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Seventh-day Adventists - not a cult according to Walter Martin's "Kingdom of the Cults"

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BobRyan

BobRyan

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JonShaff said:
Question, must we Keep the OT law in order for God's Grace to be effective in our Salvation?
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Are you asking if the saints 'Keep the Commandments of God and their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12
Or are you asking if saints will be "taking God's name on vain all the way to the kingdom"???
certainly a lost person cannot "earn" his way to heaven by "not taking God's name in vain"

Also, does satan take upon himself our sin?
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Satan takes upon himself his own added guilt for tempting the children of God - Satan has his own guilt for tempting lost souls that have chosen him as their leader - and added guilt for tempting and harrasing God's saints.

got an appointment - will get to the rest later.
 
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BobRyan

BobRyan

Well-Known Member
JonShaff said:
Thirdly, Can we have full assurance right this moment that we are Saved?
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Yes according to Romans 8:13-16

JonShaff said:
Also, can i reject Ellen White as a true prophet of God and still be saved?
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Many non-SDAs are saved according to SDA doctrine on that subject.

Do you believe Baptism in the Water spiritually unites us with Christ?
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Baptism is a symbol of facts that have already taken place
 
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JonShaff

JonShaff

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BobRyan said:
Yes according to Romans 8:13-16



Many non-SDAs are saved according to SDA doctrine on that subject.
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Do you believe Baptism in the Water spiritually unites us with Christ?
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Baptism is a symbol of facts that have already taken place
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In your estimation, When we are living with Christ eternally, do you believe SDA's will attain some greater degree of glory vs. the "non-SDA's"?
 
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Yeshua1

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BobRyan said:
--not my idea for a thread -- but got to "follow the interest" when it comes up.

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Hoekema's argument was totally destroyed by Walter Martin's book "Kingdom of the Cults" where Martin placed the SDA Christian denomination in the appendix giving it a huge amount of space for discussion and totally annihilated Hoekema's shallow arguments addressing Hoekema's book specifically - explicitly.

Martin was no SDA at all - but he knew a bogus argument when he saw it. Martin pointed out that half the time Hoekema was not even using the SDA published statements of belief for his straw-man arguments!! How sad that anyone could be snookered by Hoekema.




So then "reading" is not your strong suit??

As Christianity Today pointed out in 2015 - the SDA denomination is the 5th largest Christian denomination in the world and fastest growing (incidentally it is now over 25 million in attendance each Sabbath world wide.)


Or do you want a thread on "SDA not a Cult according to Walter Martin"??

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Fine... here it is.
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I respected Dr Martin and His work for Jesus, but last time I checked, the source that decided if the Sda is a Cult or not would be the Bible alone, and in that case, it is a Cult!
 
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Yeshua1

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BobRyan said:
True he did - but then you offer to make up something about this or that group being a cult- as if Paul did it?

Please be serious.
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ANY group or person that teaches another and false Gospel, who deny that only scriptures were inspired, who deny cardinal truths of the faith, as the Sda does, qualifies as being a cult!
 
BobRyan

BobRyan

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Yeshua1 said:
ANY group or person that teaches another and false Gospel, who deny that only scriptures were inspired,
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1. false accusations as in the above are cheap and easy to make. I think we all knew that.
2. No Bible text says that only scripture can be inspired or that all prophets write scripture as we already saw with Miriam, Aaron, Agabus, Nathan, Anna in the temple, Philip's 4 daughters and all those in 1 Cor 14 church of Corinth who when they meet "each one has a revelation" -- this has already been pointed out repeatedly.

Details matter.
 
BobRyan

BobRyan

Well-Known Member
Yeshua1 said:
I respected Dr Martin and His work for Jesus !
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And he is now deceased - but in his book "Kingdom of the Cults" he places the Adventist denomination in the appendix because according to him - he did not consider this church to be a cult... and spends about a 100 pages on the topic totally destroying Hoekema's false accusations and shoddy work in the process... naming Hoekema specifically.

details matter.
 
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Yeshua1

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BobRyan said:
1. false accusations as in the above are cheap and easy to make. I think we all knew that.
2. No Bible text says that only scripture can be inspired or that all prophets write scripture as we already saw with Miriam, Aaron, Agabus, Nathan, Anna in the temple, Philip's 4 daughters and all those in 1 Cor 14 church of Corinth who when they meet "each one has a revelation" -- this has already been pointed out repeatedly.

Details matter.
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ALL those that you mentioned were recorded down for us in the Inspired text itself, and there were and have been NO additional inspired books, teachings, sayings etc since time of John unto now!
And someone can have been using the gift of prophecy in Acts, but NOT be operating as an Apostle/prophet, as those were reserved as offices in the Church, not spiritual gifts!
 
JonShaff

JonShaff

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BobRyan said:
No.

A saved person is not 'out of fellowship with the Father' no matter what denomination they are in.
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I'm talking in terms of "relationally" out of fellowship, Like...my relationship is not as close as it could be.
 
Y

Yeshua1

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
BobRyan said:
And he is now deceased - but in his book "Kingdom of the Cults" he places the Adventist denomination in the appendix because according to him - he did not consider this church to be a cult... and spends about a 100 pages on the topic totally destroying Hoekema's false accusations and shoddy work in the process... naming Hoekema specifically.

details matter.
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Problem is that the inspired scriptures themselves place the doctrines of the Sda within bounds of being a Cult!
 
BobRyan

BobRyan

Well-Known Member
1. false accusations as in the above are cheap and easy to make. I think we all knew that.
2. No Bible text says that only scripture can be inspired or that all prophets write scripture as we already saw with Miriam, Aaron, Agabus, Nathan, Anna in the temple, Philip's 4 daughters and all those in 1 Cor 14 church of Corinth who when they meet "each one has a revelation" -- this has already been pointed out repeatedly.

Yeshua1 said:
ALL those that you mentioned were recorded down for us in the Inspired text itself,
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True. And no Bible text exists saying that only the prophets that existed at the time of so-and-so can ever exist in all of time.

making stuff up- is not the same thing as having that as a Bible doctrine.

and there were and have been NO additional inspired books, teachings, sayings etc
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Are you simply trying out your "creative writing skills again"???
 
BobRyan

BobRyan

Well-Known Member
JonShaff said:
I'm talking in terms of "relationally" out of fellowship, Like...my relationship is not as close as it could be.
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"out of fellowship" as in "in fellowship but having some misunderstanding??" -- seems like doublespeak

Were the disciples "out of fellowship with Christ because they did not fully understand how that gentiles were welcomed into the gospel in your mind?" --- if so that is not a way of defining the term that I or any SDA I know of - has ever used it.

You have free will of course and can go down that road if you wish.
 
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