The Ages in Genesis

[antiaging]

Not to mention that God limited the lifespan of man in Genesis 6:3 and we can see that 120 is pretty much the limit on how long man can live even someone in the best of health.

That is Old Covenant. In the New Covenant more is granted.

26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me SHALL NEVER DIE. Believest thou this?
40 Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?


22 Jesus saith unto him, IF I WILL THAT HE TARRY till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me.
23 Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, IF I WILL THAT HE TARRY till I come, what is that to thee?

Those words of Jesus indicate that in the New Covenant, if a Christian really believes he won't die, then he won't. Also it is possible for a man to live from the first century until Jesus comes back, if He wills Him to.

 

[antiaging]

We are never going to be able to prove this one here guys but here are some of my thoughts.

Antiaging, are you are making the assumption that Adam and Eve partook of the tree of life while they lived in the garden? What are you basing that on? Do we know that the tree in Gen 3:22 and the tree in Revelation 22:2 are the same tree? I had always read Gen 3 to infer that once they ate one bite of the tree of life it would give everlasting life, just like the tree of good and evil gave death (through sin of course). Do we even know these were real trees or could they just be symbols of our obedience or disobedience to God? After all Prov 3:18 tells us that the fruit of righteousness is a tree of life. I am not saying they were not real trees, I am just asking do we know.

From what you wrote antiaging I believe that you are saying that it was the continual consumption of the fruit of this tree that gives eternal life, that we have to eat of it more than once. I disagree with that if for no other reason than it destroys the symbolism of Christ contained in the tree. We don’t have to be saved over and over again every time we get hungry, we only have to take of the tree one time. I don't believe Adam and Eve ever partook of that tree.

Distilled vitamins are the key to long life? I don’t know about that either. I applaud you for your healthy life style, many of us could do better in that regard. Although your comment of:Is a bit over the top.

Aniaging, you said:I have to disagree with you and BobRyan here.

A youthful body at 70 will not prove it to me. Lots of 70 year olds look young. Look at Jack La Lanne. When he was 70 he swam a mile and a half across long beach harbor, while shackled and handcuffed, and towed 70 boats with 70 people in them the entire way. He plans to do a 20 mile ocean swim to Catalina Island to celebrate his 95th birthday. (He is only 93 now so he has time to train).

If you want to prove to me you have unlocked the secret of the biblical life spans call me when you are 150. Abraham was born when Tarah was 130 and Isaac was born when Abraham was 100 (and Abraham had more kids after that). Father a kid when you are over 100 and I will really think you are on to something (Didn’t Strom Thurmond father his last son when he was 73?)

I am sorry but I don’t think we will ever unlock the secret to living 900 years on this earth. Personally I believe it is due to the deterioration of the human genome. The long life spans before the flood lead to tremendous scientific advancement. Just think what you could learn and discover over a lifetime like that. I believe, and watch out, I know have limited evidence here, but I believe that God scrambled the human DNA at the tower of Babel. I believe that was the introduction of the races as well as languages. And since that time we have primarily intermarried within our race and language groups so the DNA has deteriorated further. Yes pollution, chemicals, radiation and lifestyle may have a minor role, but I believe there is a difference in our make up from those pre flood individuals who lived to be 900. But hey, go for it, if you make 200 that will be something.

And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
16 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
17 But of the TREE OF THE KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

They were allowed to eat of every tree of the garden except one.
They ate of the tree of life until they sinned. After that they were not allowed to eat of it anymore so that they would eventually die of old age.

 

[antiaging]

So, how much for a month's supply of the multi-vitamin you are selling?

In all honesty folks, ya'll have got to realize that the aging processes is due to viral and radiation exposure. From Adam to the flood as was stated before my post the environment of the earth had less radiation and less communicable viruses. After the flood the environment had changed so drastically that even the generation of Noah's sons was much shorter than that of Noah by several hundred years. With each successive generation in drastic yearly decline.

Just after the flood for several generations the whole human race collected and remained in one location. God intervened and disperced humanity by race and language. This one community had to be rife for viral dispersion and the environment had become favorable to rapid viral growth and solar radiation exposure.

Now I am not a scientist with any knowledge about DNA/RNA, genetics or treatments thereof. It is to my feeble understanding that as each of us are exposed to a rhino virus (common cold) or influenza for how ever many times throughout life that it, the virus, mutates the DNA strand. Over this time period of life, the DNA becomes so frayed that it can no longer properly regenerate and thus aging is the result of many viral attacks as well as higher radiation levels. Radiation also mutates DNA.

