The Biblical Basis for Penal Substitution, part 2

[JonC]

Of course not. They clearly show penal substitution as they are written. You can't argue against them but you are too obstinate to admit that that is penal substitution.

No. You understand them to indicate PSA, but the text itself does not state PSA.

That is why you cannot, in all the passages you quoted, put in bold that Jesus died instead of us, that Jesus suffered God's wrath, etc.

What you do is blaspheme. The reason your words are blasphemous is rather than explaining how you get from the biblical text to your understanding you claim that your understanding is the text itself.


There are many instances where my understanding is not the biblical text itself. But when this occurs I explain how I arrived at my understanding and I do not lean on this understanding. When it comes to essental doctrines, these must be in the text of Scripture.

 

[JonC]

Christians, who believe in PSA, have these debates as to in what way faith is a "condition", whether it itself can be described as saving, and whether it is possible to word it in any way to make it be truly considered a "work". But that's for people who all believe that the only meritorious cause of our salvation, or even the possibility of our salvation, to be the blood of Christ as a penal sacrifice on our behalf and in our stead. Don't come at me with this same juvenile stuff when you are obviously not even at the point of the merits of our salvation consisting in the work of Christ.

Your understanding that men save themselves through their work of coming to God is not as "easy" as traditional PSA (not as easy as Calvininism or Arminianism). But it is still "easy believism".

 

[DaveXR650]

No. You understand them to indicate PSA, but the text itself does not state PSA.

I guess you are right in that the words do not say "this is PSA". But now you are getting more and more unhinged and silly. You have no answer and have resorted to saying that I'm blaspheming because I believe the same way most Baptists on this board do regarding those verses. I'll forgive you even though I don't think you are supposed to do that on this board. Besides, I believe that you are very close to being a Socinian. I'd watch out for that because that is indeed a heresy. You haven't gone all the way but many of your arguments against penal substitution sound like Socinus himself.