Sexcess

[Johnv]

Originally posted by Martin:
Well we differ on that then, don't we? Yes. I see it as more compromise by the "popular" evangelical movement. Less meat, more sweets.

And I see it as you acting so high and mighty that flinging labels like "comprimise" and "worldly" are second nature.

Let's not get too theologically deep, let's stick with life principles.

You haven't even read it, and you're making such broadbrush accusations. Typical of the pharisees.

Nothing wrong with life principles as long as it is grounded in solid Biblical Theology.

And how do you know that this is absent in this edition? Answer: You don't. If it were, you'd deny it anyway.

I have read through that publication and saw the same thing I have seen in other "popular" publications (etc).

YOu said you did not read it, but simply saw it on the website. I'll have to go by my local bookstore and check it out for myself to give an objective view. Your view cannot be considerred objective.

Worse yet, with Revolve, it was couched in a worldly format.

Your condemnation is Revolve is a testament to your lack of objectivity here. In fact, Revolve did exactly what you require of the discussion of "life principles grounded in solid Biblical Theology". The Revolve discusses, for example, the need for girls to fel pretty, and point them to scripture that tells them about pleasing God, not man. There's another article that discusses drug abuse, and again, points directly to scripture that talks about your body being a temple of the Holy Spirit. Another article talks about dating, and points to scripture that talks about purity and the appropriateness of such things being reserved for marriage.

If that is worldy, then let there be more of it.

 

[Rachel]

Your condemnation is Revolve is a testament to your lack of objectivity here. In fact, Revolve did exactly what you require of the discussion of "life principles grounded in solid Biblical Theology". The Revolve discusses, for example, the need for girls to fel pretty, and point them to scripture that tells them about pleasing God, not man. There's another article that discusses drug abuse, and again, points directly to scripture that talks about your body being a temple of the Holy Spirit. Another article talks about dating, and points to scripture that talks about purity and the appropriateness of such things being reserved for marriage.

If that is worldy, then let there be more of it.

So true.

 

[Martin]

Originally posted by Johnv:

And I see it as you acting so high and mighty that flinging labels like "comprimise" and "worldly" are second nature.

==See it as you may.

Originally posted by Johnv:

YOu said you did not read it, but simply saw it on the website. I'll have to go by my local bookstore and check it out for myself to give an objective view. Your view cannot be considerred objective.

==You are confusing my statements. The publication I was refering to having read through was Revolve not this particular publication.

Originally posted by Johnv:

Your condemnation is Revolve is a testament to your lack of objectivity here. In fact, Revolve did exactly what you require of the discussion of "life principles grounded in solid Biblical Theology". The Revolve discusses, for example, the need for girls to fel pretty, and point them to scripture that tells them about pleasing God, not man. There's another article that discusses drug abuse, and again, points directly to scripture that talks about your body being a temple of the Holy Spirit. Another article talks about dating, and points to scripture that talks about purity and the appropriateness of such things being reserved for marriage.

==I don't know how Biblical "feeling pretty" is (see 1Pet 3:1-4, 1Tim 2:9-15) but I will leave that alone. All of what you point out is somewhat true but it misses my point totally. If there is not solid Biblical founding for those things then something major is missing. By the way quoting verses is not enough. Anyone can quote verses. There needs to be a clear, systematic explanation of those verses and how they fit together (on a lay level of course). They talk about dating and purity but their magazine/bible is formated after worldy magazines that contradict everything they are saying. What message does that send? Why are they wanting to format their magazine after those type of publications? It makes no sense. We should not treat the Bible as if it is some sort of gossip magazine. If we are going to discuss serious, life and death issues, such as sex (etc) then that needs to be done Biblically, seriously, and without worldly wrappings. Any good messages the articles in these publications may have is contradicted by their choice of words/phrases like "sexcess" and "45 Tech Savy Ideas" (or whatever it was).


Now it is clear to me that you have made up your mind on this issue. You say that I am lacking "objectivity" on this, and you are right. However you are also lacking objectivity here because you have chosen to purchase and defend these publications. You have not taken seriously any of my concerns. Therefore it is clear that this discussion is fruitless and leading no place. Therefore this will be my last reply to you on this issue.

Martin.

 

[Martin]

Steve Camp discusses this issue on his blog .

 

[Johnv]

Originally posted by Martin:
See it as you may.

I believe I see it witha fair level of objectivity, as evidenced by the fact that I was originally wary of Revolve.

If there is not solid Biblical founding for those things then something major is missing.

It is obviously you who is missing the point here. All of the content in Revolve is bible based, bible centered, and relevant to Christian girls and to scripture.

By the way quoting verses is not enough. Anyone can quote verses. There needs to be a clear, systematic explanation of those verses and how they fit together

That is exactly what is done in the Revolve edition. If you truly nad read it, you would have known that. The fact that you miss this lends credence to your lack of objectivity on the matter.

They talk about dating and purity but their magazine/bible is formated after worldy magazines that contradict everything they are saying.

That is hugely subjective upon preconception.

We should not treat the Bible as if it is some sort of gossip magazine.

Since Revolve does not do this, the point is moot.

If we are going to discuss serious, life and death issues, such as sex (etc) then that needs to be done Biblically, seriously, and without worldly wrappings.

Revolve does this, and does it successfully.

Any good messages the articles in these publications may have is contradicted by their choice of words/phrases like "sexcess" and "45 Tech Savy Ideas" (or whatever it was).

