I remember him too. He was a mod here.
Why did you join that cultish church with that ruthless pastor?
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Suppose for a Moment, if you will.....
- Thread starter Oldtimer
- Start date
I remember him too. He was a mod here.
Why did you join that cultish church with that ruthless pastor?
Ah,now you have moved from your hypothetical to your perceived reality.
All any of us have is our "perceived reality".
Regardless of my "reality" what is your answer to the question -- What would happen?
Sag 38, you said:
Duh, I would put my old Bibles away and go get God's version. Who wouldn't? What's your point?
In due time .......
There is a part two of this question to come. :flower:
All any of us have is our "perceived reality".
Regardless of my "reality" what is your answer to the question -- What would happen?
Sag 38, you said:
In due time .......
There is a part two of this question to come. :flower:
Does it have the magic words 'KJV" in it?
Does it have the magic words 'KJV" in it?
a. Why would any believer in Christ use the word "magic" in association with any version of God's word? Before doing that again, you might want to take a look at Lev 20:6-8 God's word is Holy, wherever it is found, whether it is printed in the NASB or displayed on the back window of a pickup truck. Neither one of those is "magic" -- neither is from the realm of the occult. So why would you apply such a slur to ANY version of God's word?
b. The question isn't about the KJB. Are you so focused on opposition to this particular version of God's word that you can't "see the forest for the trees" to use an old cliche? My question applies with regards to every Bible on the shelves at Lifeway or can be ordered on line from any source, and/or can be read on line. EVERY existing English language Bible.
What would happen?
a. Why would any believer in Christ use the word "magic" in association with any version of God's word? Before doing that again, you might want to take a look at Lev 20:6-8 God's word is Holy, wherever it is found, whether it is printed in the NASB or displayed on the back window of a pickup truck. Neither one of those is "magic" -- neither is from the realm of the occult. So why would you apply such a slur to ANY version of God's word?
b. The question isn't about the KJB. Are you so focused on opposition to this particular version of God's word that you can't "see the forest for the trees" to use an old cliche? My question applies with regards to every Bible on the shelves at Lifeway or can be ordered on line from any source, and/or can be read on line. EVERY existing English language Bible.
What would happen?
My use of 'magic" was not referring to the KJV itself, but that it would be getting addressed in next point probably!
And speaking with KJVO, not saying you will, but most of thetime its like speaking with charasmatics... They always get around to tongues/baptism in the HG, and KJVO to it being the perfect version!
My use of 'magic" was not referring to the KJV itself, but that it would be getting addressed in next point probably!
And speaking with KJVO, not saying you will, but most of thetime its like speaking with charasmatics... They always get around to tongues/baptism in the HG, and KJVO to it being the perfect version!
One more time.....please!
The question and this thread is NOT about any particular version of the Bible.
Why do you feel the need to keep bringing in the KJB? Just for a moment, stop thinking about questioning that version of God's word. Perhaps choose the Message, NET, NIV, NASB and/or the NWT. Any one of them or all of them. It doesn't matter to me. With what you've chosen in view, under the premise given for this thread, what will happen?
Suppose, just for a moment, that at the hand of God, a Bible version rolled off the presses, in the English language, that no one could question the validity. That He, in His infinate power, in some manner declared it to be an absolute. If you see it, hear it, touch it, the Holy Spirit convicts you that it is a faithful translation in every detail of what God inspired to be recorded for mankind. It does not carry a copyright and is placed into public domain.
What would happen?
Let's be honest here. You think that all the above applies to the KJV,don't you?
Let's be honest here. You think that all the above applies to the KJV,don't you?
In other words, you are saying that I'm lying?
I just scrolled back through the posts and noticed that you haven't answered the question yet. It shouldn't matter whether you think I'm lying or not. What you may or may not perceive as being my "motive" should not enhance or diminish the validity of the question, itself.
Since you have elected to participate in this thread, what is your answer to the question, in context with the premise outlined in the OP and further defined?
What would happen?
It shouldn't matter whether you think I'm lying or not.
