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The deadly danger of an easy believism church

evangelist6589

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Was listening to the pastor today, and while I take no issue with the churches commitment to expository preaching, Biblical Creationism, and Nouthetic biblical counseling, they seem to really bomb it with soteriology. For example once again like every service he gave an alter call, and once again all one had to do to become a christian was to pray a prayer, and come forward. Hell was not mentioned, sin was mentioned only once and not explained, no mention of repentance, etc.. I have tried to reason with the pastor(s) before but it fell on deaf ears so I have given up with them.

After the service however I found a Deacon whom loves to evangelize and thinks very much of Chic Cartoon tracts as thats the only tract that he uses. Chic Cartoon tracts are heavy on preaching Fire & Brimstone, sin, and they do emphasize repentance from sin. Although an Arminian soteriology, at least a far more Biblical approach. NOT INTERESTED IN A DEBATE ON CHIC TRACTS thanks. I asked the deacon how he could use Chic Tracts and at the same time stomach the easy-believism message preached every week at the church, and he broke down and said the church is dead wrong in their alter call evangelism, and several other areas. He said they are way way way too soft in their evangelism, and even he has complained numerous times, but his complaints likewise also fell on deaf ears.

Friends if you attend an easy-believism church I suggest you get out if you have the choice to do so. Perhaps the church down the road does not preach expositionally but they have a strong understanding of soteriology, I would go there regardless of their preaching style. I realize some pastors are topical in their preaching (John Piper) but if they understand soteriology thats where you need to be at.
 

Inspector Javert

Active Member
Was listening to the pastor today, and while I take no issue with the churches commitment to expository preaching, Biblical Creationism, and Nouthetic biblical counseling, they seem to really bomb it with soteriology. For example once again like every service he gave an alter call,
Altar Calls are not un-Biblical nor inherently wrong. You may prefer it as a method or you may not. But they are hardly "wrong".
and once again all one had to do to become a christian was to pray a prayer, and come forward.
I would bet a million dollars that is absolutely not what is believed or taught.
Try an experiment:
Go ask the Senior Pastor right now in precisely those words this question:
"Do you believe that to become a Christian all one must do is 'come forward' in an altar call and say a prayer?"

Ask him that.

He will say unequivocally that, no, that is not what he or the Church believes.
You are suggesting they do.
You are most likely misrepresenting them.
Hell was not mentioned,
Jesus did not mention Hell to Nicodemas
Philip did not mention Hell to the Ethiopian Eunuch
Isaiah chapter 53 which Philip expounded to the Ethiopian Eunuch does not mention Hell.
Peter's Sermon on Pentecost in Acts chapter 2 does not threaten people with "hell" or Eternal torment.

Please explain why Jesus Isaiah and two Apostles were inadequate preachers of the gospel in your opinion.
sin was mentioned only once
Exactly how many times must it be mentioned?
3......5......6.?
and not explained,
I don't always "explain" what sin is if there is every reason to believe that your audience is well aware of what the term means. Most people do.
no mention of repentance,
What did Philip tell the Eunuch he must do to be Baptized?
(Answer found in Acts 8: 36, 37)
I have tried to reason with the pastor(s) before but it fell on deaf ears so I have given up with them.
You may do them the further service of ceasing to badger them and hold them in derision, and blast them on the internet and begin attending a church which gives you the warm-fuzzies you want. That's the advice you gave everyone else here....Why not follow it yourself?

Few things are more sickening than reading a fellow believer constantly trash-mouthing the Pastors and Church-members he is associated with.
It's nauseating.

And you complain that they won't let you teach????? :BangHead:
Friends if you attend an easy-believism church I suggest you get out if you have the choice to do so.
"Believing" (as the Scriptures use it) is not, and never has been "easy" for the un-saved man.
If the term "Easy-believism" isn't an oxymoron to you, than you don't quite get how difficult it is for an un-saved person to give up reliance on self and get beyond their own pride and trust Christ with their Eternal Souls.
Ask Bart Ehrman or Christopher Hitchens how "easy" it would be for them to believe in and trust in Christ for their souls....go ahead.

You are a self-professed Calvinist and likely have I Cor 2:14 monogramed on your coffee mug and yet you would call genuinely letting go of ones own self-sufficiency and trusting in the shed blood of Christ exclusively "easy".
It's not.
 
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JamesL

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
I like the Inspector's take.

Easy Believism and Easy Prayerism are not the same thing at all. Anyone who thinks "believe" involves words, doesn't understand what BELIEVE means.

