Some questions for anti-calvinists #3

Jump right in, that is fine with me and I trust with anyone else participating.

To answer your question, I would not fight, nor doubt anyone's testimony.

It is God who knows the heart. To fight anyone's testimony is to assume an ability I do not possess.

Further, this is the point I would make, that we are made accepted in the Beloved, we are made willing in the day of his power and therefore from our simple understanding it would certainly have the appearance that we are 'accepting' the atonement of Christ as efficacious to ourselves. However, there is no possibility that any for whom He died could not be brought to him, through drawing of the Spirit, nor that they will fail to be brought with him or meet him in the air when he returns.

Regardless of the depth of understanding among his people, the truth is that none seek after him until they are made to feel after him.

debtor to Free Grace,
Bro. Dallas

 

Do they previously have faith, absolutely. Faith is dependant upon it's object.
They are transferring faith from themselves to Christ.

 

So, where do you find these ideas in Scripture?

 

It is human nature to be drawn, For example, if there is a loud explosion, everyone who heard it is "drawn" to the event. Whether or not they actually leave the place where they heard the sound to venture to the place of the explosion, they were in fact "drawn", their attention diverted in the direction of. Generally, all species do the same thing.

The difference here is that One was lifted up from the earth. Now two thousand years later, there is probably no one who does not know about it or will not hear about it during his/her lifetime.

That does not mean that all become believers, because there are always scoffers no matter what the event. There are always those who do not grasp the gravity of an event. There are always those who though seeing, do not believe. Test that for yourself, see if it is not true.

The fact that virtually everyone knows the name Jesus, does not mean they have faith in that name! </font>[/QUOTE]Agreed with your last statement.
Agreed with human in being drawn, but being drawn to an explosion is hardly comparable to being drawn to God because of and by his everlasting love for his people.

You are right again, there are many who fail to see the gravity of a situation, why is that? What is inherently different about these than you or I? Were we just more wise than these simpletons who could not through a wise choice, save themselves through their choice to 'accept' the accomplished work of redemption?

What is the difference?

debtor to Free Grace,
Bro. Dallas

 

How can you or I judge that anyone has ever resisted the Grace of God, hindered, done despite, certainly, this is what the teaching of chastisement shows us, but to ultimately resist the potter, the Scripture bears witness to the impossibility of this ever happening.

So, if men/women are able to resist the Grace of God, it is what men call the common Grace of God, and not his ultimate purpose in directing the affairs of the world according to His eternal purpose.

May God Bless,

debtor to Free Grace,
Bro. Dallas

 

So an "unsaved" person will stand before God at the Great White Throne and hear, "Sorry, I didn't choose you. Sorry about your luck. Have fun in the lake of fire?"

That's not the God of the Bible.

 

But Paul says not all men have faith.

Then, Faith is dependant upon it's object, I agree with this.

But, how can sinful creatures transfer faith from 'themselves' to Christ?

I don't understand this statement, maybe you could elaborate a little more so I can understand better.

Do you mean that previously to this 'faith transfer' they possess a faith with its object being themselves?

What happens to cause this transfer of faith from object 1, being themselves to object 2 the atonement of Christ?

debtor to Free Grace,
Bro. Dallas

 

This is your assumption of what I and other Calvinists believe. But I have never said I believe this, nor have I ever seen anyone else try to convince me or anyone else that this is a scriptural teaching.

Certainly all the lost will be judged according to their works. These works will be works of iniquity.

debtor to Free Grace,
Bro. Dallas

 

That would be exactly what I mean! Where does Paul say that all men do not have faith?

What happens to cause the transfer? The Bible teaches that faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the Word of God!

 

Is this question addressed to me?

debtor to Free Grace
Bro. Dallas

 

Not by robotic precontrolled decisions which would mean NOTHING... but by a wooing of the Holy Spirit to the heart of man and a submission of one's free will to accept the blood sacrifice of the perfect Lamb for all the sins, in all the world, of all the people.

Anything less than Free Will acceptance of that sacrifice takes glory from the cross.

 

</font>

• 2 Thess. 3:2</font>
• Faith does come by hearing</font>

So, first, Romans 10.17 would serve to prove that all do not have faith until they have this 'hearing' under discussion.

What is this hearing? How does it come?

Neither is the result of man looking into himself to find the ability, or possibility to make a choice. But the Bible does say it is the result of hearing coming by the word of God, that is 'rhema' the exclamation of God, this falls back upon the work of God being that you believe on him whom he hath sent.

prior to this hearing there is no faith.

debtor to Free Grace
Bro. Dallas

 

Wow, a southern baptist that believes in the blood of Christ. I'm encouraged!

 

I wonder, is there a difference between "the" faith (salvation) and faith (generic)

Whether there is no "faith" before hearing is a not relevant. However, it is a hearing of the Word of God that the Holy Spirit uses to bring conviction into the life of the unsaved. Else, there'd be no use for the foolishness of preaching!

 

If you will look closely at 1 Cor. 1.18 you will see that the preaching of the cross is what saves them 'that' believe.

The carnality of the lost also prevents them from seeing the spiritual truths of the preaching and other things of God.

What separates between them who are "able" to hear, understand and receive these spiritual truths? Either it is something from within themselves, or something acting upon them from without themselves, operating to work out from them that drawing to God through Christ.

Now, read 2 Thess. 2:13 & 14.

God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation, through sanctification (separation) of the Spirit, and (also in addition to sanctification of the Spirit,)
belief of the truth.

Whereunto, he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus.

Then, move on over to Ch. 3.5

debtor to Free Grace,
Bro. Dallas

 

Answer my question:
Great White Throne Judgment...What's God's verdict on the unsaved???
Sorry folks, gates are closed, I didn't choose you!

Like the kid on the playground who's always last to be picked for a team?

 

This is your assumption of what I and other Calvinists believe. But I have never said I believe this, nor have I ever seen anyone else try to convince me or anyone else that this is a scriptural teaching.

Certainly all the lost will be judged according to their works. These works will be works of iniquity.

debtor to Free Grace,
Bro. Dallas </font>[/QUOTE]I did answer your question. Emotionalism does not drive the will of God, though it most usually does operate the will of man.

As I said above, the judgement will be upon the lost according to their works.

debtor to Free Grace,
Bro. Dallas

 

The saved do not stand judgement, John 3:18. Only the unsaved are judged! And immediately cast into the lake of fire.

 

Gotta go, changing classes. See you guys tomorrow if possible.

debtor to Free Grace,
Bro. Dallas

 

A. I think you missed the Point. It is the response of the UNSAVED that is the point of the question. Your note observes that the UNSAVED are there after the millenium to address the question.

B. It is true that the saved do not appear at the post-millennial Great White Throne to be judged along with the unsaved. They have already stood before the judgment seat of Christ to give an account (1Cor 5) and Judgment has already been "passed in favor of the saints" Daniel 7 by the time of the post-millennial great white throne judgment.