I think it is a significant aspect.
Since you have elected to participate in this thread, what is your answer to the question, in context with the premise outlined in the OP and further defined?
What would happen?
Well,since it has never happened... You are in the world of makebelieve. The Lord has not so ordered things as you laid out in your hypothetical situation.
saturneptune
New Member
Old Timer,One more time.....please!
The question and this thread is NOT about any particular version of the Bible.
Why do you feel the need to keep bringing in the KJB? Just for a moment, stop thinking about questioning that version of God's word. Perhaps choose the Message, NET, NIV, NASB and/or the NWT. Any one of them or all of them. It doesn't matter to me. With what you've chosen in view, under the premise given for this thread, what will happen?
I would not concern myself too much about posts from Rippon. He has been slithering about for years, posting what on the surface appears to be very intellectual posts, but always address a minor or meaningless subject. It never addresses anything to do with our number one purpose for being here, telling others about Jesus. Even on the points he does make, it is never, ever in agreement. It is always opposing someone in a demeaning way. Look up his past history.
saturneptune
New Member
You would not know what order the Lord has laid things out if Gabriel gave you a scroll with the order listed in 48 point font.I think it is a significant aspect.
Well,since it has never happened... You are in the world of makebelieve. The Lord has not so ordered things as you laid out in your hypothetical situation.
The question is what would happen if a born again believer had absolute proof that the document he holds in his hands IS the very word of God handed down from the beginning?
We ALREADY have it- preserved in a variety of manuscripts in a variety of translations in a variety of languages. So answering the question is a waste of time.
We ALREADY have it- preserved in a variety of manuscripts in a variety of translations in a variety of languages. So answering the question is a waste of time.
amen!
God preserved the Word of god in thsoe greek/hebrew source texts we abse transaltion on, so regardless Kjv/Nkjv/Nasb/niv etc its the word of god tous in our native tongue!
Gregory Perry Sr.
Active Member
And Again...
Just a reminder.....Things that are different ARE NOT the same.
Bro.Greg:saint:
amen!
God preserved the Word of god in thsoe greek/hebrew source texts we abse transaltion on, so regardless Kjv/Nkjv/Nasb/niv etc its the word of god tous in our native tongue!
Just a reminder.....Things that are different ARE NOT the same.
Bro.Greg:saint:
Just a reminder.....Things that are different ARE NOT the same.
Bro.Greg:saint:
that is why we have inerrant originals , and infallible translations!
Gregory Perry Sr.
Active Member
That IS Of Course.....
That is, of course, what every believer that is a KJVonlyist already believes....and what we see happening today in regard to this debate is precisely what would happen. In this world there will always be light and darkness, truth and error, and those of every stripe both saved AND lost who will take contrary or opposite positions on just about every issue, this one included. I believe the position I have arrived at was that which God revealed to me. By saying that I potentially automatically anger those who disagree with me because I am taking an "absolute" position (without fear or apology). It is not something that I do to deliberately anger or offend others. If they are angry or offended about it then I am sorry that they are...but I have to declare and stand upon the truth I believe God has shown me. I don't have any desire to be offensive. I desire to honor God and to hold to and believe the truth that I believe He wants me to believe for HIS honor and HIS glory.....no other reason! For me, to believe that I hold in my hands the perfect and supernatural Word of God that He wants me to have is an awesome truth. I don't worship a book like it was some kind of icon or something but I do worship God and His Truth because HE IS TRUTH and the two cannot be seperated....they are and always HAVE BEEN ONE. There IS a pure, supernatural Book that we can hold in our hands today. The very perfection and holiness of God absolutely demands that it be so because a Holy, Pure, and Perfect God would not leave His Holy, Pure, and Perfect Word to the whims and vagaries of sinful men without personally seeing to its transmission, protection and preservation. I believe He did this with the KJV even though the men whom he used in it's translation may not have even been aware of the import of their work as evidenced in their own statements in their opening dedication. Even so, their dedication, sense of reverence, and apparent humility about their work is admirable. That belief that I have stated above will make me friends of some....and enemies of others. So be it. Oldtimer...thanks for an interesting OP.
