Seventh-day Adventists - not a cult according to Walter Martin's "Kingdom of the Cults"

[BobRyan]

--not my idea for a thread -- but got to "follow the interest" when it comes up.

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Anthony Hoekema said that the SDA is a cult and belongs grouped with JW's, Mormons, and Christian Science. I think he makes a valid argument.

Hoekema's argument was totally destroyed by Walter Martin's book "Kingdom of the Cults" where Martin placed the SDA Christian denomination in the appendix giving it a huge amount of space for discussion and totally annihilated Hoekema's shallow arguments addressing Hoekema's book specifically - explicitly.

Martin was no SDA at all - but he knew a bogus argument when he saw it. Martin pointed out that half the time Hoekema was not even using the SDA published statements of belief for his straw-man arguments!! How sad that anyone could be snookered by Hoekema.

The SDA isn't a Christian denomination, firstly. Some might argue that it's a sect, at best, but I again would agree with Hoekema's assessment of it.
.

So then "reading" is not your strong suit??

As Christianity Today pointed out in 2015 - the SDA denomination is the 5th largest Christian denomination in the world and fastest growing (incidentally it is now over 25 million in attendance each Sabbath world wide.)


Or do you want a thread on "SDA not a Cult according to Walter Martin"??

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Fine... here it is.

 

[Salty]

And North Korea calls itself: "Democratic People's Republic of Korea"

 

[BobRyan]

And North Korea calls itself: "Democratic People's Republic of Korea"

True. Always the stickler on Bible details ... nice.

 

[Salty]

True. Always the stickler on Bible details ... nice.

Sometimes you need to think.....

 

[BobRyan]

Sometimes you need to think.....

And read a Bible text

 

[thatbrian]

--not my idea for a thread -- but got to "follow the interest" when it comes up.

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Hoekema's argument was totally destroyed by Walter Martin's book "Kingdom of the Cults" where Martin placed the SDA Christian denomination in the appendix giving it a huge amount of space for discussion and totally annihilated Hoekema's shallow arguments addressing Hoekema's book specifically - explicitly.

Martin was no SDA at all - but he knew a bogus argument when he saw it. Martin pointed out that half the time Hoekema was not even using the SDA published statements of belief for his straw-man arguments!! How sad that anyone could be snookered by Hoekema.




So then "reading" is not your strong suit??

As Christianity Today pointed out in 2015 - the SDA denomination is the 5th largest Christian denomination in the world and fastest growing (incidentally it is now over 25 million in attendance each Sabbath world wide.)


Or do you want a thread on "SDA not a Cult according to Walter Martin"??

-----

Fine... here it is.

It's a cult according to me.

I could not care less what Walter Martin or CT have to say on the matter. I care what the Apostle Paul has to say on the matter.

 

[BobRyan]

It's a cult according to me.

I could not care less what Walter Martin or CT have to say

well you have free will that is for sure - and so you can make up whatever you wish.

I am ok with that.

 

[thatbrian]

well you have free will that is for sure - and so you can make up whatever you wish.

I am ok with that.

Paul warned, often and severely, about those who preach false gospels. This is not my opinion.

 

[thatbrian]

 

[Salty]

And read a Bible text

That as well- as long as we interrupt correctly

 

[thatbrian]

Twisting and adding or taking away from God's Word is always where Satan works. He did it in the Garden, and he does it still, in false prophets.

Exhibit One. From The Adventist Review, December 23, 1982.
Also appeared in Ministry, February 1983.

AFFIRMATIONS

1. We believe that Scripture is the divinely revealed word of God and is inspired by the Holy Spirit.
2. We believe that the canon of Scripture is composed only of the sixty-six books of the Old and New Testaments.
3. We believe that Scripture is the foundation of faith and the final authority in all matters of doctrine and practice.
4. We believe that Scripture is the Word of God in human language.
5. We believe that Scripture teaches that the gift of prophecy will be manifest in the Christian church after New Testament times.
6. We believe that the ministry and writings of Ellen White were a manifestation of the gift of prophecy.
7. We believe that Ellen White was inspired by the Holy Spirit and that her writings, the product of that inspiration, are applicable and authoritative, especially to Seventh-day Adventists.
8. We believe that the purposes of the Ellen White writings include guidance in understanding the teaching of Scripture and application of these teachings, with prophetic urgency, to the spiritual and moral life.
9. We believe that the acceptance of the prophetic gift of Ellen White is important to the nurture and unity of the Seventh-day Adventist Church.
10. We believe that Ellen White's use of literary sources and assistants finds parallels in some of the writings of the Bible.

