Shooting on a plane in Miami

Wow! bizarre stuff going on here...we know for sure Alpizar was a believer and we do not know if the Air Marshall was a believer at all...and yet we get these bizarre posts...as in "great shooting" totally bizarre...all I am saying is
look at the additional information Curtis and grieve for your brother.


I agree with on poster the compassion is lacking
much...very much for a Christian Missionary spreading the good news of Jesus Christ. </font>[/QUOTE]'Good neighbour' shot dead in terror's glare

Airport tragedy: passengers leave the American Airlines plane in Miami after air marshals shot dead Rigoberto Alpizar.
Photo: AP

THEY called him Rigo, speaking in whispers and shock outside a home illuminated by television lights and sudden national attention.

To neighbours in Maitland, Florida, he was a jogger, an immigrant, a loving husband. He was the man who always waved hello.

And to the frightened woman talking through a mail slot in a red door, Rigo was her "darling son-in-law". She slid out his photograph, showing a smiling Rigoberto Alpizar against a star-filled background.

US air marshals shot and killed Mr Alpizar, 44, a US citizen, at Miami airport yesterday after suspecting him of having a bomb in his backpack. He had run frantically from an American Airlines Orlando-bound plane boarding for take-off. No explosives were found in the bag or on him.

In the hours after Mr Alpizar's name flashed across television and computer screens, friends, neighbours and family members struggled to understand how someone so nice could be the same man authorities feared had a bomb.

"I can tell you he was very proud to be living in America," said brother-in-law Bradley Jentsch in Sheboygan, Wisconsin. "He was very, very proud to become an American citizen and to vote."

Alpizar moved to the US about 20 years ago after growing up in Costa Rica. He and Anne Buechner, his wife of more than 18 years, regularly jogged and cycled together through their Maitland neighbourhood.

"He always said hi," said Alex McLeod, 16. "He was always nice."

As word of Mr Alpizar's death spread, news crews filled the street in front of the house.

Soon after Thanksgiving, Mr Alpizar and his wife left on a trip sponsored by their church to work with children in Colombia, said longtime neighbour Louis Gunther.

The couple first met in Costa Rica when Ms Buechner, a social worker, was working in Central America. They regularly returned in recent years to his childhood home after the death of his mother to spend time with his ageing father.

Link

 

IS THIS GUY A LIAR??



Eyewitness: "I Never Heard the Word 'Bomb'"
A passenger on Flight 924 gives his account of the shooting and says Rigoberto Alpizar never claimed to have a bomb
By SIOBHAN MORRISSEY/MIAMI

Posted Thursday, Dec. 08, 2005
At least one passenger aboard American Airlines Flight 924 maintains the federal air marshals were a little too quick on the draw when they shot and killed Rigoberto Alpizar as he frantically attempted to run off the airplane shortly before take-off.

"I don't think they needed to use deadly force with the guy," says John McAlhany, a 44-year-old construction worker from Sebastian, Fla. "He was getting off the plane." McAlhany also maintains that Alpizar never mentioned having a bomb.

"I never heard the word 'bomb' on the plane," McAlhany told TIME in a telephone interview. "I never heard the word bomb until the FBI asked me did you hear the word bomb. That is ridiculous." Even the authorities didn't come out and say bomb, McAlhany says. "They asked, 'Did you hear anything about the b-word?'" he says. "That's what they called it."

When the incident began McAlhany was in seat 24C, in the middle of the plane. "[Alpizar] was in the back," McAlhany says, "a few seats from the back bathroom. He sat down." Then, McAlhany says, "I heard an argument with his wife. He was saying 'I have to get off the plane.' She said, 'Calm down.'"

Alpizar took off running down the aisle, with his wife close behind him. "She was running behind him saying, 'He's sick. He's sick. He's ill. He's got a disorder," McAlhany recalls. "I don't know if she said bipolar disorder [as one witness has alleged]. She was trying to explain to the marshals that he was ill. He just wanted to get off the plane."


McAlhany described Alpizar as carrying a big backpack and wearing a fanny pack in front. He says it would have been impossible for Alpizar to lie flat on the floor of the plane, as marshals ordered him to do, with the fanny pack on. "You can't get on the ground with a fanny pack," he says. "You have to move it to the side."

By the time Alpizar made it to the front of the airplane, the crew had ordered the rest of the passengers to get down between the seats. "I didn't see him get shot," he says. "They kept telling me to get down. I heard about five shots."