Bro.Greg:saint:
Suppose, just for a moment, that at the hand of God, a Bible version rolled off the presses, in the English language, that no one could question the validity. That He, in His infinite power, in some manner declared it to be an absolute. If you see it, hear it, touch it, the Holy Spirit convicts you that it is a faithful translation in every detail of what God inspired to be recorded for mankind. It does not carry a copyright and is placed into public domain.
What would happen?
That is, of course, what every believer that is a KJVonlyist already believes....and what we see happening today in regard to this debate is precisely what would happen. In this world there will always be light and darkness, truth and error, and those of every stripe both saved AND lost who will take contrary or opposite positions on just about every issue, this one included. I believe the position I have arrived at was that which God revealed to me. By saying that I potentially automatically anger those who disagree with me because I am taking an "absolute" position (without fear or apology). It is not something that I do to deliberately anger or offend others. If they are angry or offended about it then I am sorry that they are...but I have to declare and stand upon the truth I believe God has shown me. I don't have any desire to be offensive. I desire to honor God and to hold to and believe the truth that I believe He wants me to believe for HIS honor and HIS glory.....no other reason! For me, to believe that I hold in my hands the perfect and supernatural Word of God that He wants me to have is an awesome truth. I don't worship a book like it was some kind of icon or something but I do worship God and His Truth because HE IS TRUTH and the two cannot be seperated....they are and always HAVE BEEN ONE. There IS a pure, supernatural Book that we can hold in our hands today. The very perfection and holiness of God absolutely demands that it be so because a Holy, Pure, and Perfect God would not leave His Holy, Pure, and Perfect Word to the whims and vagaries of sinful men without personally seeing to its transmission, protection and preservation. I believe He did this with the KJV even though the men whom he used in it's translation may not have even been aware of the import of their work as evidenced in their own statements in their opening dedication. Even so, their dedication, sense of reverence, and apparent humility about their work is admirable. That belief that I have stated above will make me friends of some....and enemies of others. So be it. Oldtimer...thanks for an interesting OP.
Bro.Greg:saint:
That is, of course, what every believer that is a KJVonlyist already believes....and what we see happening today in regard to this debate is precisely what would happen. In this world there will always be light and darkness, truth and error, and those of every stripe both saved AND lost who will take contrary or opposite positions on just about every issue, this one included. I believe the position I have arrived at was that which God revealed to me. By saying that I potentially automatically anger those who disagree with me because I am taking an "absolute" position (without fear or apology). It is not something that I do to deliberately anger or offend others. If they are angry or offended about it then I am sorry that they are...but I have to declare and stand upon the truth I believe God has shown me. I don't have any desire to be offensive. I desire to honor God and to hold to and believe the truth that I believe He wants me to believe for HIS honor and HIS glory.....no other reason! For me, to believe that I hold in my hands the perfect and supernatural Word of God that He wants me to have is an awesome truth. I don't worship a book like it was some kind of icon or something but I do worship God and His Truth because HE IS TRUTH and the two cannot be seperated....they are and always HAVE BEEN ONE. There IS a pure, supernatural Book that we can hold in our hands today. The very perfection and holiness of God absolutely demands that it be so because a Holy, Pure, and Perfect God would not leave His Holy, Pure, and Perfect Word to the whims and vagaries of sinful men without personally seeing to its transmission, protection and preservation. I believe He did this with the KJV even though the men whom he used in it's translation may not have even been aware of the import of their work as evidenced in their own statements in their opening dedication. Even so, their dedication, sense of reverence, and apparent humility about their work is admirable. That belief that I have stated above will make me friends of some....and enemies of others. So be it. Oldtimer...thanks for an interesting OP.
Bro.Greg:saint:
Does God JUST use the Kjv to speak and teach people with? that NONE have been saved or matured under ANY other version?
Gregory Perry Sr.
