TEN Commandments - e.g. "do not take God's name in vain".. still moral law

[utilyan]

In the irrational fictions that get passed around here -- is one of them that pastors are running hospitals?? Is it that you imagine that these hospitals use the name "seventh-day Adventist" in the name of their hospital and then pastors tell them to do abortions or Ted Wilson does?

Name such a hospital... instead of simply making stuff up.

Sure, the Hospital List is right here:

List of Seventh-day Adventist hospitals - Wikipedia



Here is more information on them:

Adventist Health International - Wikipedia
Adventist Health - Wikipedia
Adventist HealthCare - Wikipedia
Adventist Health System - Wikipedia


====
Adventist Health International (AHI) is a multinational, nonprofit corporation with headquarters in Loma Linda, California. AHI was established to provide coordination, consultation, management, and technical assistance to hospitals and health care services operated by the Seventh-day Adventist Church, primarily in developing countries. AHI depends on various organizations, foundations, governments, and individuals to provide financial assistance when needed.
====
^ OPERATED BY THE SEVENTH-DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH, Is it a stretch for us to believe those hospitals are ran by the Seventh-Day Adventist church?





You are taught we are evil and powerless victims of evil, We are taught you are brothers and sisters in the faith.

So I know my word is trash for you. Those links are Wikipedia pretty secular and unbiased source. I also have for source the SEVENTH DAY ADVENTIST OFFICIAL WEBSITE:

READ IT! with your own eyes! It is a Corporation. It owns the name Seventh Day-Adventist.

https://www.adventist.org/en/copyright/legal-notice/



I doubt I would have a hard time getting you to say the Catholic Church is Evil.

Can I hear you say abortion is evil?

 

[Walter]

Bob has been asked over & over if abortion is a sin (or evil) and he refuses to answer. Very telling.

"READ IT! with your own eyes! It is a Corporation. It owns the name Seventh Day-Adventist".

https://www.adventist.org/en/copyright/legal-notice/

 

[BobRyan]

Sure, the Hospital List is right here:

List of Seventh-day Adventist hospitals - Wikipedia

Good work - none of them use the name "Seventh-day Adventist" and the complaint I was responding to was the one about The Seventh-day Adventist church not allowing some entity to also use the name "Seventh-day Adventist".

As we all know there are many non-SDA entities that have the word "Adventist" in their name.

In addition of the ones that you did find in North America using the name Adventist - how many of that tiny group did you find promoting abortion-on-demand?


====
Adventist Health International (AHI) is a multinational, nonprofit corporation with headquarters in Loma Linda, California.

It is a separate entity from the SDA Church -- I used to work for AHS which is another Adventist Health organization.

You are taught we are evil and powerless victims of evil,

Wha-huh??

I doubt I would have a hard time getting you to say the Catholic Church is Evil.

errr...umm... because you have "heard me say it"?? ... ever??

Recall all my statements against "making stuff up"???

 

[BobRyan]

Bob has been asked over & over if abortion is a sin (or evil) and he refuses to answer. Very telling.

Huh??? You don't have anything from me supporting abortion apart from the effort to save the life of the mother. And we all know it.

"READ IT! with your own eyes! It is a Corporation. It owns the name Seventh Day-Adventist".

https://www.adventist.org/en/copyright/legal-notice/

And as we just saw - no Hospital in North America uses that name "Seventh-day Adventist" in its name.

Were we simply "not supposed to notice"??

1. The point remains - no pastor-run hospitals in North America within the Adventist Health System
2. No doctrine in the SDA denomination promoting abortion
3. and this is not the topic of this thread.

If Baptistboard had a forum rule against derailing threads - you would be in violation of it.

 

[utilyan]

Good work - none of them use the name "Seventh-day Adventist" and the complaint I was responding to was the one about The Seventh-day Adventist church not allowing some entity to also use the name "Seventh-day Adventist".

As we all know there are many non-SDA entities that have the word "Adventist" in their name.

In addition of the ones that you did find in North America using the name Adventist - how many of that tiny group did you find promoting abortion-on-demand?


====
Adventist Health International (AHI) is a multinational, nonprofit corporation with headquarters in Loma Linda, California.

It is a separate entity from the SDA Church -- I used to work for AHS which is another Adventist Health organization.




Wha-huh??



errr...umm... because you have "heard me say it"?? ... ever??

Recall all my statements against "making stuff up"???

OH MY GOODNESS BOB!

Do you want a video format for each hospital?

