Should the snipers be executed?

I voted no. I knew one of the victims, and lived about 3 miles from the Virginia Home Depot before moving back to the hills.

Lock'em up and throw away the key.

I have had three close relatives (two aunts and a first cousin) who were murdered, and have wrestled with the capital punishment issue. I came to the conclusion that I couldn't pull the switch, and I can't ask my government to do what I couldn't do.

Jeff,

 

Here are some of the results of NOT having capital punishment:

1. The rest of the population pays, financially, for the permanent upkeep, including guards and medical of the murderer.

2. The rest of the population has learned that God's commands can be ignored if we are not 'comfortable' with them.

3. The rest of the prison inmates, some of whom are there for theft only, are put in further danger.

4. There is no sense of closure for the families.

It is amazing, really, that as we have become a people who buys our meat at sanitary meat counters, we do not come in contact with the necessity of actually killing the animals whose muscles we are eating. We have become a people who have one of two views of death:

-- far off, distant, not-to-be-thought-about

-- or entertainment (via sports hunting, video games, television shows and movies, etc.)

In a fallen world, death is a necessity. First of all, it will happen to all of us (possible rapture excluded). Secondly, we ARE made in the image of God, and that image is to be treated as something to be treasured and cared for (not meaning preoccupation with physical beauty). God Himself cares about that image, or He would not have commanded the death penalty for murder.

That murderer is going to die. We are all going to die.

If murder is proved in a court of law, why should we disobey God and, in addition, saddle ourselves with the permanent burden of taking care of the murderers?

It doesn't make theological sense.
It doesn't make social sense.
It doesn't make financial sense.

Are we so brainwashed by humanism that we can so easily argue that God didn't know what He was talking about? There is a part of me inside that would be very curious to know how many of those against the death penalty are also those encouraging violence by attending movies glorifying violence, playing videogames encouraging violence, watching TV shows making light of violence.

Just a thought...

 

In such a situation our sentencing is different in Scotland. I dont want to get involved, as a foreigner, as to what you do in this situation as there are good reasons why you will feel very sensitive in US. However, I would plead that you allow the court to decide if they are guilty first before coming to the sentence.
yours, Jon.

 

GUNS HAVE ONE USE TO KILL

 

iN THIS CASE MAYBE ITS YES KILL THE ??????
ITS OK TO USE THE GUN

 

GUNS HAVE ONE USE TO KILL

And what use would that be?

 

Romans 13:4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain; for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.

 

Ooops! Forgot to logout.

[ October 28, 2002, 03:44 AM: Message edited by: FearNot ]

 

quote:
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Originally posted by Matticus:
I'm actually disturbed at how eager you are to have these guys killed, and in manners that are not at all pleasant. Suggesting manners in which to kill them is sick and twisted, it has no place in the house of God.

God Bless

Matt
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Ah,

One minor thing, we are not in the "house of God" we are posting messages on an Internet message board. This is not a church, so let's not try and act like it is, or the next thing you know someone will be asking everyone to take communion on the court of 3 and type, "Even so come quickly Lord."

More to the point of this thread, the death penalty is biblical. The Bible teaches that God has given the state the authority to carry out such punishment. Granted, I am commanded, individually, not to murder by one of the Ten Commandments. Note that it says murder not kill. There is a big difference between the two. The Hebrew word is ratsach (Strong's #7523) pronounced raw-tsakh'. "To dash to pieces, i.e. kill (a human being), especially to murder: - slayer {16x}, murderer {14x}, kill {5x}, murder {3x}, slain {3x}, manslayer {2x}, killing {1x}..." Ratsach means "to kill, murder, slay." According to my Strong's Exhaustive Concordance, "The Decalogue [the Ten Commandments] gives the general principle in a simple statement, which contains the first occurrence of the verb: 'Thou shalt not kill [murder] sic. (Ex 20:13)'." Likewise, the NKJV translates the word as "murder," as does the NIV.

Furthermore, the Wycliffe Bible Dictionary defines murder as follows:

1. A person who murders another must die because he has destroyed God's "image" in another man (Gen 9:6). Human government has the right to exact the death penalty (Num 35:33; Jn 19:10f.; Rom 13:1-4).

2. Premeditated murder must be distinguished from the unintentional slaying of a man. This distinction involves three criteria of investigation: (a) a prior state of enmity (Num 35:20f.; Deut 19:11-130; (b) a search for the intended victim (num 35:20; Deut 19:11); (c) the use of a murderous instrument (Num 35:16-18). The murderer must have no provided refuge (Lev 24:17; Ex 21:12, 14), but the manslayer who kills another man unintentionally must flee to one of the cities of refuge provided for him (Ex 21:13; Num 35:9-15; Deut 19:1-13; Josh 20:1-9)."

There are six more numbered points in the Wycliffe Bible Dictionary. Each further supports the views expressed in the two quoted points above and/or explains why killing during war is not considered murder. Nowhere does this Bible Dictionary even hint that the death penalty in unbiblical.

For those who do not feel that they could be responsible for the execution of a murderer you do not have to worry about it. God has taken that responsibility out of your hands and placed it squarely in the hands of the state government. In states that have and enforce the death penalty it is of no concern to you whether or not you feel that you could ask the state to execute a murderer because the people of that state and its legislature have already made the provision for you. If that bothers you then you should: (1) Work to change the existing laws. (2)Move to a state or nation that does not have the death penalty on its law books. (3) Take up the issue the God and the Bible.