Active Member
By definition....
Infallible...lets see here...the definition..From Noah Websters 1828 Dictionary:
INFAL'LIBLE, a. [L. fallo.]
1. Not fallible; not capable of erring; entirely exempt from liability to mistake; applied to persons. No man is infallible; to be infallible is the prerogative of God only.
2. Not liable to fail, or to deceive confidence; certain; as infallible evidence; infallible success.
To whom he showed himself alive after his passion, by many infallible proofs--
I contend that NO MAN...Or WORK OF MAN ( if it is strictly the "work of man") can be considered "infallible"....we have to be careful here....Are we to assume that it is impossible for ANY work of translation to carry with it the feature of infallibility...whether it be the KJV or ANY other work? OR....is there any evidence that God has imparted or placed His blessing upon any particular work as evidenced by it's prevalent use and fruit? KJVO's believe SO....CT/MV'ers...not so much.
Incidently.... the word "inerrant" does not appear in the 1828 Websters...but in the Websters "New Collegiate Dictionary" the word "inerrant is defined as "free from error: INFALLIBLE." Just though inquiring minds might want to know.:thumbs:
Bro.Greg:saint:
that is why we have inerrant originals , and infallible translations!
Infallible...lets see here...the definition..From Noah Websters 1828 Dictionary:
INFAL'LIBLE, a. [L. fallo.]
1. Not fallible; not capable of erring; entirely exempt from liability to mistake; applied to persons. No man is infallible; to be infallible is the prerogative of God only.
2. Not liable to fail, or to deceive confidence; certain; as infallible evidence; infallible success.
To whom he showed himself alive after his passion, by many infallible proofs--
I contend that NO MAN...Or WORK OF MAN ( if it is strictly the "work of man") can be considered "infallible"....we have to be careful here....Are we to assume that it is impossible for ANY work of translation to carry with it the feature of infallibility...whether it be the KJV or ANY other work? OR....is there any evidence that God has imparted or placed His blessing upon any particular work as evidenced by it's prevalent use and fruit? KJVO's believe SO....CT/MV'ers...not so much.
Incidently.... the word "inerrant" does not appear in the 1828 Websters...but in the Websters "New Collegiate Dictionary" the word "inerrant is defined as "free from error: INFALLIBLE." Just though inquiring minds might want to know.:thumbs:
Bro.Greg:saint:
Infallible...lets see here...the definition..From Noah Websters 1828 Dictionary:
INFAL'LIBLE, a. [L. fallo.]
1. Not fallible; not capable of erring; entirely exempt from liability to mistake; applied to persons. No man is infallible; to be infallible is the prerogative of God only.
2. Not liable to fail, or to deceive confidence; certain; as infallible evidence; infallible success.
To whom he showed himself alive after his passion, by many infallible proofs--
I contend that NO MAN...Or WORK OF MAN ( if it is strictly the "work of man") can be considered "infallible"....we have to be careful here....Are we to assume that it is impossible for ANY work of translation to carry with it the feature of infallibility...whether it be the KJV or ANY other work? OR....is there any evidence that God has imparted or placed His blessing upon any particular work as evidenced by it's prevalent use and fruit? KJVO's believe SO....CT/MV'ers...not so much.
Incidently.... the word "inerrant" does not appear in the 1828 Websters...but in the Websters "New Collegiate Dictionary" the word "inerrant is defined as "free from error: INFALLIBLE." Just though inquiring minds might want to know.:thumbs:
Bro.Greg:saint:
In bible terms, inerrant refers to no mistakes/errors, while infallible be that though has monor mistakes.errors, it willa ccomplish what God intends for it to do!
Just a reminder.....Things that are different ARE NOT the same.
Bro.Greg:saint:
That is true but it provides no support for the KJVO belief since the KJV is DIFFERENT from all of the texts it was translated from.
Define "different". Even the Cambridge KJV is "different" from the Oxford KJV. "Different" has shades of meaning.
I prefer: "Things that are different CAN BE equal." It applies to everything else in life.