Washington Adventist Hospital




^^^^ OK Washington Adventist Hospital , Not affiliated with sda huh? Ran by Adventist health care


Right before COOPER HOSPITAL....... Or maybe it says COOPER HAPPY DISCO? SDA COOPER HOSPITAL

Wait let me get a marker and scribble this under this sign here......

....there we go.



I don't care if the hospital is called McDonalds! It is ran by the SEVENTH DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH.



BoB, this is from the OFFICIAL WEBSITE. Read CLOSELY:


The General Conference Corporation of Seventh-day Adventists® owns the trademarks for the names General Conference of Seventh-day Adventists®, Seventh-day Adventist® and Adventist®, as well as numerous other trademarks, including, but not limited to:



You keep vilifying, demonizing, calling me a liar, not even given a chance of being mistaken. I'm giving you the official website, the official stance, the hospitals ran by the SEVENTH DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH!

People are DYING BOB, they are being murdered. I will be there judgement day DEFENDING YOU, Lord he didn't know they were murdering your children! He didn't know its not his fault, His church meant well.

Brother please you point at other churches on the speck of worshiping God on the wrong day, Your church's plank is you are killing innocent children and getting paid for it.

I don't want to see your church fall. I don't want you to leave, I want you to fix it.

Also would be nice to hear you say "Abortion is Evil".

 

[HankD]

Also would be nice to hear you say "Abortion is Evil".

He can't, it would condemn the SDA support of abortion.

HankD

 

[Walter]

OH MY GOODNESS BOB!

Do you want a video format for each hospital?

Washington Adventist Hospital




^^^^ OK Washington Adventist Hospital , Not affiliated with sda huh? Ran by Adventist health care


Right before COOPER HOSPITAL....... Or maybe it says COOPER HAPPY DISCO? SDA COOPER HOSPITAL

Wait let me get a marker and scribble this under this sign here......

....there we go.



I don't care if the hospital is called McDonalds! It is ran by the SEVENTH DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH.



BoB, this is from the OFFICIAL WEBSITE. Read CLOSELY:


The General Conference Corporation of Seventh-day Adventists® owns the trademarks for the names General Conference of Seventh-day Adventists®, Seventh-day Adventist® and Adventist®, as well as numerous other trademarks, including, but not limited to:



You keep vilifying, demonizing, calling me a liar, not even given a chance of being mistaken. I'm giving you the official website, the official stance, the hospitals ran by the SEVENTH DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH!

People are DYING BOB, they are being murdered. I will be there judgement day DEFENDING YOU, Lord he didn't know they were murdering your children! He didn't know its not his fault, His church meant well.

Brother please you point at other churches on the speck of worshiping God on the wrong day, Your church's plank is you are killing innocent children and getting paid for it.

I don't want to see your church fall. I don't want you to leave, I want you to fix it.

Also would be nice to hear you say "Abortion is Evil".

Good work, U! None of us are buying the 'emotional nonsense' Bob is spewing. He KNOWS Adventists Hospitals are SDA entities and SDA doctors are scrubbing up right now to cut up another baby 'created in God's image'. He wants us to believe that the SDA would only have some accountability for their pro-death position (so clearly stated on the official SDA website) if SDA pastors were running their abortion mills. He seems to know the reason Adventists hospitals refuse to serve pork in their cafeterias and then argues that the patients can have pork upon request, but then doesn't like to talk about those same patients may also have an abortion upon request.

 

[Yeshua1]

Huh??? You don't have anything from me supporting abortion apart from the effort to save the life of the mother. And we all know it.



And as we just saw - no Hospital in North America uses that name "Seventh-day Adventist" in its name.

Were we simply "not supposed to notice"??

1. The point remains - no pastor-run hospitals in North America within the Adventist Health System
2. No doctrine in the SDA denomination promoting abortion
3. and this is not the topic of this thread.

If Baptistboard had a forum rule against derailing threads - you would be in violation of it.

Do you still see Ellen White as being inspired from God, and that the Sabbath must still be kept in order to stay saved?

 

[utilyan]

He can't, it would condemn the SDA support of abortion.

HankD

I have some faith in Bob. He just might be afraid to speak up.

We can help him. The worst case is the governing body of SDA is corrupt, but they could just be genuinely ignorant.

I'm looking for SDA pro-life sources.

"“The effect of prenatal influence is by many parents looked upon as a matter of little moment; but heaven does not so regard it. . . .Two lives are depending upon her, and her wishes should be tenderly regarded. . . . By the command of God Himself, she is placed under the most solemn obligation to exercise self-control.”[13] --Ellen G White


“If the father would become acquainted with physical law, he might better understand his obligations and responsibilities. He would see that he had been guilty of almost murdering his children [emphasis supplied], by suffering so many burdens to come upon the mother, compelling her to labor beyond her strength before their birth, in order to obtain means to leave for them.”[14] --- ELLEN G WHITE

“Few are aware of the fearful extent to which this nefarious business, this worse than devilish practice, is carried on in all classes of society! Many a woman determines that she will not become a mother, and subjects herself to the vilest treatment, committing the basest crime to carry out her purpose. And many a man, who has as many children as he can support, instead of restraining his passions, aids in the destruction of the babes he has begotten. The sin lies at the door of both parents in equal measure; for the father, although he may not always aid in the murder, is always accessory to it, in that he induces, and sometimes even forces upon the mother the condition which he knows will lead to the commission of the crime.”[1] ---James White

I think James White is Ellen G White's husband.



“The idea held by many that the destruction of foetal [sic] life is not a crime until after “quickening” has occurred is a gross and mischievous error. No change occurs in the developing human being at this period. The so-called period of “quickening” is simply the period at which the movements of the little one become sufficiently active and vigorous to attract the attention of the mother. Long before this, slight movements have been taking place, and from the very moment of conception, those processes have been in operation which result in the production of a fully developed human being from a mere jelly drop, a minute cell. As soon as this development begins, a new human being has come into existence–in embryo, it is true, but possessed of its own individuality, with its own future, its possibilities of joy, grief, success, failure, fame, and ignominy.”

“From this moment, it acquires the right to life, a right so sacred that in every land to violate it is to incur the penalty of death. How many murderers and murderesses have gone unpunished! None but God knows the full extent of this most heinous crime; but the Searcher of all hearts knows and remembers every one who has thus transgressed; and in the day of final reckoning, what will the verdict be? Murder? MURDER, child murder, the slaughter of the innocents more cruel than Herod, more cold-blooded than the midnight assassin, more criminal than the man who slays his enemy—the most unnatural, the most inhuman, the most revolting of all crimes against human life.” --- John Harvey Kellog

He and his brother invented cornflakes.



“One of the most shocking, and yet one of the most prevalent sins of this generation, is the murder of unborn infants. Let those who think this a small sin, read Ps. 139:16. They will see that even the unborn child is written in God’s book. And they may be well assured that God will not pass unnoticed the murder of such children.” -- J.N. ANDREWS


Psalm 139:16
16Your eyes saw my unformed body;

all the days ordained for me were written in your book

before one of them came to be.





“Nothing but an imperative sense of duty could induce me to pen what I am about to write. Letters from different sections of the country, and from physicians too, are so urgent that I should write on this subject, that I may not choose. I have no fear but what I am about to write will be read; but I wish it might be solemnly pondered. I am about to speak, and plainly too, of the practice of producing abortions. If any of my lady readers shall complain of a want of delicacy, I beg them to remember three facts; first, that the practice is fearfully common; second, that probably they are every week associating with those who are guilty of the practice; and third, that seventy-five per cent of all the abortions produced are caused and effected by females. What then of delicacy?”

“As a class, the medical profession have taken a noble stand. The desolations have become so fearful that, as the guardians of human life, they are compelled to do so: and society owes a debt of gratitude to Dr. H.R. Storer, of Boston, especially for his powerful arguments, lucid arrangements of facts, patient investigations and earnest and eloquent remonstrances. Among his writings on this subject, the little work entitled “Why Not?” Is a “book for every woman,” and I do wish that women might carefully read it. But the medical profession cannot arrest the evil, and they tell me they need, and must have, the moral power of good people to aid them. Even now, as I have reason to fear, all the profession are not beyond the reach of personal appeal, nor an enormous fee, and I do wish that every such an one could see that a fee steeped in blood, and crimsoned with shame, cannot bring a blessing to his family.”

“As to guilt, I want all to know that, in the sight of God, it is willful murder. “The willful killing of a human being at any stage of its existence, is murder. It is quenching immortal existence, it is destroying what, in a few months or weeks, would bear God’s image: and if anyone thinks she can do it without the guilt of murder, she is greatly mistaken. The very remembrance of this guilt has often upset the reason, and by remorse, turned the doer into madness.””[6] --John Todd

 

[HankD]

That was then, this is now!

HankD

 

[Walter]

Interesting reading: Who owns the word 'Adventist,' or 'Catholic'? - OnFaith
SDA applies pressure to have Facebook dump an Adventists Pro-Life group. See the reason why!

'They have been defending their name for some time, most notably in 1987, when they sued SDA Kinship, a group of gay Adventists, also charging trademark infringement. US District Judge Mariana Pfaeizer ruled against the church in 1991, saying the group’s title did not infringe on the denomination’s use of the name.

The SDA did not appeal that ruling, but it’s been fighting the unauthorized use of its name ever since'.

 

[BobRyan]

OH MY GOODNESS BOB!

Do you want a video format for each hospital?

Washington Adventist Hospital

It is great that you found "yet another" Hospital not using the name "Seventh-day Adventist".

Recall that the initial complaint was that the actual SDA denomination had copyrighted the name "Seventh-day Adventist" and that no other organization to use that exact name. However the SDA denomination has never copyrighted the name "Adventist" -- AND Pastors do not run the hospitals AND nothing you have ever posted shows that one of the actual beliefs of the denomination affirms abortion on demand.

And we all know it.

the point remains

 

[BobRyan]

Interesting reading: Who owns the word 'Adventist,' or 'Catholic'? - OnFaith
SDA applies pressure to have Facebook dump an Adventists Pro-Life group. See the reason why!

'They have been defending their name for some time, most notably in 1987, when they sued SDA Kinship, a group of gay Adventists, also charging trademark infringement. US District Judge Mariana Pfaeizer ruled against the church in 1991, saying the group’s title did not infringe on the denomination’s use of the name.

The SDA did not appeal that ruling, but it’s been fighting the unauthorized use of its name ever since'.

Once again not an appeal at all to the beliefs of the SDA denomination. Why do you keep doing that?

Your own article says this "But the denomination may be the only theologically conservative Protestant group that allows elective abortions. Many of their own members didn’t know that their worldwide hospital network performed the procedure, which has been quite the discussion on the Adventists for Life Facebook page."

That network is not run by pastors.
Three lawyers in Silver Springs MD do not determine the actual beliefs of the 20 million member denomination -- this appears to be a big surprise to you apparently.

What is more - Facebook is not the legal entity that defines the beliefs of the SDA denomination and the fact that 3 lawyers in Silver Springs MD got them to take down a page -- is not proof of anything other than facebook wanting to stay out of the issue altogether if it stirs up legal conflict.

 

[HankD]

It is great that you found "yet another" Hospital not using the name "Seventh-day Adventist".

Recall that the initial complaint was that the actual SDA denomination had copyrighted the name "Seventh-day Adventist" and that no other organization to use that exact name. However the SDA denomination has never copyrighted the name "Adventist" -- AND Pastors do not run the hospitals AND nothing you have ever posted shows that one of the actual beliefs of the denomination affirms abortion on demand.

And we all know it.

the point remains

Yes it does - abortion is abortion whether "on demand" or not, whether in North America or not whether the church that supports it allows its name to be displayed on it or not.

There is blood guilt!

HankD

 

[utilyan]

It is great that you found "yet another" Hospital not using the name "Seventh-day Adventist".

Recall that the initial complaint was that the actual SDA denomination had copyrighted the name "Seventh-day Adventist" and that no other organization to use that exact name. However the SDA denomination has never copyrighted the name "Adventist" -- AND Pastors do not run the hospitals AND nothing you have ever posted shows that one of the actual beliefs of the denomination affirms abortion on demand.

And we all know it.

the point remains

I already pointed out last post

They DO OWN "ADVENTIST" LET ME SHOW YOU: PUT READING GLASSES ON IN CASE IT IS TOO SMALL FOR YOU:

I WILL BOLD AND UNDERLINE:

OFFICIAL SDA WEBSITE:

The General Conference Corporation of Seventh-day Adventists® owns the trademarks for the names General Conference of Seventh-day Adventists®, Seventh-day Adventist® and Adventist®, as well as numerous other trademarks, including, but not limited to:

https://www.adventist.org/en/copyright/legal-notice/

This link is the website where you can read it with YOUR OWN EYES. OFFICIAL SDA WEBSITE:
https://www.adventist.org/en/copyright/legal-notice/


Do you need me to count the words for you?


1The 2 General 3 Conference 4Corporation 5of 6 Seventh-day 7Adventists® 8owns 9 the 10 trademarks 11for 12the 13names 14 General 15Conference 16of 17Seventh-day 18Adventists®,19 Seventh-day Adventist® 20and 21Adventist®, as well as numerous other trademarks, including, but not limited to:



21! The 21st word, REGISTERED TRADEMARK ADVENTIST. They own the word.



I could not make a product with "ADVENTIST" on it, I would get sued in a heartbeat. The same way some folks in Florida were ordered to stop making SDA T-Shirts.

They could tell all these hospitals to stop, But that would be the silliest thing. Why? Not because they can tell the hospitals to stop, but because THEY ARE THE HOSPITALS. They RUN IT.

I showed you facts that SDA runs the hospital, and you say oh its some lawyers (kinda funny lawyers running your church and swear ours is run by the devil)

 

[Walter]

Bob said: 'Huh??? You don't have anything from me supporting abortion apart from the effort to save the life of the mother'. There are two questions at issue here. One is medical (Is there ever need for an abortion to save the mother's life?) and the other is moral (Would an abortion in that case be justified?) The answer to both questions is no. There is no medical situation whose only solution is a direct abortion, as many doctors have testified. Morally speaking, furthermore, it is never right to directly kill an innocent person, even if good results are foreseen. We do not say that a baby's life is more important than the mother's. We do say that they are equal. You may never directly kill either one of them. If, in spite of the best medical efforts, one or both of them die, nothing morally wrong has been done, because an effort has been made to save life, but has failed. That is far different from what you are advocating . . . kill the baby. That is also why you refuse to say that abortion is evil/sin.

The Bible is silent about abortion in the same way it is silent about the Trinity. In other words, the word itself is not there, but the teaching is. First of all, Scripture is clear from beginning to end about the fact that human life is created by God, is in God's image, belongs to God, and has a destiny with God. The obligation to respect human life is illustrated in a thousand ways. Our obligations to each other are crystal clear.

 

[utilyan]

Bob said: 'Huh??? You don't have anything from me supporting abortion apart from the effort to save the life of the mother'. There are two questions at issue here. One is medical (Is there ever need for an abortion to save the mother's life?) and the other is moral (Would an abortion in that case be justified?) The answer to both questions is no. There is no medical situation whose only solution is a direct abortion, as many doctors have testified. Morally speaking, furthermore, it is never right to directly kill an innocent person, even if good results are foreseen. We do not say that a baby's life is more important than the mother's. We do say that they are equal. You may never directly kill either one of them. If, in spite of the best medical efforts, one or both of them die, nothing morally wrong has been done, because an effort has been made to save life, but has failed. That is far different from what you are advocating . . . kill the baby. That is also why you refuse to say that abortion is evil/sin.

The Bible is silent about abortion in the same way it is silent about the Trinity. In other words, the word itself is not there, but the teaching is. First of all, Scripture is clear from beginning to end about the fact that human life is created by God, is in God's image, belongs to God, and has a destiny with God. The obligation to respect human life is illustrated in a thousand ways. Our obligations to each other are crystal clear.

Well here is the part we have to pray......cause folks disappear for a month or so........ start a new thread.....and then we are back from square one.

But anyone reading this, debating SDA? make sure you bring up abortion. They get tighter then a girdle on a baptist minister's wife at an all-you-can-eat pancake breakfast.

 

[Walter]

[QUOTE="utilyan, post: 2350427, member: 12747"
But anyone reading this, debating SDA? make sure you bring up abortion. They get tighter then a girdle on a baptist minister's wife at an all-you-can-eat pancake breakfast.[/QUOTE]

Boy you got that right! The Sda's on other threads took off like flies when they were called out on their pro abortion stance. Bob will claim the church has no official statement or doctrine regarding abortion or that pastors do not run their SDA hospitals. It's all a bunch of hooey! Their official SDA website makes it very clear what their position is . Bob has also refused to call abortion Sin or evil. Very telling!

 

[Yeshua1]

Well here is the part we have to pray......cause folks disappear for a month or so........ start a new thread.....and then we are back from square one.

But anyone reading this, debating SDA? make sure you bring up abortion. They get tighter then a girdle on a baptist minister's wife at an all-you-can-eat pancake breakfast.

Very interesting that 2 churches that teach another false Gospel, Rome and Sda, going at it here!

 

[Walter]

Very interesting that 2 churches that teach another false Gospel, Rome and Sda, going at it here!

You should be 'going at it' over the killing of children too! As a Baptist Christian I defended the unborn and now as a Catholic Christian I continue to stand up for Jesus against this abomination.