[ October 28, 2002, 03:47 AM: Message edited by: BibleboyII ]

 

Helen and others.

Lets assume for a moment that the 17 year old boy in question is witnessed to by a Christian. Recieves Jesus Christ as his Saviour gets baptized and genuinley repents for what he has done. The court rules in favour of the death penalty. Would you personally throw the switch to murder him?

 

Hello Ben,

First, as I have shown in my post just above your most recent post according to the Bible it is not murder to enforce the death penalty on a convicted murderer. If your scenario were to occur that would be great. The young man, let's stop calling him a boy because he is not a boy, would be saved and live eternally with Christ. However, his earthly sin still carries consequences and he must bear the weight and responsibility for them. Can you show me from the Bible where God forgives the sin of murder as well as promises to remove the consequences for that sin in a person's life? I don't believe you can. Therefore, I would be willing to "throw the switch." This debate cannot, must not, be focused on our feelings. The question is what does the Word of God say? We must pass our feelings through the sieve of the Word of God; rather than, passing the Word of God through the sieve of our feelings.

[ October 28, 2002, 05:21 AM: Message edited by: BibleboyII ]

 

Yes! Yes! I found the switch! (click!!!) "for whatsoever a man sows that shall he also reap!"

The two fella--their beedy eyes peepin' through that rifle scope--watchin' as some innocent woman is puttin' her grocery sacks in the car--or that bus driver just startin' his day-probably on that first step "yawing and stretchin"--saying to himself--"My, My! This is going to be a long day!" The little fella going to school--probably releaved that all of his home work was "up to snuff" Pumpin' gas at a service station--"Buck forty-two a gallon!!" My soul and body! The bullet that killed that man--costed less than a gallon of gas!!

And some of you fellas are havin' trouble finding the switch!! Suppose we threw you guys out in that wild domain--and let the same Mohammad fella peep at you with his "good" eye trough that scope--with his index finger on the blinkin' trigger--suppose you could prove beyond the shadow of a doubt that YOU were going to be his next victom--or your little boy, or that lovely wife of yours--if you knew that--you'd be beggin' the governor to show you the switch! Suppose we ship the two "no good for nothin's" over to where you live over on the other side of the "Big Pond" and let you guys handle the situation in your own civilized way??!! And lets just suppose that one day "OH, My! There's been a jail break and now the two no good for nothin's are "at large"! I don't get it!!

Your friend,
Blackbird

 

Warm Christian greetings!

I can understand those who say that the snipers should face the death penalty if convicted; but I have grave reservations about the type of language used on this thread. To ask if they should "fry" is, quite frankly, unacceptable, and those who used this term should be ashamed of themselves.

There is a vast difference between justice and revenge. If these people who have been caught receive the death penalty then so be it, but please, let's have some decorum and dignity about it.

Kind regards

Robert J Hutton

 

I praise God that they were caught. Yes, by all means, they should be presented the love of Christ, given a proper trial and then they should be executed by the proper authorities.

 

Brother Hutton,
Greetings from this side of the "Big Pond!"

The word "fry" is a figure of speech--used mainly by Cajuns and Rednecks and people in general who are as "ticked off" as they can be when some frazzlin' nut case takes off with a .223! And we want justice to be served--and at the very end of justice is a nice neat little switch--that turns the electric juice on!

Your friend,
Blackbird

 

Um, yeah, that would be good. And you know, we have to find out how brainwashed that young man was, by Mohammed, the older man. Also, for many, and I know of the punishment to come, but for many, sitting in prison is far worse punishment than a painless gurney death of induced sedaments and poisons. With at least the older one, death would probably be a fitting punishment, for the younger one, we will have to see, but for say a sicko psycopathic child molester/killer, I believe they would be in a first hell if you will, by having to daily ignore their deviant impulses. Jan

 

Oh, and remember David Berkowitz. I was living in NJ while that was going on, many wanted to kill him themselves! And, if he had been put to death, he would not have been saved. And he now, knowing he will never get out, so no need for a jailhouse ruse, helps many others to try to realize God. Not too shabby. I really believe, God will have the authorities and juries mete out the perfect punishment for them both. Let's just pray about that. Jan

 

I guess fry is actually a little strong

Maybe we should let them walk around the prison yard, and have a sniper pick them off sometime within the next year or so! Maybe sooner so my taxes don't have to pay for them to continue existing.

Give them a chance to repent, and than do the deed!

 

Originally posted by Ben W:
Helen and others.

Lets assume for a moment that the 17 year old boy in question is witnessed to by a Christian. Recieves Jesus Christ as his Saviour gets baptized and genuinley repents for what he has done. The court rules in favour of the death penalty. Would you personally throw the switch to murder him?

No, Ben, not a seventeen year old. I have become quite impressed by God's decision to allow all those under twenty into the Promised Land while those over twenty were to die in the desert for their rebellion and never enter.

Considering that God seems to use that age of twenty as a divider between having a fresh start and having rebellion/sin taken seriously, I would not participate (if it were somehow my duty or job) in the execution of anyone younger.

However if the same situation occurred with a 21 year old, yes, in obedience to God and probably with some painful tears, I would do it.