Study 2 Thessalonians 2:13

[Brightfame52]

You really do have a strange view of the word of God BF.

Based upon what I read and showed you in Matt 11. God hides spiritual truth from some people. He revealed to babes and bids them come

 

[Brightfame52]

Yes, none seek God when sinning. Yes many seek the narrow door when they are not sinning.

None seek God by nature Rom 3:11

 

[Brightfame52]

Genesis 1:1 does not say in my translation, from the beginning. And Ephesians 1:4 does not say from the beginning. So more diversion, more gibberish, more nonsense from the deceivers.

Genesis 1:1 is the beginning in the bible I read

 

[Martin Marprelate]

First, when continuity is meant, the perfect tense is used.

First, go and learn some Greek.

Second, Luke 13:24 says many seek God and do not find him, such as those seeking God by works rather than faith. Romans 9.

Secondly, I explained Luke 13:24 to you earlier.

So your "undoubtedly" find Him is unbiblical nonsense.

Thirdly, "For everyone who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him you knocks it will be opened" (Luke 11:10). However, the verse is written in the Present Tense which denotes continuity (ring any bells?). If anyone wishes to receive, he must keep on asking etc. Deut 4:29 is helpful.

You seem to be advocating a rewrite of Romans 3:11 creating conflict in scripture to support your man-made doctrine. Not cool

One of us is seeking a re-write of Romans 3:11, but I think you'll find it's you. My Bible says that no one seeks God. Full stop. Meaning that God has to open someone's heart, as He did Lydia's, before he will receive (c.f. also John 6:44).

 

[Van]

First, go and learn some Greek.

Secondly, I explained Luke 13:24 to you earlier.

Thirdly, "For everyone who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him you knocks it will be opened" (Luke 11:10). However, the verse is written in the Present Tense which denotes continuity (ring any bells?). If anyone wishes to receive, he must keep on asking etc. Deut 4:29 is helpful.


One of us is seeking a re-write of Romans 3:11, but I think you'll find it's you. My Bible says that no one seeks God. Full stop. Meaning that God has to open someone's heart, as He did Lydia's, before he will receive (c.f. also John 6:44).

Folks, this poster made a false claim about Greek grammar, then rather admitting error, changes the subject to my qualifications. Thus his character is confirmed.

The present tense indicates an action that is in progress, such as the sun is "rising." It does not indicate the sun will continue to rise past noon.

Here is what the poster claimed, because the verb was in the present tense, people searching would "undoubtedly" find God. This is grammatical nonsense. The people of the verse, Romans 3:11, indicated by the grammar, that there is no one currently seeking or in the process of seeking God. It does not indicate that action will be continued in effect in the foreseeable future. If the idea had been a current action with continuing future effect, i.e. continuing to search, the verb would have been in the perfect tense. The grammar does not support the misinterpretation, no one will ever search.

 

[Van]

I see Luke 11:10 has been trotted out as if the verse supported the idea that none ever seek God, because if they did, all would find Him.

Again, utter biblical nonsense. Who decides if a prayer will be answered? The person persistently knocking, trying to talk with God, or God who decides whether to answer or not? God decides. So everyone God decides is asking, seeking knocking with a heart dependent upon God, will find Him. But those seeking God through their own merit or works, rather than complete dependency upon God will NOT find Him.

 

[Silverhair]

My Greek NT says that the verses are in the Present Tense, which usually signifies continuity:
'As it is written:
"There is no one righteous, not even one;
There is no one who understands;
There is no one who is searching for God.
All have turned aside; together they have become worthless;
There is no one who does what is right;
There is not even one.........."
Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.'

If people were searching for God, they would undoubtedly find Him (Luke 11:9-13).

As you said Martin these verses are in the present tense so we could read them as

"There is no one righteous, ALL THE TIME not even one;
There is no one who understands; ALL THE TIME
There is no one who is searching for God. ALL THE TIME
There is none who does good, ALL THE TIME no, not one.

"The present tense represents a simple statement of fact or reality viewed as occurring in actual time. The action is Progressive (Continuous)" RMAC Robinson's Morphological Analysis Codes

When you understand that no one is righteous, understands, is searching for God, does good ALL THE TIME. Then you will understand that while man can be righteous, can understand, does search for God, and does good none will do it all the time.

When people seek after God they will find Him.
Isa 55:6 Seek the LORD while He may be found, Call upon Him while He is near.

Act 17:26 "And He has made from one blood every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings,
Act 17:27 "so that they should seek the Lord, in the hope that they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us

 

[Brightfame52]

Folks, this poster made a false claim about Greek grammar, then rather admitting error, changes the subject to my qualifications. Thus his character is confirmed.

The present tense indicates an action that is in progress, such as the sun is "rising." It does not indicate the sun will continue to rise past noon.

Here is what the poster claimed, because the verb was in the present tense, people searching would "undoubtedly" find God. This is grammatical nonsense. The people of the verse, Romans 3:11, indicated by the grammar, that there is no one currently seeking or in the process of seeking God. It does not indicate that action will be continued in effect in the foreseeable future. If the idea had been a current action with continuing future effect, i.e. continuing to search, the verb would have been in the perfect tense. The grammar does not support the misinterpretation, no one will ever search.

Rom 3:11 is about no man by nature seeks after nor understand the TRUE GOD, yet pretty much all men naturally seek a god, but just not the True God. Man naturally thinks he seeks the True God, but that doesnt count. The True God as well as the True Christ must first be spiritually revealed. Matt11:27

27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Folks, this poster made a false claim about Greek grammar, then rather admitting error, changes the subject to my qualifications. Thus his character is confirmed.

