Some Observations on IFBdom

[robt.k.fall]

It's been pointed out on many threads IFBdom is not monolithic. Hopefully, the following illustration will help folks better understand the movement's dynamics.

First, think of Christianity as a universe. As in the real universe, the Christian universe has its black holes. The CU's black holes are made up of apostate and heretical movements and organizations. I'll leave the defining of apostasy and heresy to later in this thread if definitions are needed.

Like the real universe, the CU is divided up into galaxies. The CU's galaxies are roughly, the Lutheran, Reformed\Presbyterian, Anglican\Methodist (Wesleyan)\Holiness (Pentecostal), and Baptist (Bible Church). This post deals with the last.

The Baptist galaxy has more sectors than the others. It's three main sectors are the Continental\German, Anglo-American, and the Slavic (Russian). The label Independent Fundamental Baptist applies to one of the A-A's sub-sectors. Other sub-sectors are (again roughly, as this listing is by no means exhaustive):

• the denominational organizations (the American Baptist convention, the Southern Baptist Convention, the various Black and other ethnic bodies.
• Primitive Baptist
• Old Regular Baptist
• Free Will Baptist

Independent Fundamental Baptist churches are roughly divided North and South depending on which through convention they trace their DNA. In the North, separation from the Northern Baptist Convention was based mainly on doctrinal grounds. There was a sharp contrast between the modernist denomination structure and the Fundamentalist churches (the GARBC, the FBF and others). In the South, separation was based in large part on the perceived support of worldliness by the SBC.

Has there been cross pollination between the two, yes. Though, in the last ten or so years, the two have had less to do with each other. This is due to the rise of KJVOism in the southern strain of IFBdom and the recognition that the cultural standards of East Texas don't transfer easily to the tundra of Northern Minnesota.

I'll expand more on this as needed.

 

[Jerome]

The Fundamental Baptist Fellowship is Northern? Isn't it headquartered in Deep South Taylors, South Carolina?

 

[JesusFan]

It's been pointed out on many threads IFBdom is not monolithic. Hopefully, the following illustration will help folks better understand the movement's dynamics.

First, think of Christianity as a universe. As in the real universe, the Christian universe has its black holes. The CU's black holes are made up of apostate and heretical movements and organizations. I'll leave the defining of apostasy and heresy to later in this thread if definitions are needed.

Like the real universe, the CU is divided up into galaxies. The CU's galaxies are roughly, the Lutheran, Reformed\Presbyterian, Anglican\Methodist (Wesleyan)\Holiness (Pentecostal), and Baptist (Bible Church). This post deals with the last.

The Baptist galaxy has more sectors than the others. It's three main sectors are the Continental\German, Anglo-American, and the Slavic (Russian). The label Independent Fundamental Baptist applies to one of the A-A's sub-sectors. Other sub-sectors are (again roughly, as this listing is by no means exhaustive):

• the denominational organizations (the American Baptist convention, the Southern Baptist Convention, the various Black and other ethnic bodies.
• Primitive Baptist
• Old Regular Baptist
• Free Will Baptist

Independent Fundamental Baptist churches are roughly divided North and South depending on which through convention they trace their DNA. In the North, separation from the Northern Baptist Convention was based mainly on doctrinal grounds. There was a sharp contrast between the modernist denomination structure and the Fundamentalist churches (the GARBC, the FBF and others). In the South, separation was based in large part on the perceived support of worldliness by the SBC.

Has there been cross pollination between the two, yes. Though, in the last ten or so years, the two have had less to do with each other. This is due to the rise of KJVOism in the southern strain of IFBdom and the recognition that the cultural standards of East Texas don't transfer easily to the tundra of Northern Minnesota.

I'll expand more on this as needed.

just curious, where would the North American Baptist Conferences churches fit into Baptist map?

 

[Sapper Woody]

just curious, where would the North American Baptist Conferences churches fit into Baptist map?

Right next to Orian's Belt, across from the Big Dipper.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

As much as the FBF has a "headquarters", yes. It's in Taylors as that's where its current president John Vaughn lives. Over the years, the FBF has grown beyond its original geographic borders. Its basic philosophy of ministry is rooted firmly in the Northern Baptist (pre-convention) movement.

The Fundamental Baptist Fellowship is Northern? Isn't it headquartered in Deep South Taylors, South Carolina?

 

[Jerome]

As much as the FBF has a "headquarters", yes. It's in Taylors

Well that's the address provided on their website—Wade Hampton Blvd. to be exact.



Thanks, I found this explanation of the FBF by Dr. Bob on the FFF:

It started in the old Northern Baptist Convention. . . .In the 1960's and 70's they were the powerful voice of historic. . .fundamentalism. Then they were co-opted by Bob Jones

In the mid-80's they were taken over in influence by BoJo'ers. I walked away when "Baptist" became secondary to "Fighting Fundamentalist". And Rod Bell's bitter hate-speech turned me off (he was the voice of the FBF for many years and I assume out of the ministry because of the exposure of his drinking)

I think this, rather than any real growth, probably explains its shift southward (disgraced ex-FBF head Rod Bell out of Virginia was apparently also in the BJU orbit?)

 

[robt.k.fall]

Actually, Dr. Bell has long been retired from the active ranks of FBF leadership. As for the influence of BJU, it is present. However, in the last year or so, the faculty (especially Larry Oats) of Maranatha Baptist Bible College, Watertown, Wisc. has written a slew of articles in Frontline.

I won't quibble too much about Dr. Bob's estimation on the FBF. With this exception, where else would the Baptist graduates have gone?

The Squire wrote "as much as the FBF has a 'headquarters'" because the FBF doesn't have much of any "headquarters" staff outside the editorial staff of Frontline. The Wade Hampton address is where Dr. Vaughn collects the mail. The organization has active regional groupings in the US, Caribbean, and Pacific Rim.

Well that's the address provided on their website—Wade Hampton Blvd. to be exact.
SNIP
Thanks, I found this explanation of the FBF by Dr. Bob on the FFF:
SNIP
I think this, rather than any real growth, probably explains its shift southward (disgraced ex-FBF head Rod Bell out of Virginia was apparently also in the BJU orbit?)

 

[robt.k.fall]

Regretfully, I am unfamiliar with this group.

just curious, where would the North American Baptist Conferences churches fit into Baptist map?

 

[robt.k.fall]

On my usage of North and South

There was/is one historic differences between Northern Baptist Churches (pre convention) and those in the Southern Baptist Convention. Francis Wayland (a Northern Baptist leader) said it best in 1859

A Baptist church can not be represented.

In reading Hiscox's The New Directory for Baptist Churches, we find he writes that decisions made by councils called by a local church are only advisory. They are not binding unless adopted by the calling church. For over a half a century between the break up of the Triennial Convention and the forming of the Northern Baptist convention, Northern Baptists organized their inter church efforts along functional lines (The American Baptist Missionary Union, The American Baptist Publication Society, The American Baptist Home Missionary society, et al.) These organizations were founded and operated by like minded individuals not by churches. The FBFI continues in this tradition.

FWIW, in looking at a recent Frontline "Church Directory", I see two churches in California and one each in Pennsylvania, Colorado, Arizona, Indiana, Illinois, Maryland, Virginia, and South Carolina.