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Supreme Court Upholds Gay Marriages
- Thread starter Yeshua1
- Start date
plain_n_simple
Active Member
True, yet this is not our Kingdom. This is a flesh kingdom that will have to cease, in order for Israel to be No. 1 again. Then the end.
gigabyte71
Member
I don't understand why Christians are so obsessed with gay marriage. Does the State approving a heterosexual couple have any standing with God? I don't recall instances of couples going down to the courthouse to get the government mandated permission slips to be married.
If we stopped spending time telling everyone how wrong this is/isn't, and started pointing people to Jesus, we might see a totally different trend. We can't expect unbelievers to live right, they need Jesus for that.
If we stopped spending time telling everyone how wrong this is/isn't, and started pointing people to Jesus, we might see a totally different trend. We can't expect unbelievers to live right, they need Jesus for that.
:thumbsup::thumbsup:
plain_n_simple
Active Member
Well said!
Bingo! I know what the Lord considers Holy Matrimony and I have never relied on politicians to uphold or enforce my beliefs. It isn't and has never been their job and you will usually end up disappointed if you think it is.
First, Sodomy is an indicator of the coming of Christ - Lk. 18
Second, Sodomy is an indicator of the judgement of God presently upon a nation and its final stages of self-destruction - Rom. 1
Third, Sodomy is destructive to our society, to your children and family if they fail to grasp its immoral impact upon a society.
Fourth, you obviously are a product of the "frog in the pan" syndrome, as you should hate what God hates, and Sodom and Gomorah is pretty graphic evidence of what God hates. Sure God hates all sin, but there are some sins that deserve severer judgement than others because of they involve others and because of their more severe impact upon a home, city, and nation.
Fifth, heterosexual is the Biblical model - one man and one woman (Mt. 19) rather than "Adam and Steve" or "Madam and Eve."
Sixth, heterosexual marriage is a COVENANT committment before God AND MAN, and legally binding before God and men, not merely before God, and we are commanded to obey the government where it agrees with God's Word. Legal marriage in the sight of men is consistent with God's covenant view of marriage.
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gigabyte71
Member
First off, Sodomy and Homosexual marriage are NOT the same. You need to get your facts straight. Sodomy is an act, which doesn't require two men. Sodomy is the act SNIP which can occur with a man and woman. Homosexual marriage is a legally binding contract between two people of the same sex which grants them certain privileges that had previously only be available to heterosexual couples.
The OP wasn't about Sodomy, it is about Homosexual marriage.
Really, I don't see anything about that in Luke 18. Regardless, if that were the case, then Jesus should have returned during the time of the Roman empire. Pretty much every male was expected to perform acts of Sodomy, it was a sign of dominance.
No, you need to re-read that chapter and remove your preconceived ideas about what Paul is talking about.
So is gluttony and crony capitalism, how often do you hear churches preach against such things? Do you seriously believe that not allowing homosexual marriage is in any way going to stop them from having relationships with one another?
Again, the OP isn't about Sodomy, it is about a legally binding contract between two parties of the same sex, which is referred to as Homosexual marriage.
Way to use verses out of context. That entire text is specifically about divorce. And I am not disagreeing with your thought here, but you really need to understand the difference between the State required permit, and what God says marriage is.
Really, show me where God requires a man/woman to go down to the courthouse and get the government mandated permit. I believe that Luther is the one that started that garbage. Show me some scripture that shows that government marriage is what God requires.
So, basically after reading all your comments, I am assuming that you believe we need to spend our time forcing 'righteousness' upon the nation, rather than pointing them to Jesus.
The OP wasn't about Sodomy, it is about Homosexual marriage.
Really, I don't see anything about that in Luke 18. Regardless, if that were the case, then Jesus should have returned during the time of the Roman empire. Pretty much every male was expected to perform acts of Sodomy, it was a sign of dominance.
No, you need to re-read that chapter and remove your preconceived ideas about what Paul is talking about.
So is gluttony and crony capitalism, how often do you hear churches preach against such things? Do you seriously believe that not allowing homosexual marriage is in any way going to stop them from having relationships with one another?
Again, the OP isn't about Sodomy, it is about a legally binding contract between two parties of the same sex, which is referred to as Homosexual marriage.
Way to use verses out of context. That entire text is specifically about divorce. And I am not disagreeing with your thought here, but you really need to understand the difference between the State required permit, and what God says marriage is.
