Serious Guidance needed!

[Nicole]

Dave, I have to admit that I am worried about the sincerity of his words when he says that he is saved. I tried to approach that issue in counseling and he just gets very defensive. I get what you're saying about him making an active choice in this matter...that's what is making it so hard to deal with. The fact that right now, these things are more important to him than me or our children is very hard for me to swallow.
I've been up all night...again. I tried to speak to my mother about it but, even though she's a christian, she is just in denial herself. She and dad have worked hard all their life and I think she's always been under the impression that if she had more money, her life would be better. So, her response was basically that she couldn't believe I let him walk out on me. She even said "You need to think of your children! He is a good provider, you can't lose that. You need to find out where he is and call him, i'll call him if you want me to. You know, as women sometimes we have to just swallow our pride and do the right thing. In every marriage there is always going to be one partner who loves the other more" It doesn't matter what I say about him being a provider should include more than just financial provision, and that this has nothing to do with my "pride" I have prayed all night for the Lord to search my heart and reveal to me any area of sin that I'm unaware of or any area of sin that could have possibly provoked my husband to this behavior and it keeps coming back to me that this is between him and his choices...not mine. as far as one loving the other more in every marriage, PLEASE TELL ME THIS IS FALSE!!!!!!! I can't imagine living the rest of my life in a marriage with a man who simply does not love me at all. I mean, if God calls me to it, ok, i don't want to, but I'm sure Jesus didn't WANT to go to the cross, but he did it and I know that he suffered a multitude times what I am right now, but you know, he did make me human and it is hard to comprehend and accept a life like this. I know that he that hath begun a work in me is faithful to complete it but i still feel like i've lost here. i feel like i am in one of those dreams where you keep running but your not getting anywhere. I did learn a big thing a moment ago though....DON'T call mom for that extra push you need to go on!!!

 

[Ars]

You did right but sending him away. And, you are more than right about being a "provider". It is FAR more than just money. Money cannot heal the emotional wounds caused by an uncaring man. For I firmly believe if he cared about you and the Lord, he would never had gone as far as he have. We struggle against our flesh as Christians, that is true. However, through prayer and the power of the Lord, we make it through. We may stumble along our walk with the Lord, but we repent and get ourselves right. When someone continues to live in sin, the Holy Spirit is not in him.

This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.
If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
1 John 1:5-7

Continue in your prayers, fellowship with members of your church. Your church, pastor etc., should be their for you in this time of great trial. If they are not, they should be. I will not speak evil of your husband mind you. He is, like all of us were, a dirty rotten sinner. However, we are washed in the redeeming blood of our Lord and Saviour. Your husband needs to truly realize this. His actions do not show that he does. Is he saved? That, I do not know, but we should be able to tell by his works. And, his works aren't saying a whole lot. Either way, he desperately needs our prayers. As do you!!

Above all else, continue to take comfort in the Lord.

Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.
2 Corinthians 12:10

Psalms 46

Dave

[ October 12, 2001: Message edited by: Dajuid ]

[ October 15, 2001: Message edited by: Dajuid ]

 

[myreflection26]

Pornography is an addiction just like smoking, alcolholism or drug abuse and even though you are not taking a substance into your body, you are opening up a door for the enemy and once you make that choice to open the door, the enemy can and does put a stronghold on you and it is a very serious bondage. Against the will? Perhaps the word "will" does not accurately describe the bondage, because you also have the choice to leave it behind but the problem is once Satan has a stronghold in your life, it's very difficult to let it go and get rid of it so yes Satan does have that power over us...UNTIL...we take authority over Satan in Jesus name, that is our responsibility to do so. If this were not so, then there would not be so many having addictions and being in bondage to them.

Nicole, your husband is simply wrestling with the darkness, like that scripture say "we wrestle not against flesh and blood but against principalities and rulers of darkness". I've been there, I've seen this first hand and frankly I still see it trying to pop its ugly head up, it does become a situation of the husband being out of control. Think about it, what else but Satan would cause a man to choose a fake, unrealistic form of sexual gratification over the real thing in his wife and actually be willing to turn his back on his wife leaving his children behind, and justifying his actions all the while doing so? He is extrememly blinded right now, Nicole, I saw this in my own husband and it almost devistated my family until I began to battle Satan for my husband and my marriage. Ya know what? The first time it happened and we got thru it then the very next season the whole situation replanted itself and this time it not only attacked my self esteeme but it nearly wiped out my marriage and my husband began to threaten to hit me and a few times he used physical force on me as a threat.

Nicole, do you know if folks in your husband's family struggled with pornography? That also makes a big difference.

Anyway, I need to get going here and it will be a few days till I can respond again but I'll talk to ya soon.

Blessings

Sue

 

[Ars]

Sue, I disagree with your view about "strongholds", however, I do not want to take away from Nicole's pain and her need for prayer in her life, so I will start a new thread about so called "strongholds".