I wholeheartedly embrace Easy Believism, and have nothing but disdain for Easy Prayerism.
The two are mutually exclusive

As for believing upon Christ, laying aside all confidence in my own self, my actions, my efforts...
That was the most difficult thing I've ever encountered.
 

wpe3bql

Member
Somewhat related to "easy believism" is that of the overly-extended "Invitation" (".....We're gonna sing 'Just As I Am" until somebody comes forward!!!.....")!

I was in the audience of one evangelist's program who may not have used the exact same tactic as I mentioned, but it had the same effect on me (and this was about 45 years ago!).

His line went something like:

"Now folks, I'm not going to drag out this invitation. I'll merely state the fact that Peter denied the Lord three times.

We're only going to sing a hymn three times.

If the Spirit doesn't move you to come forward after the third verse, then both you and I know exactly what your relationship with Jesus is!"
 
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Rippon

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
an alter call,
It's an altar call. And no, I don't believe such a thing. It should not even be called that.
After the service however I found a Deacon whom loves to evangelize
What's with you evan? Do you have an aversion to the word who?
Chic Cartoon tracts
Chic Cartoon
CHIC TRACTS
I asked the deacon how he could use Chic Tracts
They're called Chick Tracts. Jack Chick just turned 91 in April.
 

quantumfaith

Active Member
Altar Calls are not un-Biblical nor inherently wrong. You may prefer it as a method or you may not. But they are hardly "wrong".

I would bet a million dollars that is absolutely not what is believed or taught.
Try an experiment:
Go ask the Senior Pastor right now in precisely those words this question:
"Do you believe that to become a Christian all one must do is 'come forward' in an altar call and say a prayer?"

Ask him that.

He will say unequivocally that, no, that is not what he or the Church believes.
You are suggesting they do.
You are most likely misrepresenting them.

Jesus did not mention Hell to Nicodemas
Philip did not mention Hell to the Ethiopian Eunuch
Isaiah chapter 53 which Philip expounded to the Ethiopian Eunuch does not mention Hell.
Peter's Sermon on Pentecost in Acts chapter 2 does not threaten people with "hell" or Eternal torment.

Please explain why Jesus Isaiah and two Apostles were inadequate preachers of the gospel in your opinion.

Exactly how many times must it be mentioned?
3......5......6.?

I don't always "explain" what sin is if there is every reason to believe that your audience is well aware of what the term means. Most people do.

What did Philip tell the Eunuch he must do to be Baptized?
(Answer found in Acts 8: 36, 37)

You may do them the further service of ceasing to badger them and hold them in derision, and blast them on the internet and begin attending a church which gives you the warm-fuzzies you want. That's the advice you gave everyone else here....Why not follow it yourself?

Few things are more sickening than reading a fellow believer constantly trash-mouthing the Pastors and Church-members he is associated with.
It's nauseating.

And you complain that they won't let you teach????? :BangHead:

"Believing" (as the Scriptures use it) is not, and never has been "easy" for the un-saved man.
If the term "Easy-believism" isn't an oxymoron to you, than you don't quite get how difficult it is for an un-saved person to give up reliance on self and get beyond their own pride and trust Christ with their Eternal Souls.
Ask Bart Ehrman or Christopher Hitchens how "easy" it would be for them to believe in and trust in Christ for their souls....go ahead.

You are a self-professed Calvinist and likely have I Cor 2:14 monogramed on your coffee mug and yet you would call genuinely letting go of ones own self-sufficiency and trusting in the shed blood of Christ exclusively "easy".
It's not.

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:

Kudos Inspector!!!!!

I am looking out for the following:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uV09LQduwSI
 

InTheLight

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:

Kudos Inspector!!!!!

I am looking out for the following:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uV09LQduwSI


t7o19f.jpg
 

Jkdbuck76

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Inspector, thank you for your comments. Rarely have I read something of such awesomeness.

Sent from my KFTT using Tapatalk
 

PreachTony

Active Member
Was listening to the pastor today, and while I take no issue with the churches commitment to expository preaching, Biblical Creationism, and Nouthetic biblical counseling, they seem to really bomb it with soteriology. For example once again like every service he gave an alter call, and once again all one had to do to become a christian was to pray a prayer, and come forward. Hell was not mentioned, sin was mentioned only once and not explained, no mention of repentance, etc.. I have tried to reason with the pastor(s) before but it fell on deaf ears so I have given up with them.
Just how many times do you believe that a preacher should mentions Hell and sin before God can convict a person of their sins? When I was saved, I had heard it preached on before, but the night I was saved there was no preaching at all. It was in Bible School. After class one night, on the way home, I fell under conviction. I asked my Mom to take me back to the church, and everyone had already gone home. We drove over to my grandfather's house. I knelt beside his recliner while he was sitting in it and we all began praying. Before my grandfather had even finished praying I was up hugging my Mom and Grandmother. The prayer didn't save me, but through it I gained peace and assurance of my salvation.

