The Age of Accountability

[John Gilmore]

koreahog2005,

The forgiveness of sins comes first. The work is finished and done. The forgiveness of sins was procured by Christ for all men before you and I were born.

But neither you nor I nor anyone else could believe on Christ and obtain the forgiveness of sins unless it was granted to us by the hearing of the gospel. In the parable, the prodigal obtains the forgiveness of sins when he believes his father's words, "this my son was dead, and is alive again."

Infants do not need cry out in terror, "Who will save me?" Satan has not yet taught them to put their total trust in him. Such is not the case for adults. Before adults are prepared to receive the grace of God, they must despair and cry out in terror like the prodigal son.

The 2000 Baptist Faith and Message denies justification by faith alone and invites men to trust in their personnel work of acceptance and commitment. All Christians should mark and avoid the SBC.

 

[koreahog2005]

John, you said,

The 2000 Baptist Faith and Message denies justification by faith alone and invites men to trust in their personnel work of acceptance and commitment. All Christians should mark and avoid the SBC.

I am a Southern Baptist missionary, and I regard the statement above as an indication that you do not want to have a polite discussion with me. It is quite insulting to say that Christians should avoid the SBC, the largest Protestant denomination in the United States. I would never say that about Lutherans. It's interesting that you would say such a thing in the context of a "Baptist" board. I wish you well, John.

 

[John Gilmore]

koreahog2005,

Why wouldn't you mark and avoid the Lutheran Church if it teaches false doctrine? I regard the SBC as a heterodox Christian church and scripture teaches me to avoid such churches.

The Baptist Board is not a church and my posting is not a sign of fellowship. However, I have decided to withdraw because I do not wish to cause offense.

 

[npetreley]

Originally posted by John Gilmore:
Why wouldn't you mark and avoid the Lutheran Church if it teaches false doctrine? I regard the SBC as a heterodox Christian church and scripture teaches me to avoid such churches.

Every church I've ever attended teaches some false doctrine. I avoid the ones that teach serious errors, but if I avoided all churches that teach SOME error I'd have no church.

 

[Eric B]

What's wrong with hellfire? That's the pattern of the old Calvinist and Lutheran pastors. It's the Arminians that have gotten away from it with their seeker sensitive sermons.

I didn't say anything was wrong with it, but I was going to caution that people overdid it in the past, and this hardened and rove peole away. (or is that supposed to be a good thing; harden the reprobates and drive out the tares? I don't know about the; Christ warned us about uprooting the wheat as well).
Lutheran and Calvinist denominations have also liberalized greatly. So weakening of doctrine is not the fault of Arminianism.

Luther's salvation model is different from Calvin's. Luther really believes that the Lamb of God has taken away the sins of the world, Christ is the propitiation for the sins of the world, and God was in Christ reconciling the world unto Himself. So Luther pronounces an unconditional absolution. And those who believe his absolution obtain the forgiveness of sins.

Still, then, I don't see any real difference from the method of the Arminian, who likewise believes Christ atoned for the whole world. Believe and you obtain the forgiveness.

The 2000 Baptist Faith and Message denies justification by faith alone and invites men to trust in their personnel work of acceptance and commitment. All Christians should mark and avoid the SBC.

Are you sure they actually said that; or is that the way you are interpreting it? The fact that there is a growing Calvinist movement within the SBC is evidence it des not say or mean that, for they probably would avoid it as well.

 

[BobRyan]

Originally posted by John Gilmore:
koreahog2005,

Why wouldn't you mark and avoid the Lutheran Church if it teaches false doctrine? I regard the SBC as a heterodox Christian church and scripture teaches me to avoid such churches.

The Baptist Board is not a church and my posting is not a sign of fellowship. However, I have decided to withdraw because I do not wish to cause offense.

That is silly.

Christ "had fellowship" with His disciples. But according to the Matt 16 incident with Peter - they did not believe in the substitutionary atoning death of the messiah for sin -- much less the Trinity. Yet Christ celebrates passover communion yearly with Jews that had flawed doctrinal views as compared to Christians today.

In Christ,

Bob