 

[Lorelei]

I must Amen Dajuid's advice! My ex-husband was suffered much of the same problem and it did destroy our marriage. He was also a drinker and began to become abusive again.

Whatever you do, don't turn your back on God and the Church like I did. I didn't get angry at God or the Church, I just stopped spending time with either. It only causes more problems in the end. When you do finally get back to serving God (which you always do, God never lets you forget him!) you might find that you ended up handling things "on your own" apart from God's guidance and end up with even more propblems. At least I did. I just urge you to ALWAYS stay in prayer, in God's Word and fellowship with other Christians who can support you!

I continue to keep you in my prayers!

~Lorelei

PS. With all the advice you get, make sure you hold it all up against the Word of God. Him and Him alone can walk you through this pain. In a time of crisis it's easier to be so easily moved with whatever sounds good and makes you feel better. Seek that peace that passes all understanding from staying close to the Lord and following Him and his Words!

 

[Brother Adam]

All I can say is I will be praying Nicole.

"A person cannot know the glory of the highest mountian until they have walked through the deepest valley."

Until Next Post, Adam

 

[Phillip]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Nicole:
as far as one loving the other more in every marriage, PLEASE TELL ME THIS IS FALSE!!!!!!! I can't imagine living the rest of my life in a marriage with a man who simply does not love me at all. I mean, if God calls me to it, ok, i don't want to, but I'm sure Jesus didn't WANT to go to the cross, but he did it and I know that he suffered a multitude times what I am right now, but you know, he did make me human and it is hard to comprehend and accept a life like this. I know that he that hath begun a work in me is faithful to complete it but i still feel like i've lost here. i feel like i am in one of those dreams where you keep running but your not getting anywhere. I did learn a big thing a moment ago though....DON'T call mom for that extra push you need to go on!!!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Nicole,
Please, please, quit trying to find fault within yourself. That is a TYPICAL reaction and also he WILL use that to turn himself into a VICTIM. Watch carefully, you will see that he is still not taking responsibility--he is turning you and your children from the victims to himself----very typical.
I hope my wife's note to you do not offend you the other night. She had been through medical tests all day and was nervous about surgery the next morning and she can be quite blunt about things because of what happened to our children and her. We are praying very hard for you right now. She just got out of the hospital this evening and does not feel like coming to the computer, but I hope you are feeling as well as can be expected. May God be with you!

 

[myreflection26]

Nicole,

I've been thinking about you and praying for you so much. Has anything changed? How are you holding up? Stay strong and keep your ground.

Use this time to cry out to God, believe me, he can do wonders in helping you cope with this. Whatever you do, remember that you are a beauty in God's eyes and he loves you so much, you're a jewel.

God loves you like crazy and he's there with ya Nicole, grab onto him and stay there in his arms.

God Bless you in Jesus name!!!

Sue

 

[Nicole]

Hi Sue. Wish I could say things are better but I can't. He came home, but it is very clear nothing has changed in his mind or in his heart. I haven't been on the computer, actually, I haven't done much of anything but spend time with my boys. He is such a fake...such a complete hypocrite. I hate to think that way of him but I can't help it. Sad thing is, he has people snowed. We met with our Pastor and you know, I had so much hope, i thought WOW he really has had a change of heart. He was saying all the right things, apologizing, seemed so repentant, he seemed so sincere. As we walked out the door and stepped outside he actually laughed and said "hmm...that wasn't so hard" I'm thinking he meant it wasn't hard for him to finally get this out but he went on to say "I told you I won't let you end up making me look bad...no matter what it takes" I'm just disgusted. I told him to just forget it. I refuse to sit there in front of pastor and take up his time counseling us when it's all just an act for my husband...what is the use in that? If he's closed his heart off from his ears he can hear all I want him to hear but he's blocking it from going on any further. I'm just kind of lost as to what to do. Pastor says that it would be wrong to leave him, of course, he bases this on what my husband says and such while he's sitting in front of him, but biblically, I can see where he's coming from but at the same time, I'm losing it. I told our pastor that I just didn't know how much more of this I could take and his response was "good thing Jesus didn't say that" he's right. it's like I told him though....I'm not Jesus. I wish I were more like Him, I WISH this didn't affect me so. I feel like I would be the most selfish person in the world to walk away from my marriage but at the same time, my kids and myself are suffering. My husbands parents were supposed to come for a visit and I told him that it would probably be wise to tell them it's not a good time. So, he mentions to his mom just surface stuff, he did however say that I was upset with him because he likes to look at pornography (he totally minimized things) his moms response was "Tell her to get off it. She shouldn't be making you feel guilty about this, you're a man, good heavens...I wish you didn't have to put up with her" Par for course I guess, I just have to look at the source. He comes from an unsaved family. I feel like I've just lost so much of myself. He brought up being with another woman and ya know, what has bothered me the most is that at the point we were at when he finally admitted it, I couldn't muster up an ounce of feeling one way or the other about it. I couldn't get angry, sad, jealous, hurt...I didn't feel a thing. So often you hear that Hate is the opposite of love...I know from experience that it is not. You have to have intense feeling and emotion to hate....apathy is the opposite of love...you feel nothing. I just don't know what to do about it. I don't want my kids going through this...I don't want them going through a divorce either though. He had the nerve to say to me "You just don't trust me at all" Well.....DUH! anyway, thanks for your prayers and concerns...it means so much.