Again, hugely subjective on your part, lacking objectivity.

Now it is clear to me that you have made up your mind on this issue.

No. I am willing to change my position based on objective observation of the subject matter. Prior such observation is contrary to your assertions.

You say that I am lacking "objectivity" on this, and you are right. However you are also lacking objectivity here because you have chosen to purchase and defend these publications.

I purchased the Revolve product after objective scrutiny. I do not "defend" the product. I only state objectively that which is contrary to yoru assertions.

You have not taken seriously any of my concerns.

I have indeed taken your concerns seriously. However, objective scrutiny of the Revolve publication eases those concerns.

Therefore it is clear that this discussion is fruitless and leading no place. Therefore this will be my last reply to you on this issue.

So noted. But I feel the discussion was indeed fruitful. I encourage other individuals to check these products out for themselves.

Originally posted by Martin:
Steve Camp discusses this issue on his blog.

I have a blog on the same site. I guess that makes me as much of an authority as him.

 

[shannonL]

My thought is this: This Biblezine is not marketed to reach the lost simply because 99 out of 100 lost people are not going to walk into a christian bookstore.
For all you folk who contend that we have to engage the culture in a more "contempary" fashion be it music, Bible marketing, how we "do church" etc... Where is the fruit of this type of laboring? As I stated earlier America is a hogpen of immorality, things aren't getting better they are getting worse. The culture needs to be changed by Scripture. We don't need to continue to try and adapt to the culture.
Some of you are missing the point this Biblezine as it is called was only published by TN because they saw a market for it. Friends the market wasn't the "seeker" on the street. It was an already stuffed, filled to overflowing, "american evangelical christian" who needs another BV like they need a hole in the head.
In case some haven't noticed the Christian publishing industry is big business. Some think it is so wonderful that there is a "christian" section now at Barnes & Noble. Well I don't. I think it plays right into the hands of the devil. He likes all this "religous pluralism" which is so prevelant today. Now the christians have thrown their hat into the ring. I know the last time I was in Barnes & Noble I came across Brian McClaren's book "A generous orthodoxy". Boy, I sure hope some "seeker" doesn't pick that book up. He or she would be more lost than before they came in. Just like when people try to bring God down so they can humanize Him the same thing is happening with the christian publishing industry.
and God's Word. Let's just "dumb it down","blend it in with the culture" etc... You get my drift?
"Jesus is to be lifted up" and so is His Word. Not so blended in that we wouldn't know the difference from it and the latest issue of "teen" magazine. Barf!

 

[Gold Dragon]

Originally posted by shannonL:
I know the last time I was in Barnes & Noble I came across Brian McClaren's book "A generous orthodoxy". Boy, I sure hope some "seeker" doesn't pick that book up. He or she would be more lost than before they came in.

"A Generous Orthodoxy" does deal with topics that are inappropriate for a seeker, largely because many of the concepts deal with relatively advanced theologies that the average seeker isn't often interested in. It may be valuable to the churched seeker who left the church because of problems with the way some Christians handled theology.

I do think McLaren's "A New Kind of Christian" might be appropriate to seekers sick of the infighting and condemnation of the stereotyped fundamentalist Christian but are attracted to Christ. Still not a great book for seekers. I is written more towards evangelicals who have been in the church for a while.

I highly recommend both books.

 

[jw]

We certainly wouldn't want a more carnal, immature, or worldly Christian to pick up a Bible and read it because he was attracted to it in some way.

Maybe we should market a Bible with 3 point font, sharp razors on the edge that cut you, and a built in randomized electric shock while you read it. Man, you'd have to be godly to carry that bad boy around.

 

[4His_glory]

Originally posted by TexasSky:
The problem is, God's word shouldn't be used for things such as, "How to be successful with the opposite sex." It should be used for things such as, "How to live a Christ centered life."

Amen Texas- that sums the whole thing up sufficiently.

I will add, that Christians often today look to the Bible in order to find a verse to "get them through the day", instead of reading and seaching the Scriptures to see the glorious King of Kings and worship Him. Nothing will assist the Christian more in facing the trials of life than haveing a God centered view of all things.

 

[jw]

Hold the press. I found a compromise

http://www.sacredsandwich.com/advertisement5.htm

 

[rlvaughn]

After reading this thread, I googled for more information on "Biblezines" and found the following article:
Ten Things You Should Know About the New Girls' Biblezine

It's not on the Align "Biblezine" of Martin's OP, but is about the Revolve "Biblezine" that Martin and johnv discussed quite a bit.

Here's a few bites that might give you a taste for reading the article:

In less than eight weeks, 40 thousand copies of the glossy New Testament have disappeared from bookstores. That's the number of copies that an average Thomas Nelson Bible sells in a year!

But what if the tips for dating are to young girls like bread to the hungry who came to see Jesus because of his ability to feed them?

"We really wanted to show girls that guys aren't completely obsessed with external beauty ...." Wait a minute! What then are all these cute girl models—some of them braless, some baring their midriffs, some pouting their lips, a few striking provocative poses, a few in bikinis, all with seemingly spotless complexion, only one of them with braces, 98 percent of them skinny—doing in the photos adorning Revolve?

On page 186, the girls can find "Top Ten Great Christian Books." C. S. Lewis and Dorothy Sayers haven't made the list...all of the top ten books have been recently published by Thomas Nelson, most of them through Transit Books. [TN's teen division, publisher of Revolve, rlv]