Really, show me where God requires a man/woman to go down to the courthouse and get the government mandated permit. I believe that Luther is the one that started that garbage. Show me some scripture that shows that government marriage is what God requires.
So, basically after reading all your comments, I am assuming that you believe we need to spend our time forcing 'righteousness' upon the nation, rather than pointing them to Jesus.
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Not that some of you haven't shared some fantastic points .... kudos to you. You're right on. BUT, I do not desire to allow a pair of sexual perverts to share something I believe to be holy and meant for a man and a woman. Marriage is something special, and just like amnesty CHEAPENS citizenship ... same-sex marriage defiles and perverts the union between a man and a woman.
I realize that we live in a sinful world .... but I am tired os sin infringing upon the basic institutions I hold dearly.
So no matter what a court may dictate, I still have the God given right to disagree with sexual sin and perversion being treated as a holy union. It is a sin here and now, just like it will be treated upon the judgment of those who think its okay.
Shalom!
I realize that we live in a sinful world .... but I am tired os sin infringing upon the basic institutions I hold dearly.
So no matter what a court may dictate, I still have the God given right to disagree with sexual sin and perversion being treated as a holy union. It is a sin here and now, just like it will be treated upon the judgment of those who think its okay.
Shalom!
Why is this a problem for Christians? Because sexual sin is sin and this is going to be a government sanctioned sin that will be soon entering the church by the courts. If anyone thinks that in time pastors won't be sued and jailed for not marrying homosexual partners, they are woefully wrong.
we just have to suck it in and live with it, bro.
that said, I've always been fascinated not with gays and lezzies who like to flaunt who they are, but with Christians who are so up in arms about it.
don't they realize that pigs will be pigs, cockroaches will be cockroaches, and they will naturally wallow in filth.
that's who they are.
that's just the way it is.
And where did I ever say they were???? You need to read more carefully!
Homosexual marriage is inclusive of the sexual act, just as marriage between a woman and man is inclusive of the sexual act. "homosexual" marriage necessarily infers sodomy and lesbism
My typo, it is Luke 17:28-30 and read it along with 2 Pet. 2:6 and Jude 1:7 "strange flesh." This is a characteristic found in all generations but especially in the final generation. Jesus characterizes the time between His first and Second coming after the manner of birth pangs (Mt. 24:6,8). Birth pangs are always present but are building in intensity until the revelation of the baby, which is here used as a metaphor for the revelation of Christ from heaven.
No, you simply need to read and understand English as the text clearly spells out homosexuality in the clearest language possible in English and in the Greek text:
Rom. 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
Paul describes the things following Romans 1:18 as the signs of God's judgement.
So do you think that giving the Ten commandments as law over Israel could stop people from violating every single law???? According to your logic no laws should be made as they cannot stop people from doing what the Lord forbids. The power of the law is its penal consequences. The Laws of our Land should uphold righteousness not promote it (Rom. 12:1-5). And yes, we should legislated morality as the left does legislate immorality.
There is no LEGALLY binding contract between two people of the same sex, nor is it marriage. What it is, is SIN by a nation in rebellion against the authority God gave to government (Rom. 12:1-5). Governments were established by God to MINISTER RIGHTEOUSNESS as He defines it, not as they define it.
Again, you are not understanding the text. This text established the boundaries Marriage by God who instituted it. Government did not institute it, nor do they have the right to redefine it, as such IS SIN. This text restricts marriage to one man and one woman in the sight of God.
Read Romans 12:1-5. That is a command to you as a Christian to obey the laws of the land AS LONG AS THEY ARE WITHIN THE BOUNDARIES OF GOD'S STANDARD OF RIGHTEOUSNESS.
You have a responsibility as a free citizen to vote and enact laws that honor God. You will be held responsible for doing nothing, when it is in your power to oppose laws that defy God's law, and when it is in your power to support laws that glorify God. That does not mean by doing so you are opposing preaching the gospel. You are responsible to do BOTH. We are to RESIST sin and that is part of our civic duty. We are to preach the gospel, as that is the only way to change people one person at a time.
Just out of curosity, are you a homosexual?
gigabyte71
Member
Your sig line totally blows your entire argument. If all men are totally depraved, then how in the world can you expect them to live according to God's standards?