 

[Kathy]

Nicole,
I don't see how you would be wrong in putting him out of your house for the things he has done (adultery) and the things he continues to do (pornagraphy - which translates into adultery of the heart). Perhaps you shouldn't decide hastily to divorce this man, but perhaps you could separate yourself and your kids from him until he makes his choice, darkness or light. Allow him to make the decision. I hope I haven't overstepped my boundaries here, but I hope you realize that althought we don't "know" you, there are many here on this board who care deeply for you, and I am one of them.

Love,
Your Sister in Christ
Kathy
&lt;&gt;&lt;

 

[Helen]

HI Nicole and all,

Been there, done that. Twenty years of a husband running around and involved with perversions and it was him who left me. I, like you, turned a blind eye to so much. We had children, and ANY marriage was better than none! The kids needed a father! Of SOME kind....

Besides, every marriage had problems, didn't it?

And still, when he took off for good with another woman, leaving us all behind, I cried myself to sleep for a year. I also had heard the 'fat' thing. "I married a model and got a matron!" "You cow!" "If you would just lose some weight, maybe I would like you better." And stuff like: "You just don't make me happy" (you have no idea how many years I really did think I was responsible for his happiness!)

Here are some things I learned after it was all over:

1. Our kids were afraid of him. He was not physically abusive, but they could never please him, no matter how hard any of them tried, and his anger was terrifying to them.

2. About two years after he left my oldest son said to me (he was about 19 at the time), through tears, "Mom, I'll never miss him, but I've always missed a dad."

3. Children see daddy as a sort of representative of God, even if daddy is totally pagan. After all, we are taught to say "Our Father...." When the father is not a man of God, the children can have a very hard time getting past wrong concepts of God later.

4. It was totally by the grace of God that I did not contract any diseases from his sexual escapades.

5. I had gotten used to my chains. I would cry in pain to God for help and relief, but then be as perfect a wife as I knew how to be to my husband and part of me had accepted things the way they were. This is typical of both physically and emotionally abused women.

6. I truly had been betrayed and emotionally battered. I understood about the betrayal part, but the emotional damage was not something I recognized (although my friends did) for a long time. It is over ten years since he left now, and last year I married a most wonderful Christian man -- and you know I still cringe at the thought of his disapproval over anything? I had no idea I was so scared! He has been incredibly patient and loving and encouraging and, gradually, I'm returning to something like normalcy in a marriage!


Moral? Get him out of the house for your children's sake and for yours. As fast as you can, now. To allow this marriage to take this form is to deny the sacredness of marriage and its holiness. It is allowing him to trample on something instituted by God and which also is supposed to be the picture of Christ and His church.


Get away and get your children away from this before it is too late. My third son ended up getting involved in pornography himself at twelve years old. A year later he did some acting out with a neighborhood girl and was arrested and put on work detail, house confinement (ankle bracelet, electronic monitering) and probation. When he was sixteen, just two weeks before his probation was due to be up, he didn't just break probation, he smashed it into a million pieces. I was the one who had to call the police to have him arrested. I have only seen him a few times since, although he is nineteen now. He was put in a juvenile facility and graduated from high school there. He is in college now, and doing very well, but the bond he and I had was broken. I still miss him so much, although we are friendly on the phone and someday he might return emotionally.

Pornography is contagious.

Please, Nicole, stop the damage to yourself and your children. My heart is aching for you. I know what you are dealing with and the pain of feeling not good enough. DO NOT attempt to 'act out' his fantasies! Be a godly woman. Your children need that example and you need that picture in your head of the person you want to be in the Lord, not the person he would like you to be in the gutter.

You may never go through anything more painful than now. Yes, you have been kicked in the gut. Yes, it feels like a half a heart amputation without anesthetic. Yes, it is right to feel stunned, shocked, in pain, angry, and even to occasionally lash out (choose something cheaper than good juice, anyway!) -- what has happened to you and your marriage is a total betrayal of trust and faith on an ongoing, knowing basis. He has destroyed the marriage vows and trampled on you as a person. Remember forgiveness is not an emotion, actually. It is not seeking revenge yourself and simply handing it to the Lord. But that does not stop the pain. And that does not require you to trust him again -- you can forgive a thief who breaks and enters and steals your goods, but are you going to hand him the key to your house after? You see?