You seem to be saying that I needed to hear about Hell and Sin that very night, otherwise my salvation is not as valid as someone else's. But here's how I view what happened: I had heard the gospel preached several times. When my personal fullness of time came, the Lord convicted me of the sin in my life and called for me to repent, and to accept Him as my savior. I did those things, as He required and commanded. The way I see it, as Paul once wrote, one preacher planted, another preacher watered, but God gave the increase.

After the service however I found a Deacon whom loves to evangelize and thinks very much of Chic Cartoon tracts as thats the only tract that he uses. Chic Cartoon tracts are heavy on preaching Fire & Brimstone, sin, and they do emphasize repentance from sin. Although an Arminian soteriology, at least a far more Biblical approach. NOT INTERESTED IN A DEBATE ON CHIC TRACTS thanks. I asked the deacon how he could use Chic Tracts and at the same time stomach the easy-believism message preached every week at the church, and he broke down and said the church is dead wrong in their alter call evangelism, and several other areas. He said they are way way way too soft in their evangelism, and even he has complained numerous times, but his complaints likewise also fell on deaf ears.
How do you come across so many people who refuse to leave their churches even though they have such staunch disagreements with them?

Guess what, Evan? There is nothing wrong with an altar call. Peter essentially gave one at Pentecost. He told those hearing him to repent, which some spiritually equate to building an altar. The way you describe the altar call at this church seems a bit disingenuous. I've seen a lot of tracts that promote easy-believism, in the guise of repeating a prayer or signing a card. Come to any of the small, sort-of backwoods churches around my area. When they give an altar call, it allows a person to pray, to speak with the Lord, to repent, to work out their own salvation with fear and trembling...

You're acting as though altar calls are just "kneel here and repeat this prayer" and we'll hand you your new Christian membership card. This is not the case.

Friends if you attend an easy-believism church I suggest you get out if you have the choice to do so. Perhaps the church down the road does not preach expositionally but they have a strong understanding of soteriology, I would go there regardless of their preaching style. I realize some pastors are topical in their preaching (John Piper) but if they understand soteriology thats where you need to be at.
Unless things have changed greatly I don't know about it, Evan, then you're not really in any place to tell people to switch churches.
 

matt wade

Well-Known Member
I believe the point that evangelist6589 was trying to make is not that altar calls themselves are inherently bad, but this specific altar call was not handled well.

PreachTony, you said, "You're acting as though altar calls are just "kneel here and repeat this prayer" and we'll hand you your new Christian membership card. This is not the case."

It definitely is the case in some churches. I've seen it. You are specifically told that all you need to do is repeat a prayer and whamo, you are saved.

I agree with evangelist6589 that leaving out the essential information about what a person is being saved FROM is damaging.
 

PreachTony

Active Member
I believe the point that evangelist6589 was trying to make is not that altar calls themselves are inherently bad, but this specific altar call was not handled well.

PreachTony, you said, "You're acting as though altar calls are just "kneel here and repeat this prayer" and we'll hand you your new Christian membership card. This is not the case."

It definitely is the case in some churches. I've seen it. You are specifically told that all you need to do is repeat a prayer and whamo, you are saved.

I agree with evangelist6589 that leaving out the essential information about what a person is being saved FROM is damaging.

Fair points, Matt. I was speaking to the altar calls in the churches I attend. I should not have painted with such a broad brush. Thank you.
 

JamesL

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter

Jordan Kurecki

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
I'd be interested in the book, if not for one statement - evidenced by "changed lives"

Im so sick of that cliche, words are simply inadequate to express my disdain for it.

But i agree that "pray this prayer" is so far from the truth, and, i have grave concerns about the genuineness of any conversion which incorporates outward performance.
You need to read the book to really understand the meaning.

Your missing out by not reading this book.
 

Revmitchell

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Its funny what people get sick of. Not sure what purpose it serves. I guess I'm sick of people always being sick of things.:jesus:
 

JamesL

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Its funny what people get sick of. Not sure what purpose it serves. I guess I'm sick of people always being sick of things.:jesus:

Does that mean you're going to start a faith healing ministry? So you can cure people from being sick of things?
 

JamesL

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
No it means I am going to wash people's feet and have them say a prayer so they can be saved.:tongue3:

I'm telling you, man...the folks at TBN would love to have another guy on board.

Youve already got their empty prayerism down pat, you're halfway there.

Now all you need is an ambiguous specialty like deliverance or healing, and you're all set
 
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