Should our churches fellowship with repentant criminals?

[canadyjd]

Recent threads about s*xual abuse in the SBC noted a report that stated 35 former pastors/leaders/volunteers that had been convicted of these crimes were serving in some way in Baptist churches after jail/conviction.

My question is this. Would you allow someone with this type of history join your church if they demonstrate repentance for their crimes?

Are their any crimes that would result in permanent disfellowship no matter how repentant the person appeared to be?

 

[Scarlett O.]

To be honest, it depends on the intensity of the crime, for me.

To me, he or she could be a member of an adult same-sex Bible class, but never around children, even if truly repentant. These type of temptations don't always go away as easily as people want to think they do.

 

[canadyjd]

To be honest, it depends on the intensity of the crime, for me.

To me, he or she could be a member of an adult same-sex Bible class, but never around children, even if truly repentant. These type of temptations don't always go away as easily as people want to think they do.

Certainly true of p*dophiles. However, the crimes reported were not just against children.

For example, there were 3 men in a church near here (about 15 years ago) that abused a mentally disabled adult woman who was unable to consent to anything.

One pleaded guilty and spent a year or so in jail. After he got out, he came to a church where my mother was a member. He was with his wife and children and eventually sought membership.

There was opposition and they went elswhere.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

In the cases cited above, we must be guided by Scripture.
The operative passage that comes to my mind is 1 Timothy 3:2 & 7.

From verse 2

A bishop then must be blameless ... of good behaviour​

From verse 7

Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without​

Verse 8 applies the same criteria to deacons.
My take away is those who are found guilty of such behavior should not be allowed in positions of leadership.
That being said, we must keep in mind the passages in the Corinthian Epistles. There we see in 2 Corinthians 2:4-8

4 For out of much affliction and anguish of heart I wrote unto you with many tears; not that ye should be grieved, but that ye might know the love which I have more abundantly unto you.
5 But if any have caused grief, he hath not grieved me, but in part: that I may not overcharge you all.
6 Sufficient to such a man is this punishment, which was inflicted of many.
7 So that contrariwise ye ought rather to forgive him, and comfort him, lest perhaps such a one should be swallowed up with overmuch sorrow.
8 Wherefore I beseech you that ye would confirm your love toward him.​

After the church in Corinth took action after Paul wrote 1 Cor 5:1-3 to them.

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[canadyjd]

In the cases cited above, we must be guided by Scripture.
The operative passage that comes to my mind is 1 Timothy 3:2 & 7.

From verse 2

A bishop then must be blameless ... of good behaviour​

From verse 7

Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without​

Verse 8 applies the same criteria to deacons.
My take away is those who are found guilty of such behavior should not be allowed in positions of leadership.
That being said, we must keep in mind the passages in the Corinthian Epistles. There we see in 2 Corinthians 2:4-8

4 For out of much affliction and anguish of heart I wrote unto you with many tears; not that ye should be grieved, but that ye might know the love which I have more abundantly unto you.
5 But if any have caused grief, he hath not grieved me, but in part: that I may not overcharge you all.
6 Sufficient to such a man is this punishment, which was inflicted of many.
7 So that contrariwise ye ought rather to forgive him, and comfort him, lest perhaps such a one should be swallowed up with overmuch sorrow.
8 Wherefore I beseech you that ye would confirm your love toward him.​

After the church in Corinth took action after Paul wrote 1 Cor 5:1-3 to them.

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Thank you for the scripture. Do you think there is any crime that would forever bar fellowship?

 

[Squire Robertsson]

Thank you for the scripture. Do you think there is any crime that would forever bar fellowship?

How do you square a forever bar to fellowship with 1 Corinthians 6:9-11

9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.​

So, I don't see a permanent bar to fellowship\membership. I do see a permanent bar to formal leadership.

 

[Reformed]

So, I don't see a permanent bar to fellowship\membership. I do see a permanent bar to formal leadership.

We are also to employ wisdom. While a repentant sinner should be welcomed back into the fold, restrictions on certain service is a wise thing to do.

 

[Reynolds]

Recent threads about s*xual abuse in the SBC noted a report that stated 35 former pastors/leaders/volunteers that had been convicted of these crimes were serving in some way in Baptist churches after jail/conviction.

My question is this. Would you allow someone with this type of history join your church if they demonstrate repentance for their crimes?

