I just believe that God is absolutely Sovereign, and that Satan cannot make one move without God approving. My picture of Satan being bound and chained in the bottomless pit is that his influence is almost nothing during that 1000 years.
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The 1,000 years of Revelation 20. #4 When does this Binding of Satan Take Place?
- Thread starter Alan Gross
- Start date
We agree on the first sentence. I note that Satan could not touch Job until God gave approval. I see Satan being unrestrained to deceive the nations as God giving him full authority to unleash his wrath against us who are marked by God in Revelation 7 by using the Beast (national governments) to attack. Jesus will return to end Satan and all who oppose him, as described in Revelation 19. Thus, on a timeline, Revelation 19 would be coming after Revelation 20:1-10. This is another reason why John is not laying out a sequential, linear timeline. The letter is never intended to be read that way.
timtofly
Well-Known Member
Do you not understand that the church thrives under persecution? The church becomes complacent and backsliden when things go great.
The binding of Satan has nothing to do with the spread of the Gospel. The binding of Satan has to do with deception and obedience to God.
Satan is hiding in the shadows, because to be front and center would be evidence that the Bible could also be true about Jesus and God. The nations today are being deceived through their leadership, who misdirects the truth. Ephesians 6:12
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places."
If this was the Millennium, no nations on earth would be in darkness. All leaders would bow to the authority of Jesus Christ. Saying that Satan is bound now to prevent persecution of the church is the farthest thing from the truth of God's Word. Jesus said the church would be persecuted: Matthew 24:9-10
"Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake. And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another."
Jesus even said there would be wars:
"And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places."
This is not the binding of Satan per Revelation 20. Wars and persecution have been continuous for the last 1993 years. The exact opposite of Revelation 20. Even the opposite of Isaiah 65:22-23
"They shall not build, and another inhabit; they shall not plant, and another eat: for as the days of a tree are the days of my people, and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands. They shall not labour in vain, nor bring forth for trouble; for they are the seed of the blessed of the Lord, and their offspring with them."
Their offspring for dozens of generations. The same in Zechariah 14:11, 9
"And men shall dwell in it, and there shall be no more utter destruction; but Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited."
"And the Lord shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and his name one."
The OT gives us details. John in Revelation 20 gives us the timeframe.
Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
Remember, the text says, 2 "He seized the dragon, that ancient serpent who is the devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years.
3 "And he threw him into the Abyss, shut it, and sealed it over him, so that he could not deceive the nations until the thousand years were complete."
You're taking it to say something exists that is labeled, "The Millennium", and assume that is some period of peace? with everyone under Jesus Authority?
Here, I see Jesus answering the Disciples question about when will one stone not be on another?
1 "As Jesus left the temple and was walking away, His disciples came up to Him to point out its buildings.
2 “Do you see all these things?” He replied. “Truly I tell you, not one stone here will be left on another; every one will be thrown down.”
3 "While Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to Him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will these things happen?"
When will the temple be destroyed?
Jesus answers that they will happen after you see the verses you quoted above and below, at The Destruction of Jerusalem.
timtofly
Well-Known Member
The authority of Jesus is the point of the 7th Trumpet.
"And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever."
That happens at the Second Coming, after all the trash is removed.
"Behold, the day of the Lord cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee. Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, And it shall be in that day, that living waters shall go out from Jerusalem; half of them toward the former sea, and half of them toward the hinder sea: in summer and in winter shall it be. And the Lord shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one Lord, and his name one."
The 7th Trumpet declares the Day of the Lord. The mystery of the Gospel is complete.
"And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer: But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets."
Daniel's 70 weeks are declared come to an end. The Day of the Lord will be the reality promised in Daniel 9:24. Not in part, but in whole. Also Adam's 6 days of punishment will be over. The 7th Day will be a Sabbath and Jesus will be the Lord of that Sabbath on earth.
In Matthew 24 there is no temple destroyed. Jesus did not answer their question. Jesus told them what they needed to hear, not what they wanted to hear. There is a difference.
The destruction of Jerusalem will be complete at the Second Coming. Then Jesus will build what is necessary. Zechariah 14
"And men shall dwell in it, and there shall be no more utter destruction; but Jerusalem shall be safely inhabited."
"For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him. And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all."
This is all in context of Jesus on the earth after the Second Coming. Jesus is the Prince to come. Gabriel declared that Jesus was both Messiah and Prince. That is Christ and King. The Lord of the earth during the Day of the Lord. A Day that comes with a baptism of fire to remove all the "trash".
The first coming was physically to earth as Messiah, the Christ. The second coming will be physically to earth as Prince, the King. That is what takes place while Satan is removed for a thousand years. That is what takes place if there are those beheaded who reign during the same thousand years. I see no reason to shorten, nor lengthen this period to a half a day, nor 2 days. Amil will deny that is what they do. They will question all other interpretations, and place their interpretation as the only viable interpretation. I understand they see this as only symbolic. Satan is symbolically held in check, sure, that is the symbolism of the parable of the strongman bound. Are parables now literal as long as Amil are using them? Satan has never been allowed to do as he pleases with full 100% authority. Satan was never the Lord of the earth. Satan is still allowed to deceive people and nations. That was not what that thought states. Jesus was asking a question, not making a statement.
"And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand? And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges. But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you. Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man? and then he will spoil his house."
Jesus was speaking in parables.
"And he called them unto him, and said unto them in parables, How can Satan cast out Satan? And if a kingdom be divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. And if a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand. And if Satan rise up against himself, and be divided, he cannot stand, but hath an end. No man can enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he will first bind the strong man; and then he will spoil his house."
John was not giving us a parable to explain what he was seeing in Revelation 20:1-3. If you don't think Satan had 100% control as the 8th king and mystery Babylon is just about symbols, then was there never a Babylon, a Daniel, the Medes and Persians, Greece, and Rome? Are they all just symbolic narratives about the struggle between good and evil? Jesus never declared Satan was bound for an indefinite period of time. That is a presupposition that some then insert into their interpretation of Revelation 20. A comparison of a parable with an alleged symbolic thought. Some would say John literally saw Satan bound, even if the method seems fantastical.
I tend to see the interpretation that John did not see symbolism. John saw the literal action and wrote it down in a symbolic form. Those who leave interpretation open based merely on symbolism are missing what literally happens. They can make Scripture say what ever they want with open ended symbolism. John knew what he saw and expected the reader to understand despite the symbolic form of writing.
Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
I think that is what I did here.
The verses cited don't leave room for any other structuring of Revelation.
REVELATION; Seven Returns of Jesus & Seven Ends of Time, or Seven Views of Jesus' One Return?
timtofly
Well-Known Member
No structure is better than the wrong structure.
Why is Revelation not showing the detail about the Second Coming? You have all the detail in Revelation about the first coming and nothing left for the Second Coming.
Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
I don't know what to tell you.
I drew you a picture.
When the First Coming is mentioned it is green.
Second Coming is in blue.
A careful reading of the book of Revelation will make it clear
that the book consists of seven sections,
and that these seven sections run parallel to one another.
Each of them spans the entire dispensation
from the first to the second coming of Christ.
This period is viewed now from one aspect, now from another.
With Christ’s first coming to save His people in Bold Green
and Jesus' Second Coming to Judge all nations in Bold Blue.
More than Conquerors, by William Hendricksen
timtofly
Well-Known Member
Can you tell me which part of the Olivet Discourse is about Jesus' first coming?
Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
The part about the Godman Who was speaking.
Jesus gave His Olivet Discourse during His First Coming, of course.