The Authority of Scripture: Creedal vs. Sole Authority

[TCassidy]

Are Creeds and Confessions, when based in Scripture, an authority for orthodoxy?

Asked and answered so why do you continue to ask the question that has already been answered?

When a creed quotes scripture the scripture is the only authority.

 

[Yeshua1]

Perhaps you three (you, @The Archangel , and @Martin Marprelate ) are reading too much into this thread. Perhaps the thread is too simple for such complex minds. (kidding)

I will try to be super clear and avoid obfuscation.

Are Creeds and Confessions, when based in Scripture, an authority for orthodoxy?

When their points of doctrine and belief line up and are in agreement with the Bible...

 

[JonC]

Asked and answered so why do you continue to answer the question that has already been answered?

He said that was a an intentional misrepresentation of his words.

Hence my question.

 

[TCassidy]

He said that was a an intentional misrepresentation of his words.

Just as you intentionally misrepresented my words?

You asked

Are Creeds and Confessions, when based in Scripture, an authority for orthodoxy?

After I said

When a creed quotes scripture the scripture is the only authority.

 

[JonC]

When their points of doctrine and belief line up and are in agreement with the Bible...

That is where we disagree.

I believe creeds and confessions to be descriptive only. We have to go to Scripture when examining doctrine.

 

[Yeshua1]

Have you ever noticed many of them attack anyone not agreeing with them as if Calvinists were the guardians of orthodoxy and everyone else that one apple that could spoil the whole bunch?

Even on what should have been a fairly simple and plain thread as this one.

Would say that would based upon the historical fact that Calvinists have by and by been the Christians that have stood up too the attacks launched upon the Gospel and the Bible themselves!

 

[Yeshua1]

I said "Calvinists" and I named one person. I said nothing about you, in particular. You can quote confessions until the sun explodes, doesn't mean they have the same weight in doctrine as scripture.

Requote Any Calvinist/reformed who posts here that stated that they do!

 

[Yeshua1]

That is where we disagree.

I believe creeds and confessions to be descriptive only. We have to go to Scripture when examining doctrine.

So when the Confession merely reaffirms and agrees with the Bible itself, that mean that they are not authorative in that the doctrines has ben firmly established as being true?

 

[JonC]

Just as you intentionally misrepresented my words?

You askedAfter I said

Ok. Let's put away the childishness of he said she said you said etc and just get to the subject of the OP. You are losing me in the jargon.

The OP concerns the authority of creeds.

I believe them descriptive only (no authority).

I understand @The Archangel to hold them in authority if biblically based.

He can answer and clarify from there. You aren't working out as a middle man .

 

[JonC]

So when the Confession merely reaffirms and agrees with the Bible itself, that mean that they are not authorative in that the doctrines has ben firmly established as being true?

Yes. The reason is that these are not just strings of Scripture. They involve interpretation and sometimes quite a bit of philosophy.

The creed I question states that Mary is the "Mother of God". Some disagree with that description and prefer the mother of Jesus (Jesus in His humanity). So they reject the creed.

Even one of the most basic creeds have Jesus descending into Hell, which has been taken at least 3 ways (literal Hell, the grave, and suffering a hell for 3 hours on the cross).

So I believe them descriptive (which accommodates differences) but not an authority (one is forced to seek out Scripture).

 

[Yeshua1]

I can only respond to what you post. If you are saying you do not believe creeds and confessions an authority for orthodoxy then I can happily accept that. But you may want to work on articulating your thoughts with greater clarity.

There are three reasons I thought you to hold creeds in such a position.

1. You presented a creed as indicative of the position of the "Orthodox Church".
2. You presented the Bible as the "final authority".
3. You spoke of not believing creeds "in and of themselves" as authoritive.

If you mean to say creeds are no ground for authority when it comes to doctrine then I agree. This is my only point.

Then place cite the scriptures that indicate to you why the vast majority of us who uphold Jesus having 2 natures are wrong!

 

[Yeshua1]

That is where we disagree.

I believe creeds and confessions to be descriptive only. We have to go to Scripture when examining doctrine.

Does not the 1689 Confession go to the very scriptures themselves though, as it does not affirm itself to be any authority apart from the basis of what ha been revealed to us in the scriptures themselves?
Every church pretty much has some form of a written statement of beliefs held by it, based upon scriptures, are they also wrong?

 

[JonC]

Then place cite the scriptures that indicate to you why the vast majority of us who uphold Jesus having 2 natures are wrong!

OK. But first you cite Scripture stating we will not have cars in Heaven.

 

[Yeshua1]

OK. But first you cite Scripture stating we will not have cars in Heaven.

Can Jesus being fully human and not have a human nature?

 

[37818]

The basic problem is with the word hell, as its actually Hades in the Greek text....

In the KJV that term "hell" is used to translate referring to three different places. In the modern versions typically gehenna.

 

[TCassidy]

Let's put away the childishness of he said she said you said etc

Yes, please do. I am getting tired of it. Surely you have something more to offer?

 

[TCassidy]

OK. But first you cite Scripture stating we will not have cars in Heaven.

I thought you were going to stop the childishness.

 

[Jerome]

Southern Baptists....they all ascribe to the BFM.

Its drafters assured us that it was NOT "a binding or governing document on Southern Baptist churches and their members."

Baptist Press June 14, 2000
Baptist Press June 14, 2000

In answer to debate coming from the floor, members of the study committee repeatedly defended the preamble, as well as the entire document, as a statement of belief and not as a binding or governing document on Southern Baptist churches and their members.

Committee members cautioned the press against misunderstanding Baptist polity, noting that the convention's vote is not binding on local churches. "We don't have the right, the authority or the power"...[Adrian] Rogers noted...."It is not a creed. It is a statement of what most of us believe."

 

[Yeshua1]

In the KJV tha

That is where the Kjv got it wrong....

 

[37818]

That is where the Kjv got it wrong....

No.