The present tense indicates an action that is in progress, such as the sun is "rising." It does not indicate the sun will continue to rise past noon.

I'm glad that you appear to have looked up your Beginner's guide to Greek, and discovered that the Present tense does indeed usually indicates continuing action. To add a reductio ad absurdum is less helpful.

Here is what the poster claimed, because the verb was in the present tense, people searching would "undoubtedly" find God. This is grammatical nonsense. The people of the verse, Romans 3:11, indicated by the grammar, that there is no one currently seeking or in the process of seeking God. It does not indicate that action will be continued in effect in the foreseeable future. If the idea had been a current action with continuing future effect, i.e. continuing to search, the verb would have been in the perfect tense. The grammar does not support the misinterpretation, no one will ever search.

'Every word of God is pure; He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him. Do not add to His words, lest He rebuke you, and you be found a liar' Proverbs 30:5-6). I reckon that there is scarcely a single text of Scripture that someone could not confuse by adding a few words to it. 'There is no one who seeks God.' Leave it alone, Van! It says what it says. Do not destroy its meaning by adding 'all the time,' or 'except sometimes.' If the Holy Spirit had wanted to say that, He would have said it.

 

[JesusFan]

I see Luke 11:10 has been trotted out as if the verse supported the idea that none ever seek God, because if they did, all would find Him.

Again, utter biblical nonsense. Who decides if a prayer will be answered? The person persistently knocking, trying to talk with God, or God who decides whether to answer or not? God decides. So everyone God decides is asking, seeking knocking with a heart dependent upon God, will find Him. But those seeking God through their own merit or works, rather than complete dependency upon God will NOT find Him.

The ONLY people that as lost sinners will be doing that would be due to the Holy Spirit working in and thru them to get them saved, not by their own desires and efforts and will

 

[canadyjd]

Folks, this poster made a false claim about Greek grammar, then rather admitting error, changes the subject to my qualifications. Thus his character is confirmed….

Folks,…

1. keep in mind @Van has admitted to having no formal education in biblical languages. All he has is a Greek lexicon and an agenda against the doctrines of grace

2. Keep in mind @Van routinely attacks those who have spent decades studying the biblical languages as not understanding the biblical languages because they disagree with his obvious misunderstandings of the biblical languages.

3. Keep in mind @Van has, on numerous occasions, had biblical languages experts explain to him in detail why his interpretations are not supported by commonly understood rules of grammar first year students learn. Every post exposes his errors. Despite this, he has no shame in maligning those true experts as false teachers holding to heresy

4. By all of these things his character is exposed and confirmed by all to see.

Not the least of which is his proud declaration that he changes the words of scripture to fit his understanding.

That is a sure sign of a false teachers regurgitating heresy

Peace to you

 

[Van]

I'm glad that you appear to have looked up your Beginner's guide to Greek, and discovered that the Present tense does indeed usually indicates continuing action. To add a reductio ad absurdum is less helpful.

'Every word of God is pure; He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him. Do not add to His words, lest He rebuke you, and you be found a liar' Proverbs 30:5-6). I reckon that there is scarcely a single text of Scripture that someone could not confuse by adding a few words to it. 'There is no one who seeks God.' Leave it alone, Van! It says what it says. Do not destroy its meaning by adding 'all the time,' or 'except sometimes.' If the Holy Spirit had wanted to say that, He would have said it.

Still this buffoon tries to hid is ignorance by hurling idiotic insult. He did not know the difference between continuing in the present and continuing in the future. These false claims are the house of cards, Calvinism is built upon.

Many seek the narrow door precludes no one ever seeks God. But this buffoon pretends he is so stupid not to grasp it.

This is all Calvinism has, denial and absurdity.

 

[Van]

The ONLY people that as lost sinners will be doing that would be due to the Holy Spirit working in and thru them to get them saved, not by their own desires and efforts and will

Yet another Calvinist falsehood proclaimed to derail discussion of the truth of the gospel.

 

[Van]

Folks,…

1. keep in mind @Van has admitted to having no formal education in biblical languages. All he has is a Greek lexicon and an agenda against the doctrines of grace

2. Keep in mind @Van routinely attacks those who have spent decades studying the biblical languages as not understanding the biblical languages because they disagree with his obvious misunderstandings of the biblical languages.

3. Keep in mind @Van has, on numerous occasions, had biblical languages experts explain to him in detail why his interpretations are not supported by commonly understood rules of grammar first year students learn. Every post exposes his errors. Despite this, he has no shame in maligning those true experts as false teachers holding to heresy

4. By all of these things his character is exposed and confirmed by all to see.

Not the least of which is his proud declaration that he changes the words of scripture to fit his understanding.

That is a sure sign of a false teachers regurgitating heresy

Peace to you

1) Addressing my qualifications rather than the topic. This marks the poster as a deceiver using fallacious argumentation.

2) Totally made up false claim with no evidence. This again marks the poster as a deceiver using fallacious argumentation.

3) Totally made up false claim with no evidence. I just showed Martin's grammatical claim was bogus.

4) Totally made up false claims with no evidence. This again marks the post er as a deceiver using fallacious argumentation.

5) Calvinism adds words to there interpretation of the text. The denial of this marks the poster as a deceiver using fallacious argumentation.

6) Calvinism is heresy - total spiritual inability is a destructive heresy, unconditional individual election for salvation is a destructive heresy, claiming Christ did not die as a ransom for all is a destructive heresy, and claiming people cannot be prevented from entering the kingdom because of irresistible grace is a destructive heresy.

 

[Salty]

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