No it isn't, just like heterosexual marriage is inclusive of the sexual act. There are men/women who get married all the time for convenience. They get married for green cards, to hide their homosexual desires, for insurance benefits, etc, and never have any sexual relationship.
It is also unlikely that homosexuality is more prevalent now than in the Roman empire is skeptical. It was pretty much expected of every male, as it showed dominance over the other person.
Show me a scripture reference that says I have to obey the law of the land, unless it is contrary to the word of God.
No it isn't, just like heterosexual marriage is inclusive of the sexual act. There are men/women who get married all the time for convenience. They get married for green cards, to hide their homosexual desires, for insurance benefits, etc, and never have any sexual relationship.
It is also unlikely that homosexuality is more prevalent now than in the Roman empire is skeptical. It was pretty much expected of every male, as it showed dominance over the other person.
Show me a scripture reference that says I have to obey the law of the land, unless it is contrary to the word of God.
Just because you break the law habitually does not excuse your sin. God gave sinners the law knowing they would violate it - Rom. 8:7 but that did not excuse their violation but rather brought them under further condemnation and exposed their enmity.
Which is your standard? God's Word or ever changing human culture? I gave you the BIBLICAL definition of marriage not the cultural definition. As Christians our standard of righteous laws should be the BIBLE not the ever changing culture around us.
We have not yet reached the time when Christ returns have we? The homosexual agenda is increasing not decreasing isn't it?
Rom. 12:1 ¶ Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.
2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.
3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:
4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.
5 Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.
The Greek term translated "powers" is exousia or the common word for "authority." He is speaking about government and its "rulers" (v. 2). He is referring to secular authority to bear "the sword" as just recompense for disobedience.
gigabyte71
Member
You are the one confusing cultural definition of marriage with God's definition. My argument is that they are NOT the same, which is why I am not concerned with it.
I don't see anywhere in Romans 13 which says I can ignore the law, if it violates God's law.
Read more carefully!
Rom. 12:1 ¶ Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.
2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.
3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:
4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.
5 Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.
1. The powers are ordained by God - v. 1
2. The limits of their power is defined in verses 3-4
They are ordained by God "NOT to be a terror to good works, but to evil"
They are "ministers of God TO THEE FOR GOOD."
All authority is given to Christ (Mt. 28:18) and therefore all other authority is DELEGATED by Christ. Delegated authority is LIMITED authority. For example,
1. Wives are to be subject to the Husband but only within the confines of "in the Lord"
Col. 3:18 ¶ Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as it is fit in the Lord.
2. Children are to be subject to Parental authority but only within the confines "in the Lord."
Eph. 6:1 Children, obey your parents in the Lord: for this is right.
3. Servants are to be subject to Masters/bosses but only within the confines to what is pleasing to the Lord:
Eph. 6:6 Not with eyeservice, as menpleasers; but as the servants of Christ, doing the will of God from the heart;
7 With good will doing service, as to the Lord, and not to men:
4. Citizens are to be subject to secular authorites but only in the confines of God's design for them "ministers of righteousness....for good" not for evil.
Jesus said give unto Ceasar the things that belong to Ceasar, but unto God the things that belong to God. God has not authorized Ceasar or you to violate His revealed will. That is called "sin" in the bible regardless if Ceasar or you violate His will.
gigabyte71
Member
Not a single indication there that I can ignore the law of the land. I am finished with you on this. If you have something that actually proves your point, let me know.
I look at it this way…they cannot share that something we hold holy and meant for a man and a woman. While they may call it “marriage,” and our worldly governments may decide to recognize their union as a marriage….it is simply not the same thing. The ideologies of the world constitute an antithesis of the Christian worldview. Worldly love, hope, etc. corruptions of godly love, hope, etc. because they are absent of Christ. So even if they call it “marriage,” which I suspect will be more common place in the fairly near future, it simply is not the same…it’s a worldly forgery.
You just need to read things better and perhaps study it better, as you are suggesting that God holds us responsible to sin if the law of the land demands it. Surely you can see the vain reasoning behind that position? God promoting us to sin because the Law of the land LEGALIZES SIN?????? Surely?
Reread what I said, and you will see the consistent border is "good" as opposed to evil. You are suggesting that the government is a minister of God FOR UNRIGHTEOUSNESS as you are demanding we are obligated to man more than God to obey ungodly laws!!!
Zaac
Well-Known Member
HALLELUJAH!!!:applause::applause::applause: