Since you have been a Baptist, have you . . .

[Craigbythesea]

Originally posted by standingfirminChrist:
Let me ask all y'all a question. What if it were not a catholic church? What if it were a church that practiced bloodletting and denounced God? If it were a family member of yours who insisted before death that he or she did not want a christian funeral and wanted their funeral to be held at their blasphemous church? Would you go?

Of course, any Christian man would. But, of course, a man that is not a Christian may be so wicked and self righteous that he would not care enough to go.

Christians don’t go to funerals because they love the religion of the deceased—they go to funerals because they love the deceased and their families and friends, and most importantly because they love Jesus and are led by the Holy Spirit.

When a spirit causes a man to be wicked and self righteous, that spirit is most definitely not the Holy Spirit.

 

[Craigbythesea]

Originally posted by standingfirminChrist:
When Jesus forbad the one that asked Him leave to go to his own father's funeral, why did Jesus not say, Go ahead? Why did He use the words 'let the dead bury their dead. Follow me?'

Matt. 8:21. Another of the disciples said to Him, "Lord, permit me first to go and bury my father."
22. But Jesus *said to him, "Follow Me, and allow the dead to bury their own dead."

Luke 9:59. And He said to another, "Follow Me." But he said, "Lord, permit me first to go and bury my father."
60. But He said to him, "Allow the dead to bury their own dead; but as for you, go and proclaim everywhere the kingdom of God."

These passages have been interpreted in many different ways. For a summary of the interpretations that scholars have proposed, see the following:

K. G. Klemm, “Das Wort von der Selbstbestattung der Toten: Beobachtungen zur Auslegungsgeschichte von Mt. viii. 22 Par.,” NTS 16 (1969-1970) 60-75.

 

[Ron Arndt]

Losing a loved one, no matter what their religious persuasion is heart wrenching for all family members involved. Anyone who refuses to attend a direct relatives funeral for denominational reasons should be ashamed of themselves. This is the time we SHOW our love and respect for the remaining family members and especially at the loss of the deceased. It is a time of weeping and great sorrow and remembrance.

To this day, I still miss Mother, who loved me more than one could imagine. I can still see her standing on the front porch of our old home waving goodbye to me as I would leave the house. Oh, if I could only hug her once more and tell her how much I miss her and love her.Someday, someday, beyond the sunset I will.

 

[Debby in Philly]

Then I guess some of you would call me a heretic. For a while I belonged to a band (guitars,flute,vocals,and my hand drum) connected with a pro-life organization near me. All of the other band members were Catholic. In fact, most of the organization members were too. If you wanted to be involved as a prolifer in my area, that was the deal. We played and sang mostly general praise and prayer songs that the Catholics knew. Most of it was rather nice - scripture based. We also played some songs that I provided - "Baptist songs" they called them. We played at protests, usually outside of abortion mills. We also played at masses specially held to pray for the cause, and the mothers who were decieved. I remember the rehersals we had fondly. We all shared a deep commitment to Christ, and often debated, in love, many things. I feel I served the purpose of showing them that Protestants were people too, who loved Jesus, not some sort of monsters with three heads as they may have fantasized as children. We had a special bond. They were sad at the masses when I could not take communion, and held my hand when the Lord's Prayer was recited, knowing we had that in common.
So call me a heretic. I treasure that time with those brothers and sisters.

 

[4His_glory]

Originally posted by standingfirminChrist:
When Jesus forbad the one that asked Him leave to go to his own father's funeral, why did Jesus not say, Go ahead? Why did He use the words 'let the dead bury their dead. Follow me?'

You do err not understanding the Scriptures. This man's father was not dead yet, but what he was telling Christ was that he wanted to go home to his father and take care of him before following Christ.

Christs response revealed that the man was not willing to trust Christ at that time.

 

[4His_glory]

I am appaled by some of the responses on this board. How can a Christian be so heartless and cold? If I had this attitude towards Catholics as a chruch planter in Argentina, I would offend many and have no ministry whatsoever.

I am sorry that brothers in Christ stand behind "conviction of the Holy Spirit" to mask the numbness of their hearts.

Again I would like to see Scritpure that actually forbids me from going to family members of friends funeral. Just saying Jesus didn't doesn't cut it since Jesus did a lot of things that aren't recorded. He went to a wedding- a Jewish wedding that no doubt was attended by mostly unregenerate people, why would we assume that he wouldn't go to a funeral?

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

I am appaled by some of the responses on this board. How can a Christian be so heartless and cold? If I had this attitude towards Catholics as a chruch planter in Argentina, I would offend many and have no ministry whatsoever.

Boy, ain't that the truth here in Eire!

 

[Artimaeus]

I have not partaken in any Roman Catholic worship services whether funeral, wedding, or whatever. I have no interest in doing so and would feel extremely uncomfortable doing so. I have friends and relatives who are Roman Catholic and I will sit with them, hold their hand, cry with them at their loss. I will go to their house and they can come to mine. I will go to the funeral home the night before and comfort them as best I can but I will not sit in the audience when a Roman Catholic ceremony is taking place.

2 Jo 1:11 For he that biddeth him God speed is partaker of his evil deeds.

Psa 50:18 When thou sawest a thief, then thou consentedst with him, and hast been partaker with adulterers.

1Ti 5:22 Lay hands suddenly on no man, neither be partaker of other men's sins: keep thyself pure.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

Who is bidding godspeed, consenting with a thief, laying hands on anyone, partaking of sin, or being impure?

 

[Hope of Glory]

Originally posted by Craigbythesea:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by standingfirminChrist:
Let me ask all y'all a question. What if it were not a catholic church? What if it were a church that practiced bloodletting and denounced God? If it were a family member of yours who insisted before death that he or she did not want a christian funeral and wanted their funeral to be held at their blasphemous church? Would you go?

Of course, any Christian man would. But, of course, a man that is not a Christian may be so wicked and self righteous that he would not care enough to go.

</font>[/QUOTE]Why would you yoke yourself to such practices as those that are openly anti-Christ?

Now, although I have not been inside a Catholic church, I have been inside an Episcopal church. I do not participate in the kneeling, standing, bowing to the graven image, and all that malarky, but at least it is a Christian church. I would do the same in a Catholic church, if a close family member had died.

That being said, I do think we put too much emphasis on funerals. A dear friend of mine was able to visit his brother before he died, but could not attend the funeral even to support his mother. (It's not just a simple jaunt across town from up here.) This dear friend just died, and I was unable to attend his funeral for the same reason. However, I was able to support them while alive, and that's much more important.

 

[TaterTot]

My grandmother died a Mormon. I attended her funeral and wept as well with Mormon family members, one of which was my Dad. I even got the chance to pray with my Dad, and he eventually came to know the Lord. If I had been hardened and turned away in a time of need, I dont see how that could have honored the Lord.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

I do not participate in the kneeling, standing, bowing to the graven image, and all that malarky,

I don't think anyone here is advocating that - I know I don't.

 

[tinytim]

Originally posted by standingfirminChrist:
no scripture? We are forbidden to add to the Word of God

Amen, that is good advise for everyone.

Now show me where Christ forbids going to funerals except for "approved" churches.

Please hold to your own doctrine of not adding to the Bible.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Christ's response included 'Let the dead bury their dead'. Why would the man want to bury someone who was still alive? Scripture does not say the father was still alive.

the Greek word for dead is 'nekros'. it means dead.
the Greek word for bury is 'thapto'. it means inter.

Why would a man want to bury his father if he was still alive?

 

[TaterTot]

The context of his statement wasnt what we are discussing. Thats a far stretch.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

The Christian is not dead.

And you hath He quickened who were dead in trespasses and sins. It is quite obvious when Jesus said 'Let the dead bury their dead', He could not have been talking about an actually dead body burying a dead body. He was speaking of a spiritually dead people seeing to the funeral services of a physically dead person who was in life spiritually dead.

A christian attending the funeral of a christian who has passed is different, for that is not the dead burying the dead.

Matthew 8:22 But Jesus said unto him, Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead.

Luke 9:60 Jesus said unto him, Let the dead bury their dead: but go thou and preach the kingdom of God.

 

[4His_glory]

Originally posted by standingfirminChrist:
Christ's response included 'Let the dead bury their dead'. Why would the man want to bury someone who was still alive? Scripture does not say the father was still alive.

the Greek word for dead is 'nekros'. it means dead.
the Greek word for bury is 'thapto'. it means inter.

Why would a man want to bury his father if he was still alive?

You need to do more than just a word study. Look at the common practice of the time, and take a look at good conservative commentaries.

 

[Craigbythesea]

Hope of Glory wrote,

Why would you yoke yourself to such practices as those that are openly anti-Christ?

It is my personal conviction that those individuals who deliberately and willfully make public statements that maliciously and slanderously represent the body of Christ have no hope in glory but will spend eternity in the fires of hell with the rest of the infidels!

Contrary to the blasphemous filth so eagerly circulated by some infidels who falsly call themselves Baptists, the Roman Catholic church holds to and teaches justification by faith in Christ:

Here is the note on Romans 3:21-31 found in the second edition of the New Testament in the New American Bible:

The justice of God is his mercy whereby he declares guilty man innocent and makes him so. He does this, not as a result of the law, but apart form it (v 21); not because of any merit of man, but through forgiveness of his sins 9v 24), in virtue of the redemption wrought in Christ Jesus for all who believe (v 22, 24f). No man can boast of his own holiness, since it is God’s free gift (v 27), both to the Jew who practices circumcision out of faith, and to the Gentile who accepts faith without the Old Testament religious culture symbolized by circumcision (v 29f).

The text of Romans 3:21-31 in that translation of the Bible reads as follows:

21. But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, though testified to by the law and the prophets,
22. the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction;
23. all have sinned and are deprived of the glory of God.
24. They are justified freely by his grace through the redemption in Christ Jesus,
25. whom God set forth as an expiation, through faith, by his blood, to prove his righteousness because of the forgiveness of sins previously committed,
26. through the forbearance of God--to prove his righteousness in the present time, that he might be righteous and justify the one who has faith in Jesus.
27. What occasion is there then for boasting? It is ruled out. On what principle, that of works? No, rather on the principle of faith.
28. For we consider that a person is justified by faith apart from works of the law.
29. Does God belong to Jews alone? Does he not belong to Gentiles, too? Yes, also to Gentiles,
30. for God is one and will justify the circumcised on the basis of faith and the uncircumcised through faith.
31. Are we then annulling the law by this faith? Of course not! On the contrary, we are supporting the law.

 

[Craigbythesea]

Originally posted by standingfirminChrist:
Christ's response included 'Let the dead bury their dead'. Why would the man want to bury someone who was still alive? Scripture does not say the father was still alive.

the Greek word for dead is 'nekros'. it means dead.
the Greek word for bury is 'thapto'. it means inter.

Why would a man want to bury his father if he was still alive?

These passages have been interpreted in many different ways. For a summary of the interpretations that scholars have proposed, see the following:

K. G. Klemm, “Das Wort von der Selbstbestattung der Toten: Beobachtungen zur Auslegungsgeschichte von Mt. viii. 22 Par.,” NTS 16 (1969-1970) 60-75.

Please read these 16 pages and tell us if you still hold to the same uniformed view that you started with.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Christ is not the only redemptor according to the Catholic faith. Mary is also a Redemptrix. She also shares the power to redeem people from sin, thereby removing the faith in Christ alone.

They teach that relatives of dead people can say 'Hail Mary's' to gain favor from God to pray their loved one out of purgatory.