Seven Year Tribulation Question

[saturneptune]

This is a serious question, not a debate starter. I read a view from one person I had never heard before and was wondering if any of you all heard it. It really does not have to do with the timing of the Rapture, (maybe indirectly), but has anyone ever heard of a case made that the seven seals, seven trumpets, and seven bowls in Revelation could not possibley happen within a seven year period, placing the tribulation at another time?

 

[Grasshopper]

Where do you get the seven years from?

On a related note: http://americanvision.org/7197/exegetical-gerrymandering-and-the-time-texts-of-scripture/

 

[InTheLight]

This is a serious question, not a debate starter. I read a view from one person I had never heard before and was wondering if any of you all heard it. It really does not have to do with the timing of the Rapture, (maybe indirectly), but has anyone ever heard of a case made that the seven seals, seven trumpets, and seven bowls in Revelation could not possibley happen within a seven year period, placing the tribulation at another time?

I've never heard that theory. I presume the seven seals were opened rapidly, one after the other because it says in Rev. 8:1 that after the seventh seal was opened it was silent in Heaven for a half hour.

 

[saturneptune]

Where do you get the seven years from?

On a related note: http://americanvision.org/7197/exegetical-gerrymandering-and-the-time-texts-of-scripture/

In most end time theories, the seven years equals the time span of the tribulation and Great Tribulation together. It comes from Daniel 9:27, or the 70th week. The purpose of the thread is to see if anyone had ever heard that the judgements in Revelation could take longer than the seven year period.

This is just ideas and information to me. We need another thread to debate whether or not there is a Rapture, or if there is, when it occurs.

 

[RLBosley]

The historicist interpretation of Revelation sees the judgements spread out from the Ascension of Christ (Some have it starting in 70AD though) going through to the Second Advent.

That is the point of view I currently hold to. Also I do not believe that the judgments are successive or sequential but in some form concurrent. Of course my theology is still developing and may change as I grow and learn more.

I used to be a dispensationalist who believed firmly in the 7 year trib but really there is nothing in scripture that says there will be a 7 year period called that.

 

[Tom Bryant]

This is a serious question, not a debate starter. I read a view from one person I had never heard before and was wondering if any of you all heard it. It really does not have to do with the timing of the Rapture, (maybe indirectly), but has anyone ever heard of a case made that the seven seals, seven trumpets, and seven bowls in Revelation could not possibley happen within a seven year period, placing the tribulation at another time?

I'm sure it's been made, but I am not sure where. But if God can create the world in 7 days, he can certainly do all the things that are spoken about in Revelation in 7 years.

 

[kyredneck]

Where do you get the seven years from?

On a related note: http://americanvision.org/7197/exegetical-gerrymandering-and-the-time-texts-of-scripture/

Thanks for that excellent article, 'Exegetical gerrymandering and the time texts of Scripture'.

'Gerrymandering', never heard it called that before, but that's exactly what it is.

The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show unto his servants, even the things which must shortly come to pass: and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John;,,,,,,, Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of the prophecy, and keep the things that are written therein: for the time is at hand. Rev 1: 1, 3

I come quickly: hold fast that which thou hast, that no one take thy crown. Rev 3:11

And behold, I come quickly. Blessed is he that keepeth the words of the prophecy of this book.,,,,,,,,,, And he saith unto me, Seal not up the words of the prophecy of this book; for the time is at hand.,,,,,,,, Behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to render to each man according as his work is.,,,,,,,,,,,,,, He who testifieth these things saith, Yea: I come quickly. Amen: come, Lord Jesus. Rev 22:7,10,12,20

 

[kyredneck]

In most end time theories, the seven years equals the time span of the tribulation and Great Tribulation together. It comes from Daniel 9:27, or the 70th week.....

Speaking of Daniel, compare:

26 And the vision of the evenings and mornings which hath been told is true: but shut thou up the vision; for it belongeth to many days to come. Dan 8

4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel; for the words are shut up and sealed till the time of the end. Dan 12

With:

And he saith unto me, Seal not up the words of the prophecy of this book; for the time is at hand. Rev 22:10

 

[webdog]

I've never heard that theory. I presume the seven seals were opened rapidly, one after the other because it says in Rev. 8:1 that after the seventh seal was opened it was silent in Heaven for a half hour.

Amazing what context does to theories :thumbs:

 

[InTheLight]

Amazing what context does to theories :thumbs:

Yes, a plain straight forward reading of scripture usually is the way to go.

I got to thinking about it and I'm wondering why John mentioned a particular time span of one-half hour in Rev. 8:1. It could be the judgments are unsealed and read sequentially and rapidly, and executed quickly or concurrently, or it could be possible that time passing in Heaven is occurring at a different rate than on Earth. That is, the seals could be opened and read in what seems like minutes in Heaven but on Earth it would seem like a month or some other timeframe. (ie. "A day is like a thousand years" idea.) This would mean that things happening in Heaven would seem like real time unfolding to John but on Earth it could be months or years. That might explain the significance of why John felt it necessary to explain that there was a silence of half an hour in Heaven, because on Earth that could be months or years.

Hey, as long as we are speculating...:smilewinkgrin:

 

[percho]

Yes, a plain straight forward reading of scripture usually is the way to go.

I got to thinking about it and I'm wondering why John mentioned a particular time span of one-half hour in Rev. 8:1. It could be the judgments are unsealed and read sequentially and rapidly, and executed quickly or concurrently, or it could be possible that time passing in Heaven is occurring at a different rate than on Earth. That is, the seals could be opened and read in what seems like minutes in Heaven but on Earth it would seem like a month or some other timeframe. (ie. "A day is like a thousand years" idea.) This would mean that things happening in Heaven would seem like real time unfolding to John but on Earth it could be months or years. That might explain the significance of why John felt it necessary to explain that there was a silence of half an hour in Heaven, because on Earth that could be months or years.