While I too believe that humanity was very advanced technology, as Genesis indicates that the lineage of Cain built cities and forged iron. However to state that Adam and the rest of humanity before the flood synthesized the benefits of the fruit of the Tree of Life is in my mind very far fetched.

Aging is cause by:
Oxidation products in the cells converting to free radicals by background radiation. The free radicals cause cell damage which slows the funcions of the cells and the cell divisions down. Slower cell divisions causes more cells to die than are being regenerated. Causing aging.
Antioxidant vitamins, megadoses, can clean the oxidation products out fast enough so that the cells are not damaged and the cell divisions continue to be at a fast level. So no aging.-- Calcium need for bones and teeth to regenerate.
Clean colon also helps. More sleep for more Human growth harmone helps.

 

[antiaging]

That is probably part of that averaging out thing Rubato was talking about. For every 50 year old who looks 20 there is another 50 year old who looks 80.

Overwork, not enough sleep, no vitamin supplements will cause premature aging and an early death.
Robert Ripley, of Ripley's believe it or not, burned out that way. When in his 40s the doctor told him he had the body of an 80 year old. He died in his 40s.

 

[Rubato 1]

Robert Ripley, of Ripley's believe it or not, burned out that way.

I don't believe it.

 

[BobRyan]

That is Old Covenant. In the New Covenant more is granted.

26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me SHALL NEVER DIE. Believest thou this?

That is from John 11 where Christ states "Lazarus IS dead! I go that I may wake him".

Funny how we have SOOOO many examples of people blowing that 120 year limit right out of the water by almost a factor of 8 or 9 in the OT and yet NOT ONE Bible account of ANYONE in the NT ever doing it!

Now this is not to say that there may have been a case or two over the past 2000 years where 1 or 2 people eeked their way huffing and barely puffing past 120 - but that is nothing compared to the 200's, 500's, 800's that were "mere children" pre-flood by comparison to the 900's.

22 Jesus saith unto him, IF I WILL THAT HE TARRY till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me.
23 Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, IF I WILL THAT HE TARRY till I come, what is that to thee?

Those words of Jesus indicate that in the New Covenant, if a Christian really believes he won't die, then he won't. Also it is possible for a man to live from the first century until Jesus comes back, if He wills Him to.

That account regarding John is another good example of a saintly disciple dying long before 150 or 120 or 500 years of age. New Covenant and all.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

And out of the ground made the LORD God to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the tree of life also in the midst of the garden, and the tree of knowledge of good and evil.
16 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
17 But of the TREE OF THE KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

They were allowed to eat of every tree of the garden except one.
They ate of the tree of life until they sinned. After that they were not allowed to eat of it anymore so that they would eventually die of old age.

Very true. And in Gen 3 God says that He now needs to bar the way to the Tree of Life so they will no longer have access to it - lest they eat and "live forever".

in Christ,

Bob

 

[Palatka51]

Where is the account that while they were in the garden they ate of the Tree of Life?

 

[antiaging]

Vitameatavegamin...
No great discovery surfaces without its detractors and scoffers.

Truth will first be ridiculed, then violently opposed, and finally accepted as self-evident; A. Schopenhauer 1788-1860

"It is the responsibility of scientists never to suppress knowledge, no matter how awkward that knowledge is, no matter how much it may bother those in power. We are not smart enough to decide which pieces of knowledge are permissible and which are not."
--Carl Sagan, in a 1991 commencement address at UCLA

"Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance!"
--Albert Einstein

"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments, and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance--that principle is contempt prior to investigation."
--Herbert Spencer

 

[antiaging]

That is from John 11 where Christ states "Lazarus IS dead! I go that I may wake him".

Funny how we have SOOOO many examples of people blowing that 120 year limit right out of the water by almost a factor of 8 or 9 in the OT and yet NOT ONE Bible account of ANYONE in the NT ever doing it!


in Christ,

Bob

Matthew 17:20 And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.

That statement is true as long as it does not contradict any other scripture in the New Testament.

John 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
John 11:40 Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?

All of that is in the context of physical death.

So, apparently no one recorded in the scriptures really believed he would not die. So what. That does not negate the truth, according to the Words of Jesus, that if a real Christian did believe it, then he would not die.
That also does not negate what Jesus said about willing someone to tarry from the first century till He returns.

According to scripture, a real Christian is only limited by what he is willing to believe, conscerning what is possible to happen to him; so long as it does not contradict any other scripture of the New Testament.

Ecclesiastes 6:6 Yea, though he live a thousand years twice told, yet hath he seen no good: do not all go to one place?

And because of those words it could have been a possibility for the old covenant as well.

That verse about 3 score years and 10 is in general. Not in every case; obviously.