McAlhany says he tried to see what was happening just in case he needed to take evasive action. "I wanted to make sure if anything was coming toward me and they were killing passengers I would have a chance to break somebody's neck," he says. "I was looking through the seats because I wanted to see what was coming.

"I was on the phone with my brother. Somebody came down the aisle and put a shotgun to the back of my head and said put your hands on the seat in front of you. I got my cell phone karate chopped out of my hand. Then I realized it was an official."

In the ensuing events, many of the passengers began crying in fear, he recalls. "They were pointing the guns directly at us instead of pointing them to the ground," he says "One little girl was crying. There was a lady crying all the way to the hotel."

McAlhany said he saw Alpizar before the flight and is absolutely stunned by what unfolded on the airplane. He says he saw Alpizar eating a sandwich in the boarding area before getting on the plane. He looked normal at that time, McAlhany says. He thinks the whole thing was a mistake: "I don't believe he should be dead right now."

 

No. Not likely. "Not hearing" is not the same as "didn't happen". On a plane of 50 to 70 people, and depending on the nature of incident, a lot of people will not have heard anything, or not have witnesses the whole thing.

Please, this incident is barely a day old, and to pick one person and ride them like a bronco is hardly going to result in accuracy. Over the next several days, more and mroe eyewitness accounts will be gathered, plus forensic evidence, and we'll be able to get a more accurate picture.

I do guarantee one thing. A year from now, this same story is going to be used by some conspiracy nut somewhere to say that it was a "coverup" ro hide the fact that George Bush was behind the death of Pat Morita, or some such nonsense.

 

On Gillis Court, where steady rains came down Thursday, friends and neighbors recalled a man who was by all accounts gentle and friendly.

After Hurricane Charlie toppled trees and power lines in Central Florida, Alpizar offered to run an electrical line from his generator across the street to Janice Tweedie's house so the retired registered nurse could have electricity. He offered to help clean up the limbs and branches.

That's the kind of neighbor the people on Gillis Court are remembering.

''I cried when I heard it on TV,'' Tweedie, 68, said.

''He and his wife are just as friendly as puppies,'' Tweedie said. ``I felt like if something ever happened to me, I could call on him to help me.''

``This is a real loss to our community, our neighborhood, Tweedie said. This is a fine man.''

Down the street, Jeff McLeod said Alpizar, who worked at a Home Depot store, and his wife, a social worker, attended the occasional neighborhood potluck dinners and were always friendly.

Neighbors said they would see the two of them leaving for bicycle jaunts. He was an avid runner and a very healthy guy, former co-workers said.

''He seemed like an upbeat guy all the time,'' who was always willing to give a neighbor a hand, said McLeod, 43, a consumer finance company sales representative.

Directly across the street from Alpizar's house, Louis Gunthers, who has lived in the neighborhood 30 years, said he spoke to Alpizar at least a couple of times a week.

Alpizar was to have started helping Gunthers paint his house this month, he said as a cold rain fell outside.

''He was always smiling, always happy,'' Gunthers said.

''The man would do anything for you. If you needed help doing anything, he was there,'' Gunthers said.

In the seven or eight years Charles Baez worked with Alpizar at a paint store on busy U.S. 17-92 in Winter Park, Alpizar never missed a day of work. He almost always brought his own lunch.

''He was a very, very quiet reserved gentleman, really good guy, a model employee,'' Baez said.

''In the face of adversity he was very calm,'' Baez said. ``That's why I don't understand the whole situation down there.''

''It is quite unbelievable that it happened,'' Baez said.

 

I just nominated him for a Darwin Award.

 

Who's playing that game? Who has blamed the shooter?

It's very difficult to make someone take medicine, if they are at all paranoid.

That's wrong - mentally ill is not the same as stupid. I don't quite see the humor in this situation.

 

Sorry, Daisy, just a reaction to the deification of this guy. I shouldn't have put that up, but what was done needed to be done. Missionary or not.

 

I have no choice but to acknowlege that Bro Curtis's post probably wasn't his best shining moment, but I truly understand the frustration behind it. This guy is being martyred beyond reason. I don't dispute his worthy activities in his life, but unfortunately, likely due to serious illness, he put himself in a situaion that would cause harm to himself, and that's exactly what happenned. The air marshall cannot be blamed for this.