Are their any crimes that would result in permanent disfellowship no matter how repentant the person appeared to be?

Any people in your Church who have not sinned?

 

[Reynolds]

We are also to employ wisdom. While a repentant sinner should be welcomed back into the fold, restrictions on certain service is a wise thing to do.

Many times that restriction is required by law.

 

[canadyjd]

Any people in your Church who have not sinned?

Of course not.

 

[Reynolds]

Of course not.

So, everyone in your Church broke the entire law.

 

[canadyjd]

So, everyone in your Church broke the entire law.

Easier, imho, to just make your point directly.

 

[exscentric]

Really hard to know. Yes, they are forgiven, yes, we all sin - however a pastor we knew molested his teenage daughter, was forgiven, restored, took a church, molested a teenager, repented, was forgiven/restored and yep, third time - I'm sure three young girls/families feel restoration is not right.

On the other hand I correspond with a man that has been inside for 22 years, earned a BA and an MA, seems to be completely reformed/forgiven, yet I have warned him I do not know how churches will feel about having him around. His reply was rather indignant - I've served my time! I am forgiven for what I did! Everyone sins/makes mistakes! And he definitely has a point.

Where does our God given common sense/logic draw the line. Needs to be with lots of prayer, getting to know and an individual basis in my mind.

 

[Yeshua1]

Recent threads about s*xual abuse in the SBC noted a report that stated 35 former pastors/leaders/volunteers that had been convicted of these crimes were serving in some way in Baptist churches after jail/conviction.

My question is this. Would you allow someone with this type of history join your church if they demonstrate repentance for their crimes?

Are their any crimes that would result in permanent disfellowship no matter how repentant the person appeared to be?

Could become members, but any back ground check failure means no working in any church ministry....

 

[canadyjd]

Could become members, but any back ground check failure means no working in any church ministry....

Agreed. How many churches, especially small churches do the background check?

 

[Rob_BW]

It's a difficult topic, for sure. I hate to think we have such resources for prison ministry but shun them when they get released.

 

[carpro]

Recent threads about s*xual abuse in the SBC noted a report that stated 35 former pastors/leaders/volunteers that had been convicted of these crimes were serving in some way in Baptist churches after jail/conviction.

My question is this. Would you allow someone with this type of history join your church if they demonstrate repentance for their crimes?

Yes. A church is for sinners. When we stop believing that, it's all over but the crying.

But we don't have to be stupid.

knowing pedophilia is incurable, their contact with children would have to be zero.

 

[Scarlett O.]

="Rob_BW, post: 2481641, member: 12336"]It's a difficult topic, for sure. I hate to think we have such resources for prison ministry but shun them when they get released.

I was involved with a prison ministry some years ago. The team made sure the men on their last six months of their sentences had a church to go to on Sundays. They lived in a half-way house. About 4 -5 of those men came to my church and were in my mixed adult Sunday School class. We also held services at the half-way house.

None of those men were pedophiles. If they had been, they would not have been allowed to sit near children and possibly only allowed to come to Sunday School - depending on the child population.

I'm telling you that God forgives and people should forgive...…..I am also telling you that those desires NEVER change. I've worked with too many sexually abused children and known too many pedophiles.

If a team brought a soon-to-be-released pedophile to my church and he sat close to children, that would be a huge problem for me. If something like that happens, it should be planned ahead of time which adult male or female [depending on whether the pedophile is a man or woman] that he or she would sit by and it would be very far away from children.

This isn't about forgiving someone, it's about taking preventative measures to ensure the CHURCH is not enabling a pedophile.

 

[JonC]

A previous church I was a member of (since a teenager) had this come up. A person who had been reached by the prison ministry wanted to join the church when he had been released. He had been saved while in prison. The man was upfront with his past and had an outstanding testimony. BUT he was also forbidden to be around children and schools. There was two issues: first was the issue of the law (was he legally able to attend when they held classes for children in the same building). But the more important issue was one, perhaps, of trust and judgment. Do you take the man's profession as is knowing that you may be putting children at risk if you are wrong?

I can't remember how this ended up (I may have left the church prior to this being resolved). But there are issues more than simply accepting that God forgave the man.

 

[Yeshua1]

Agreed. How many churches, especially small churches do the background check?

All churches should do them for any ministerial staff support member!