Shooting on a plane in Miami

Thanks for posting this. I almost replied a few times to the Darwin comment, then kept telling myself to wait, and now I'm glad I listened.

 

Me too Gina, I was getting ready to respond, but decided to read the thread first, I am glad Bro. Curtis apologized for his mean and hurtful statement!

Pre 9/11 he would have been either allowed to exit the plane, or tackled, arrested and taken to a mental hospital. Post 9/11 he could have said anything that the marshal's thought sounded like the word "bomb" so they shot him 5 or 6 times.

Don't let anyone tell you that our nation is not living in fear of the terrorist! There is not a day that goes by that I don't hear of some new way the government is working to pass a new law that was birthed out of fear of terrorism.

 

"so they shot him 5 or 6 times."----------------------------------------------------------------

Law enforcement officers are not trained to shoot once and stop. They are trained to shoot center mass and keep shooting until the threat is neutralized. Until he was flat on his back it is reasonable and in keeping with their training for them to continue to fire. This accident is unfortunate and we all regret it. But it could not have turned out any other way. This level of vigilance is justified in our current state of war, it is not fear, it is prudence.

 

And I do feel bad about my comment, but he wasn't innocent, and the idea of "no air marshalls and he would still be alive" puts real innocents in harm's way.

 

Agreed. The nutjob had no business on a plane, without his meds. he shot himself. </font>[/QUOTE]I haven't been on this board in ages, but happened to see the below quote and it broke my heart.

So sad that a "Christian" would refer to someone mentally ill as a nutjob.

Makes me tremendously sad.

 

Thank you, bunyan, for pointing that out. Your'e correct. Yes, the layperson gets "upset" that a suspect gets shot multiple times. But the layperson typically has no weapons training. Just more armchair quarterbacking.

 

When getting my license, it was pounded into my head that the object is not to kill the person, but to stop the threat. The most effective way to stop the threat is shoot center mass. This usually results in the person being killed, but that's not the object. Cause and effect, and if you go for the leg or something "more humane", you're going to be killed.

 

I have since heard that he was shot in the head, not the center mass. A more difficult target, but if he had had a bomb, shooting him in the head would prevent his detonating it after having been shot - no motor control.

 

If he was shot in the head, then I would almost wager that it was not intentionally so, unless it was at almost point blank range.

 

I never was a police officer.
I was a political activist, well o.k. I was a parttime rioter. We used slingshots instead of guns, but the basic principle applies to both.
If you want to do anything fancy with a missile weapon (as in more complex than aim at his rump and keep shooting untill your gun is empty) you must either be in a position to very calmly take aim, or practice intensively for over an hour on a daily basis.

 

Daisy asks:

Lots of people were making judgments (including me), one said he shot himself, most were exonerating the shooter.

Well, you know what will happen then...

More TSA regulations, a medical database with "no fly" status for those on pyschoactive drugs unless they are accompanied by a professional or family member. The must have immediate access to their medication and they must take them, etc, etc...

HankD

 

I don't know if the passanger was shot in the head. But before I left the PD, I was given training on "double tabing" -tow shots to chest and one to the head. The reason being that the gangs were using bullet proof vest. My guess is that these marshals are tought to double tap rutinely for the reason Daisy stated- to take on the CNS so that they can't detonate a bomb. Imaging, if you were 22,000 ft in the air. You would want to be absolutely sure he was incopacitated.

 

What makes me sad, is that along with the Christians that are abusing the guy, Alqueda would be very much happy with what has happened. Their activities on Sep 11 have resulted in this, and to them each person shot is another westerner gone which no doubt brings them much pleasure.

 

Yea, Ben, but do you see any alternative. They would be much happier with a downed 747 and 500 dead.

 

How would a guy trying to run off a plane lead to a downed 747? He wasn't trying to blow up the plane, he was trying to get off the plane!

 

That would not result in a 747 being downed. The alternative is not having well trained Air Marshals. If you have them, then a man is going to get shot if he tell the flight attendant that he has a bomb and then reaches into his bag. If we have no air marshals, than it will be a lot easier for air terrorist to down planes.