DENIALS

1. We do not believe that the quality or degree of inspiration in the writings of Ellen White is different from that of Scripture.
2. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White are an addition to the canon of Sacred Scripture.
3. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White function as the foundation and final authority of Christian faith as does Scripture.
4. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White may be used as the basis of doctrine.
5. We do not believe that the study of the writings of Ellen White may be used to replace the study of Scripture.
6. We do not believe that Scripture can be understood only through the writings of Ellen White.
7. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White exhaust the meaning of Scripture.
8. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White are essential for the proclamation of the truths of Scripture to society at large.
9. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White are the product of mere Christian piety.
10. We do not believe that Ellen White's use of literary sources and assistants negates the inspiration of her writings.

 

[BobRyan]

Paul warned, often and severely, about those who preach false gospels. This is not my opinion.

True he did - but then you offer to make up something about this or that group being a cult- as if Paul did it?

Please be serious.

 

[BobRyan]

Twisting and adding or taking away from God's Word is always where Satan works. He did it in the Garden, and he does it still, in false prophets.

I agree.

But you did not find false doctrine or taking away.. or adding to the Bible here --

Exhibit One. From The Adventist Review, December 23, 1982.
Also appeared in Ministry, February 1983.

AFFIRMATIONS

1. We believe that Scripture is the divinely revealed word of God and is inspired by the Holy Spirit.
2. We believe that the canon of Scripture is composed only of the sixty-six books of the Old and New Testaments.
3. We believe that Scripture is the foundation of faith and the final authority in all matters of doctrine and practice.
4. We believe that Scripture is the Word of God in human language.
5. We believe that Scripture teaches that the gift of prophecy will be manifest in the Christian church after New Testament times.
6. We believe that the ministry and writings of Ellen White were a manifestation of the gift of prophecy.
7. We believe that Ellen White was inspired by the Holy Spirit and that her writings, the product of that inspiration, are applicable and authoritative, especially to Seventh-day Adventists.
8. We believe that the purposes of the Ellen White writings include guidance in understanding the teaching of Scripture and application of these teachings, with prophetic urgency, to the spiritual and moral life.
9. We believe that the acceptance of the prophetic gift of Ellen White is important to the nurture and unity of the Seventh-day Adventist Church.
10. We believe that Ellen White's use of literary sources and assistants finds parallels in some of the writings of the Bible.

DENIALS

1. We do not believe that the quality or degree of inspiration in the writings of Ellen White is different from that of Scripture.
2. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White are an addition to the canon of Sacred Scripture.
3. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White function as the foundation and final authority of Christian faith as does Scripture.
4. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White may be used as the basis of doctrine.
5. We do not believe that the study of the writings of Ellen White may be used to replace the study of Scripture.
6. We do not believe that Scripture can be understood only through the writings of Ellen White.
7. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White exhaust the meaning of Scripture.
8. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White are essential for the proclamation of the truths of Scripture to society at large.
9. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White are the product of mere Christian piety.
10. We do not believe that Ellen White's use of literary sources and assistants negates the inspiration of her writings.

 

[thatbrian]

From the horse's mouth:

Exhibit One. From The Adventist Review, December 23, 1982.
Also appeared in Ministry, February 1983.

AFFIRMATIONS

1. We believe that Scripture is the divinely revealed word of God and is inspired by the Holy Spirit.
2. We believe that the canon of Scripture is composed only of the sixty-six books of the Old and New Testaments.
3. We believe that Scripture is the foundation of faith and the final authority in all matters of doctrine and practice.
4. We believe that Scripture is the Word of God in human language.
5. We believe that Scripture teaches that the gift of prophecy will be manifest in the Christian church after New Testament times.
6. We believe that the ministry and writings of Ellen White were a manifestation of the gift of prophecy.
7. We believe that Ellen White was inspired by the Holy Spirit and that her writings, the product of that inspiration, are applicable and authoritative, especially to Seventh-day Adventists.
8. We believe that the purposes of the Ellen White writings include guidance in understanding the teaching of Scripture and application of these teachings, with prophetic urgency, to the spiritual and moral life.
9. We believe that the acceptance of the prophetic gift of Ellen White is important to the nurture and unity of the Seventh-day Adventist Church.
10. We believe that Ellen White's use of literary sources and assistants finds parallels in some of the writings of the Bible.