Give this man to the Lord to deal with and either get him out of the house or yourself and your children out. Don't allow him to continue his damage.

It will take time to heal. Maybe lots of time. But, in the Lord, you will heal. You will survive this. And you will also learn more about the faithfulness of God.

Nicole, no one who has not gone through this can understand what it has done to you inside. Don't expect them to understand. They really can't. Some can imagine the horror, but it is only bits of pictures they can grasp, like us looking back at the Nazi Holocaust. But actually going through this is a whole 'nother story.

God is faithful. Your husband may not be, but God is. I guarantee that one. That is experience, too....smile.

God bless you.

Helen
tuppence@ns.net

 

[Phillip]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Helen:
HI Nicole and all,
God is faithful. Your husband may not be, but God is. I guarantee that one. That is experience, too....smile.

God bless you.

Helen
tuppence@ns.net<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Helen,
You surprise me more and more. At first I was fussing with you over everything and I have come to respect your beliefs more and more as time goes on. Thank you for backing Nicole on this issues. This is extremely hard on her--I know, my wife went through the same thing and I have raised three abused children (daughters) and have a taste of what this stuff can do to people. My wife feels the same way you do and I really appreciate your honest, yet heartfelt message to help Nicole take the first steps to get her and her children away from the pain. Nicole is a very, very sweet person and deserves much better. I am sure you have read the posts but she has been through more than most people will in ten life-times (figure of speech--no I ain't no reincarnation dude, hehe)
But, I just wanted to say thank you for your thoughtful letter and your backing of what is right and what is wrong for Nicole. She needs people like you right now and the support. My wife is trying to help, but she is just one person. Please, lift her (Nicole) up in prayer, too, that she may make the right decisions and that the Comforter will truly provide ease to her pain and protect her and her children during these trying times. She must understand there truly is a light at the end of the tunnel.

Thank you so much!

 

[Danette]

I too have experienced marital betrayal. I spent 14 years on the inside of an abusive marriage. And I'm a believer, as is my husband. We were both preacher's kids and we met at Bible College. This is not just a problem for the lost and recently saved. Our issue was not pornography, it was violence.

It is a hard, hard thing and not something that can even begin to be addressed in this forum. I have walked in that place and have had to learn the answers the hard way because, unfortunately, many times the church doesn't have good answers, only cliches.

You mentioned all the other things you have also experienced. I can identify with that too. I have experienced sexual molestation, extreme spiritual abuse, miscarriage, infertility, clinical depression, marital abuse, the threat of the loss of my children to the state, and more. I wrote an article recently called God's Chamber Pot (When Life's Unfair) about some of my feelings about this. You can find it at www.titus2women.com. My articles are in the Guest Speakers section under Danette Tucker. My bio is in the uploading pipeline and has more info. We're also working on a section for abuse survivors and will add a section for women in troubled marriages. I have a LOT to say on this subject because I have walked there and I've found God as a friend beyond compare in the dark places. While I wouldn't want to go back and repeat any of it, I wouldn't trade the relationship with God that I have gained through the process.

I have come out the other side after a lot of years and can say with confidence that God has answers, hope, and comforting arms to wrap around you.

The very most important thing of all is to go to God for answers, and don't base your actions on either license or legalism. Those who say that if you're godly enough God will change your husband and that separation is an absolute sin aren't looking at the whole of Scripture. At the same time, just because we can doesn't mean that's what God wants in a particular situation. If there is physical danger it becomes an obvious choice. I believe that when there is on-going adultery this may also be a necessary and non-optional choice because of the potential of life-threatening STDs. You have to know for sure what God wants YOU to do. And He will make that absolutely clear to you.

I know several people have expressed the desire to encourage you through private e-mail. I add myself to the list. At the same time, I'm pretty sure you don't want to talk to a bunch of people -- it just gets to be too much to talk about again and again. I will pray for you and am available if you want to talk.

-- Danette

 

[Sue Pollock]

Nicole,

I understand that you are hurt, very bad. But, you have to move slowly and wait for the guidance of the Holy Spirit. I know!!! My daughter-in-law moved upon the guidance of her pastor (not my husband at the time) and left her husband. The marriage is at the point of death right now and it looks hopeless. But remember, if the Lord can soften a heart to the point of surrender and salvation, He can soften a heart to the point of surrender and give victory over this horrible sin. My prayers are with you and I trust you will make the right move for your life. You could be your husband's saving grace, so to speak if you are living the type of Chrisian life in front of him so the convicting power of the Holy Spirt can work.

Sue

 

[Kathy]

Haven't heard from you in a few days Nicole so I hope you are doing ok. You are in my prayers!

Kathy
&lt;&gt;&lt;