible and start testing doctrines "sola scriptura" instead of "sola man-made-tradition ad populum".

1 Cor 15 "We shall not ALL sleep -- but we shall ALL be changed in a moment in the twinkling of an eye at the last trumpet"

Turns out they did ALL asleep from Paul's day onward.


Notice that these texts are so "offensive" to the bible intolerant that they will not respond to them or deal with them "as if we were on a Catholic board".

How is it that sola-scriptura testing and evaluation is so offensive to those posting on this thread?? They avoid Jeremiah 18 like it was scripture.

They avoid Jonah 3 -- like it was scripture.

They avoid the example given in the Exodus -- like it was scripture.

they avoid discussing the principle of these 2 cases ... one for calamity and one example for blessing deferred - like it was scripture.

Wait! I know why... because "it is scripture" and it does not please their "preference of the moment".

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobRyan
In 1Thess 4 "We who are alive AND remain will be caught up together with THEM in the air".

Paul did not live past the first century - neither do any of his contemporary readers.

1Cor 15 "WE shall not all asleep - but we shall all be changed".

 

[targus]

Bob Ryan, you left out an important part of Johan 3...

"When God saw by their actions how they turned from their evil way, he repented of the evil that he had threatened to do to them, he did not carry it out."

From this we can see that Jonah's prophecy of "Forty days more and Nineveh shall be destroyed." was conditional.

It was conditional on whether the people repented or not.

We know that it was a conditional prophesy and not a failed prophesy because it is part of Scripture.

Now please explain how you know that Ellen White's prophesy was conditional and not simply FAILED.

How have you tested this prophesy to know that Ellen White is not a FALSE PROPHET?

 

[targus]

Bob Ryan, the Apostle Paul was writing to the entire church for all time. He was not writing simply for those who happened to be living at the time. So his words are true because they still apply today.

Those particular writings of Paul are TEACHING not prophesy. Or do you not believe that some believers will still be alive when Christ returns?

The "prophesy" of Ellen White on the other hand was about a specific group of people - namely those attending the conference. She claimed that some of them would still be alive when Jesus returns.

THEY ARE ALL DEAD.

ELLEN WHITE IS A FALSE PROPHET.

The SDA church follows a FALSE PROPHET.

It really is that simple.

 

[Yeshua1]

Bob Ryan, the Apostle Paul was writing to the entire church for all time. He was not writing simply for those who happened to be living at the time. So his words are true because they still apply today.

Those particular writings of Paul are TEACHING not prophesy. Or do you not believe that some believers will still be alive when Christ returns?

The "prophesy" of Ellen White on the other hand was about a specific group of people - namely those attending the conference. She claimed that some of them would still be alive when Jesus returns.

THEY ARE ALL DEAD.

ELLEN WHITE IS A FALSE PROPHET.

The SDA church follows a FALSE PROPHET.

It really is that simple.

SDA teaches another gospel, of good works and right conduct, so that by itself makes them a Cult ...

 

[targus]

SDA teaches another gospel, of good works and right conduct, so that by itself makes them a Cult ...

SDA puts the false prophesies of Ellen White on par with Scripture.

There is so much wrong there it is hard to know where to even start.

 

[Yeshua1]

SDA puts the false prophesies of Ellen White on par with Scripture.

There is so much wrong there it is hard to know where to even start.

The problem with discussing with them is that they refuse to come right out and admit that they are the 'true church", and that those who refuse to keep Sabbath will be getting mark of the beast!