DENIALS

1. We do not believe that the quality or degree of inspiration in the writings of Ellen White is different from that of Scripture.
2. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White are an addition to the canon of Sacred Scripture.
3. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White function as the foundation and final authority of Christian faith as does Scripture.
4. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White may be used as the basis of doctrine.
5. We do not believe that the study of the writings of Ellen White may be used to replace the study of Scripture.
6. We do not believe that Scripture can be understood only through the writings of Ellen White.
7. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White exhaust the meaning of Scripture.
8. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White are essential for the proclamation of the truths of Scripture to society at large.
9. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White are the product of mere Christian piety.
10. We do not believe that Ellen White's use of literary sources and assistants negates the inspiration of her writings.

 

[BobRyan]

From the horse mouth:

Exhibit One. From The Adventist Review, December 23, 1982.
Also appeared in Ministry, February 1983.

AFFIRMATIONS

1. We believe that Scripture is the divinely revealed word of God and is inspired by the Holy Spirit.
2. We believe that the canon of Scripture is composed only of the sixty-six books of the Old and New Testaments.
3. We believe that Scripture is the foundation of faith and the final authority in all matters of doctrine and practice.
4. We believe that Scripture is the Word of God in human language.
5. We believe that Scripture teaches that the gift of prophecy will be manifest in the Christian church after New Testament times.
6. We believe that the ministry and writings of Ellen White were a manifestation of the gift of prophecy.
7. We believe that Ellen White was inspired by the Holy Spirit and that her writings, the product of that inspiration, are applicable and authoritative, especially to Seventh-day Adventists.
8. We believe that the purposes of the Ellen White writings include guidance in understanding the teaching of Scripture and application of these teachings, with prophetic urgency, to the spiritual and moral life.
9. We believe that the acceptance of the prophetic gift of Ellen White is important to the nurture and unity of the Seventh-day Adventist Church.
10. We believe that Ellen White's use of literary sources and assistants finds parallels in some of the writings of the Bible.

DENIALS

1. We do not believe that the quality or degree of inspiration in the writings of Ellen White is different from that of Scripture.
2. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White are an addition to the canon of Sacred Scripture.
3. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White function as the foundation and final authority of Christian faith as does Scripture.
4. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White may be used as the basis of doctrine.
5. We do not believe that the study of the writings of Ellen White may be used to replace the study of Scripture.
6. We do not believe that Scripture can be understood only through the writings of Ellen White.
7. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White exhaust the meaning of Scripture.
8. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White are essential for the proclamation of the truths of Scripture to society at large.
9. We do not believe that the writings of Ellen White are the product of mere Christian piety.
10. We do not believe that Ellen White's use of literary sources and assistants negates the inspiration of her writings.

If this thread melts down into you repeatedly quoting that Ministry Magazine article -- and me doing it too it will get boring.

 

[thatbrian]

If this thread melts down into you repeatedly quoting that Ministry Magazine article -- and me doing it too it will get boring.

Light destroys darkness.

The Devil has the same fork in his tongue as does that document, and that makes perfect sense, as he is the original author.

 

[Jerome]

Churches such as these are worshiping at a cult facility?

St. John's Vancouver, Pastor David Short serves with Timothy Keller on The Gospel Coalition council

"For the past five years, we have been meeting in the Oakridge Adventist Church"

Founders Ministries - On Church Planting

"You will need a regular meeting place....This may mean that you use a...Seventh Day Adventist Church to get started."

 

[BobRyan]

Light destroys darkness.

True that is why I like light.

The Devil has the same fork in his tongue as does that document,

factless false accusations -- easy to make.. That is why the devil is called 'the accuser of the brethren" ... I think we all knew that.

 

[BobRyan]

Churches such as these are worshiping at a cult facility?

St. John's Vancouver, Pastor David Short serves with Timothy Keller on The Gospel Coalition council

"For the past five years, we have been meeting in the Oakridge Adventist Church"

Founders Ministries - On Church Planting

"You will need a regular meeting place....This may mean that you use a...Seventh Day Adventist Church to get started."

Maybe they "read" instead of always relying on "making stuff up" to slander other denominations just because they have free will.
So then it makes sense that they would meet in a church that is not using the facility on Sunday

 

[thatbrian]

Following a false prophet is done at the infinite expense of one's soul, and when there so much proof that Ellen G White was a false prophet in her own writings, no man can claim ignorance of such things when he faces the Living God.