Hey, as long as we are speculating...:smilewinkgrin:

Speaking of that, "A day is like a thousand years," why do you all think that is in the word?

Consider, as the lights of the heavens set up the fourth day, was the resurrection of Christ as the firstborn from the dead at the end of four thousand years from, "Let there be light," as him Christ being the light of the new creation of man.

Then as the creation of man set up the sixth day could the recreation of man in the conformed image of God's Son take place in a moment in the twinkling of an eye at the last trump be at the end of six thousand years making the Son the firstborn of many brethren?

 

[kyredneck]

I've never heard that theory. I presume the seven seals were opened rapidly, one after the other because it says in Rev. 8:1 that after the seventh seal was opened it was silent in Heaven for a half hour.

Amazing what context does to theories :thumbs:

Yes, a plain straight forward reading of scripture usually is the way to go....

Lol, I suppose you all believe it's a literal woman clothed with the sun and the moon under her feet being literally chased by a literal red dragon with seven heads and ten horns literally with a literal whore riding his back decked out in purple and scarlet and gold and precious stone and pearls.

The very first sentence of the book:

"The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show unto his servants, even the things which must shortly come to pass: and he sent and signified it..."

What's your criteria or protocol in deciding when to literalize from the book?

Literal days, hours, moments?:

8 Therefore in one day shall her plagues come, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire; for strong is the Lord God who judged her.
10 standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Woe, woe, the great city, Babylon, the strong city! for in one hour is thy judgment come.
19 And they cast dust on their heads, and cried, weeping and mourning, saying, Woe, woe, the great city, wherein all that had their ships in the sea were made rich by reason of her costliness! for in one hour is she made desolate. Rev 18

but these two things shall come to thee in a moment in one day, the loss of children, and widowhood; in their full measure shall they come upon thee, in the multitude of thy sorceries, and the great abundance of thine enchantments. Isa 47:9

Behold, I am against thee, O thou proud one, saith the Lord, Jehovah of hosts; for thy day is come, the time that I will visit thee. Jer 50:31

 

[MB]

I suppose anyone could come up with a new theory . all one has to do is just imagine. The Bible say the trib is 7 years long and even then says it will be cut short. Of course what scripture says couldn't possibly count for some on this board. It really makes me sick to see how much butchering of scripture goes on in the minds of some.
MB

 

[RLBosley]

I suppose anyone could come up with a new theory . all one has to do is just imagine. The Bible say the trib is 7 years long and even then says it will be cut short. Of course what scripture says couldn't possibly count for some on this board. It really makes me sick to see how much butchering of scripture goes on in the minds of some.
MB

Please show me a verse that explicitly says the tribulation period is 7 years.

 

[Tom Bryant]

I suppose anyone could come up with a new theory . all one has to do is just imagine. The Bible say the trib is 7 years long and even then says it will be cut short. Of course what scripture says couldn't possibly count for some on this board. It really makes me sick to see how much butchering of scripture goes on in the minds of some.
MB

You do realize that Bible believers can differ about these issues? I disagree with Kyredneck about his view, but I don't doubt for a moment that he loves Jesus and takes the Bible seriously.

I have a missionary friend who is fond of saying "It's a mighty thin piece of paper that has only 1 side."

 

[MB]

Please show me a verse that explicitly says the tribulation period is 7 years.

From the book of Revelations;
Rev 11:2 And the court which is without the temple leave without, and measure it not; for it hath been given unto the nations: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

The first half 42 months equals three and one half years


Rev 13:5 and there was given to him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and there was given to him authority to continue forty and two months.
the second half.

You can count the months if you like but they add up to eighty four months which equals seven years.
These events in Revelation are with out doubt the tribulation
MB

 

[RLBosley]

From the book of Revelations;
Rev 11:2 And the court which is without the temple leave without, and measure it not; for it hath been given unto the nations: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

The first half 42 months equals three and one half years


Rev 13:5 and there was given to him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and there was given to him authority to continue forty and two months.
the second half.

You can count the months if you like but they add up to eighty four months which equals seven years.
MB

So you don't actually have one verse that says 7 years... you have two verses that each say 3 1/2 years. If those are even literal years to begin with, what's to say that they aren't referring to the same period of 3 1/2 years? Or two different periods separated by decades?

 

[kyredneck]

I suppose anyone could come up with a new theory . all one has to do is just imagine. The Bible say the trib is 7 years long and even then says it will be cut short. Of course what scripture says couldn't possibly count for some on this board. It really makes me sick to see how much butchering of scripture goes on in the minds of some.
MB

What is it that nauseates you? I've made three (prior) posts, all rooted in scripture quoted. I notice you've provided no scripture reference.

Please show me a verse that explicitly says the tribulation period is 7 years.

Ditto.

 

[InTheLight]

What's your criteria or protocol in deciding when to literalize from the book?

OP specifically said he didn't want to get into this sort of stuff. Stick to the topic.

 

[kyredneck]

From the book of Revelations;
Rev 11:2 And the court which is without the temple leave without, and measure it not; for it hath been given unto the nations: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.

The first half 42 months equals three and one half years


Rev 13:5 and there was given to him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and there was given to him authority to continue forty and two months.
the second half.

You can count the months if you like but they add up to eighty four months which equals seven years.
These events in Revelation are with out doubt the tribulation
MB

21 for then shall be great tribulation, such as hath not been from the beginning of the world until now, no, nor ever shall be.
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all these things be accomplished. Mt 24

I believe the actual war the Jews made with the Romans was right at 3 1/2 years in length, from 66 to 70 AD.