 

"She told me about an officer who was very traumatized by a shooting. He was never the same after that."----------------------------------------------------------------------

He probably did not have the right personality for the job, or there was something questionable about the shooting.

But for a cut and dry shooting, there is no reason to expect an officer to be traumatized.

Man makes bomb theat, man ignores officers and runs, man reaches into bag as if to detonate a bomb in the middle of fueling planes and fuel trucks, officer shoots man. That is cut and dry. He will be shook up a little, the adreneline will flow for 24 hours or so, he will feel bad for the man, but not about the job he did. Most likely he understand that it could be not other way, all of his peers will have affirmed it. He will move on with no problems. If not, he needs to move on to another job for his own sake and for those who depend on him to be able to do it again without hesitation.

 

I think that this guy did move on after awhile. But I agree, he probably wasn't cut out for the job.

Faithgirl

 

It's traditional to eulogize the dead.

Sadly, yes.

Has his name even been mentioned? I'm sure he'll have the support of all who know him and the majority of those who know of him.

 

I agree Daisy, and the poor wife also. The whole thing is just so sad. Stay on meds.

 

I definately stand by my first post, it is a very unfortunate incident. But I feel safer knowing there are people trained to stop this. It is very hard to fire a weapon, under stress, and show the kind of control in aiming these two had. Perfect shooting. Nobody who didn't need to be hit, was hit.

And the question, since we all know travel can be stressful for anyone, let alone someone who required medication, where were his meds ?

Still looking for some credible history on this guy.

 

Moving this to the Politics Forum.

 

MIAMI Dec 8, 2005 — The passenger shot to death by air marshals in Miami had been agitated before boarding the plane and was singing "Go Down Moses" as his wife tried to calm him, a fellow passenger said Thursday.

"The wife was telling him, 'Calm down. Let other people get on the plane. It will be all right,'" said Alan Tirpak.

"I thought maybe he's afraid of flying," Tirpak said


In honor of this Christian man who loved his neighbors and obeyed the gospel.

You are now released from the shackles of this
sinful world and healed immediately into the presence of God the Father.


Go Down Moses

 

Aslandspal and others. I think every one is sypathetic to the man. Mostly we have concentrated on weather or not the officer was jsutified. That has really been the discusion. We never lacke sympathy for the man. Weather or not he was a Christian is beside the point. I have sympathy for his family and him regardless.

 

This brother who died an innocent
death because of a number of events that added up
to a tragedy...any other day he would be alive
one pill or the wife not turning back or even
no air marshals that day means he is alive to
be loved by his wife,neighbors,co-workers, and church and it sure looks as if he returned the love.

In a tragedy it always a series of events an if just one is tweaked or changed then you live to see another day...and it is still early the story
is still unfolding and that was my salient point
with people quick to de humanize the guy and make
him sound like target practice we still do not know the whole story yet...but I am convinced he
was a Christian. imho

Bunyon said:
"We never lacke sympathy for the man"

Oh really could have fooled me the sympathy and compassion in previous posts was so thick ..I must have missed it.

Bunyon said:I think every one is sypathetic to the man.

You think! read some of previous bizarre posts and as additional information comes to light we learn this was a very serious Christian.

and one more thing you also said:Weather or not he was a Christian is beside the point

now that is the bizarreist statement yet...of course it it the most IMPORTANT POINT..SALVATION
TRUMPS ALL ELSE.

Of course on this evangelical board Christians
are a priority Bunyon imho...I stand on the bible
on that one.


and as a Christmas present to you Bunyon

http://toolbar.google.com/?promo=gdl-tb-en

 

"now that is the bizarreist statement yet...of course it it the most IMPORTANT POINT..SALVATION
TRUMPS ALL ELSE."---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

My point is that it is a tradgedy and worthy of our sympathy REGARDLESS of weather he was a Christian or not. I just don't get your point here. Are you saying that you would not be concerned if he were secular??

I don't see lack of sympathy in anyones point, but I do see some folks reacting to your judgemental assumptions about other posters.

Thanks, for the present, I'll open it in one second.

 

I downloded that toolbar, yet I don't see it at the top of my screen. Any hints aslands pal?

 

Never mind Aslanspal. I figured it out, now to test it out. It works, cool, now if we could get a judgement blocker.

[ December 08, 2005, 11:52 PM: Message edited by: Bunyon ]