OldRegular
Well-Known Member
I would say that all of the redeemed crucified Jesus Christ. He is our passover, He is the sacrifice for the sins of the elect only.
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The 2 seeds
- Thread starter HisWitness
- Start date
I would say that all of the redeemed crucified Jesus Christ. He is our passover, He is the sacrifice for the sins of the elect only.
yes, for if one held to a definite atonement, penal substitution, that would be the correct view, which I do hold to also, just trying to say that not Just Jews killed Christ, it was an act of mankind ourselves!
What does the scripture say?
http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?p=1944025#post1944025
[add]: Or rather, what does the SPIRIT say?
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Scripture says, before this man, "So God created man in his [own] image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them," was created, this man about four thousand years later would be born, "And she brought forth her firstborn son, and wrapped him in swaddling clothes, and laid him in a manger;" and be slain in this fashion, "Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:"
Tom Butler
New Member
Permit me to answer. Peter's audience was Jews, in town from many other nations to celebrate Pentecost.
Acts 2:22-23
Acts 2:22-23
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
The Jews and Romans were simply instruments in the hands of God. It was sin that crucified Jesus Christ, the sin of all the redeemed.
Acts 2:22, 23
22. Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:
23. Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
...his Servant Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied before the face of Pilate, when he had determined to release him. But ye denied the Holy and Righteous One, and asked for a murderer to be granted unto you, Acts 3:13,14
It's not the Romans that the Spirit convicts of the crime; the blame, the bloodguiltiness falls squarely upon 'that generation' of Jews.
http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?p=1948992#post1948992
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No mention of Roman bloodguiltiness here:
and how the chief priests and our rulers delivered him up to be condemned to death, and crucified him. Lu 24:20
No mention of Roman bloodguiltiness here:
...the Jews; who both killed the Lord Jesus and the prophets, and drove out us, and pleased not God, and are contrary to all men; 1 Thess 2:14,15
No mention of Roman bloodguiltiness here:
35 that upon you may come all the righteous blood shed on the earth, from the blood of Abel the righteous unto the blood of Zachariah son of Barachiah, whom ye slew between the sanctuary and the altar.
36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.
37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, that killeth the prophets, and stoneth them that are sent unto her!..... Mt 23:35
But I know what it is with you OR, I know why you're so hardheaded on this issue, your gross misinterpretation of the Harlot as Rome is a sacred cow to you, this passage just HAS to be Rome, not Jerusalem:
And in her was found the blood of prophets and of saints, and of all that have been slain upon the earth. Rev 18:24
and how the chief priests and our rulers delivered him up to be condemned to death, and crucified him. Lu 24:20
No mention of Roman bloodguiltiness here:
...the Jews; who both killed the Lord Jesus and the prophets, and drove out us, and pleased not God, and are contrary to all men; 1 Thess 2:14,15
No mention of Roman bloodguiltiness here:
35 that upon you may come all the righteous blood shed on the earth, from the blood of Abel the righteous unto the blood of Zachariah son of Barachiah, whom ye slew between the sanctuary and the altar.
36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.
37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, that killeth the prophets, and stoneth them that are sent unto her!..... Mt 23:35
But I know what it is with you OR, I know why you're so hardheaded on this issue, your gross misinterpretation of the Harlot as Rome is a sacred cow to you, this passage just HAS to be Rome, not Jerusalem:
And in her was found the blood of prophets and of saints, and of all that have been slain upon the earth. Rev 18:24
That's WHY He was crucified, not HOW He was crucified.
Go back to the passage of the OP, what entity bruised His heel? The serpent.
How was the serpent manifested in this temporal realm?:
....Ye offspring of vipers, who warned you to flee from the wrath to come? Mt 3:7
44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father it is your will to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and standeth not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof. Jn 8:44
...the blasphemy of them that say they are Jews, and they art not, but are a synagogue of Satan.... Rev 2:9
....the synagogue of Satan, of them that say they are Jews, and they are not, but do lie;... Rev3:9
I would say the Jews living in the land of Judea.
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
He was crucified because God decreed that he would be crucified.
Galatians 3:13. Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
I am not trying to argue that the Jews did not crucify Jesus Christ. However, they could not crucify Him without the aid and permission of Rome. Furthermore, crucifixion was the mode of execution by Rome, not the Jews. And Rome was always under the control of God.
Consider Genesis 3:15:
And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.
If the Redeemer was to be born of a woman and that birth was to take place in history the way must be prepared. The Redeemer must be identified with God since He was to reconcile sinful man to God and since He was a man, the seed of a woman, He must be identified with the people of God. It was necessary, therefore, that God call out a people for His Name. Unto that people would be given the oracles of God [Romans 3:2] and through that people would come the promised Redeemer.
In due time God called out of idolatry a man named Abram [Genesis 12:1-3], changed his name to Abraham [Genesis 17:5] and promised that in his seed all the nations of the earth would be blessed [Genesis 22:18]. God, through the Apostle Paul, tells us that seed of Abraham through which all the nations of the earth would be blessed was Jesus Christ.
Galatians 3:16. Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
As time passed the lineage of the ‘seed of woman’ was further defined: Abraham’s son Isaac to the exclusion of Ishmael [Genesis 17:18-22], Isaac’s son Jacob to the exclusion of Esau [Genesis 28:10-15]. Out of Jacob would come twelve sons and the infant nation Israel which God, consistent with His promise to Abraham [Genesis 15:12-16], moved to Egypt. In Egypt the lineage of the ‘seed of woman’ was further defined: Jacobs son Judah [The Jews] to the exclusion of the eleven [Genesis 49:8-10]. That lineage was further defined to King David and his seed.
The Nation Israel was used to bring the Redeemer into the world. The Jews with the aid of Rome, were used to crucify Jesus Christ, fulfilling the promise of Genesis 3:15.
Acts 2:22, 23
22. Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:
23. Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
But it was sin that caused the death of Jesus Christ because He was the sacrifice for sin. He paid the price for the Redemption of all the Elect.
salzer mtn
Well-Known Member
I can remember when the Jews were called Christ killers and they were hated among all nations, now they are considered the elect by some religious groups. My, times have changed.
OldRegular
Well-Known Member
You have hit the tack with a sledge hammer and rightly so!
All part of being punished 'seven times over', Lev 26:18,21,24; Rev 16:1 and so on.
But they were generally 'loosed' from that status during the 19th century:
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/judaica/ejud_0002_0006_0_05916.html
The dispensationalists were also 'loosed' upon the church during the 19th century. Most of the adherents today do indeed worship 'the Holy DNA'.
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OldRegular
Well-Known Member
We badly need as a "smilie" a hand with a wagging finger. But until that happens :thumbsup::laugh:
So the LORD never promised that he would bless those nations who honored and blessed Isreal then?