 

[annsni]

Ahhh - gotcha. We just need to believe that we will live forever and we will.

Hmmm - that's really interesting, especially since it does not line up with Scripture OR true historical fact.

 

[donnA]

That is Old Covenant. In the New Covenant more is granted.

26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me SHALL NEVER DIE. Believest thou this?
40 Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?


22 Jesus saith unto him, IF I WILL THAT HE TARRY till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me.
23 Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, IF I WILL THAT HE TARRY till I come, what is that to thee?

Those words of Jesus indicate that in the New Covenant, if a Christian really believes he won't die, then he won't. Also it is possible for a man to live from the first century until Jesus comes back, if He wills Him to.

hummmm, a scripture twister,, no shortage of those is there.

 

[donnA]

Overwork, not enough sleep, no vitamin supplements will cause premature aging and an early death.
Robert Ripley, of Ripley's believe it or not, burned out that way. When in his 40s the doctor told him he had the body of an 80 year old. He died in his 40s.

so if I take vitamins, sleep a lot, do not ever over work I can expect to not die.

 

[donnA]

Truth will first be ridiculed, then violently opposed, and finally accepted as self-evident; A. Schopenhauer 1788-1860

"It is the responsibility of scientists never to suppress knowledge, no matter how awkward that knowledge is, no matter how much it may bother those in power. We are not smart enough to decide which pieces of knowledge are permissible and which are not."
--Carl Sagan, in a 1991 commencement address at UCLA

"Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance!"
--Albert Einstein

"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments, and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance--that principle is contempt prior to investigation."
--Herbert Spencer

LOL :tonofbricks: :BangHead:
so you have a lot of men, how about scripture that isn't twisted?

 

[antiaging]

Ahhh - gotcha. We just need to believe that we will live forever and we will.

Hmmm - that's really interesting, especially since it does not line up with Scripture OR true historical fact.

What you got seems to be doubt. Go and read what Jesus said again.

Go to a book store or a health food store and buy a book on slowing down aging with nutrition. There are several of them. There are people around the world megadosing on vitamins to slow down aging. There is a volume of research done on this subject already. A vitamin combination works much better than a single one. Very large doses of cetain vitamins, work better still. [Too much vitamin A or D can kill you.]
I saw a woman on TV at a vitamin conference or show, and she was in her 50s and was young like her 30s. I am not the only one doing this. But, I think I started doing it at an earlier age and probably pushed it further than anyone else.
The ones that are using human growth harmone to slow down aging are not doing it as well as they think. That is like a quick fix, and not a cure. It also has serious side effects like unwanted bone growth (giantism) and acromagaly; Giant face. If they stop taking the HGH, they get older by the same years they got younger rapidly.
HGH works on the harmone level. Antioxidants work on the cellular level.

 

[annsni]

What you got seems to be doubt. Go and read what Jesus said again.

Go to a book store or a health food store and buy a book on slowing down aging with nutrition. There are several of them. There are people around the world megadosing on vitamins to slow down aging. There is a volume of research done on this subject already. A vitamin combination works much better than a single one. Very large doses of cetain vitamins, work better still. [Too much vitamin A or D can kill you.]
I saw a woman on TV at a vitamin conference or show, and she was in her 50s and was young like her 30s. I am not the only one doing this. But, I think I started doing it at an earlier age and probably pushed it further than anyone else.
The ones that are using human growth harmone to slow down aging are not doing it as well as they think. That is like a quick fix, and not a cure. It also has serious side effects like unwanted bone growth (giantism) and acromagaly; Giant face. If they stop taking the HGH, they get older by the same years they got younger rapidly.
HGH works on the harmone level. Antioxidants work on the cellular level.

Well, I'm 42 and I'm CONSTANTLY getting mistaken for being in my 20s. I guess I'm doing something right. But that certainly doesn't mean that I'm going to live past 120. Those who take good care of themselves can live longer - but no longer than the prescribed lifespan of man. I'm sorry to disagree with you but I know that you can not show one person who is beyond 120 who is living well.

 

[Rubato 1]

Truth will first be ridiculed, then violently opposed, and finally accepted as self-evident; A. Schopenhauer 1788-1860

"It is the responsibility of scientists never to suppress knowledge, no matter how awkward that knowledge is, no matter how much it may bother those in power. We are not smart enough to decide which pieces of knowledge are permissible and which are not."
--Carl Sagan, in a 1991 commencement address at UCLA

"Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance!"
--Albert Einstein

"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments, and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance--that principle is contempt prior to investigation."
--Herbert Spencer

"Falsehood, along with truth, will be ridiculed"--Rubato 1