The economy is improving but unemployment . . .

[Martin Luther]

If money is so worthless and gold is so valuable then why do all the advertisers want to trade my money for their gold?

The world was on a gold standard for most of 3000 years during which 90% of the population was working poor and NEVER had any gold. It was only after the gold standard was dumped that the working class got easy access to credit and the middle class exploded in size.

Yeah it's so worthless and has no industrial value yet China just purchased 4000 tons at $1000 per ounce and its price is still listed daily by all news outlets. It is also mentioned numerous times in the bible. Gold is here to stay, it will always be a precious metal and it will always have value.

 

[Martin Luther]

One side note of worth is the fact the many (If not all) of these cash for gold stores popping up everywhere are owned by JP Morgan. Why are they shorting gold to the tune of one year’s production and then buying from the public like never before?? The answer is very clear; gold will soon be heading much higher. The only thing that could be a wet blanket on this party would be if Obama made gold ownership illegal, which is a very good possibility.



The chances of a bank holiday before the end of the fiscal year (Sept 30) grow by the day. It is my belief that we will all soon learn the real value of the American dollar. Be prepared for 25.00 per gallon gas. It won’t stop there either, with devastating blows to our economy; dollar reflation will finish off what’s left and don’t think that the government will stop spending.



Tomorrow promises to be a very interesting day in the market as well. The bond dealers must buy 23 billion in tenure notes one hour before the Fed meeting. Things could be very volatile.

 

[TomVols]

Gold is here to stay. But so are other investments that can either be good or bad. (How does every topic get turned to gold by goldbugs?). Ask the people who lost their shirt on gold in the 90s. Yep, they remember gold.
And for everyone who is so concerned with Biblical fidelity that they buy gold, I query this: How much jasper, onyx, and copper do you own? Do you Forex Denarii? And yes, Gold is mentioned in the news every day. So is Oil, Wheat, cattle futures, et.al.

Societal collaps is another arugment for gold that can be sophistry. During Katrina, did anyone barter for gold in their microeconomy? Of course not. It had no value. But a bottle of water did. Services did. A true economic collapse renders us to a point where tangible goods and services become the new currency. Last year during the storms in Cincinnati, people didn't rush out to buy/sell gold. They traded generators for food, flashlights for water, and the best investment in the word was a handful of Duracells.

As much as Obama is poor economically, I've yet to see one shred of evidence gold is going to be outlawed. He's not THAT stupid.

No chance of a bank holiday due to the greenback. Now, there will be a bank holiday before Sept 30. It's called Labor Day.

Traders are still not giving up on the dollar. Check UUP.

And so much for bond market instability. Now, after October, get back to me after the Fed stops its purchase/repurchase.

I always appreciate people being interested in economics, but a little knowledge helps. Trivia is always better when it's factual. Reality beats fantasy. I'm just sayin.......

LeBuick wrote:

However, how do you feel about all those 401k's that would have completely wiped out? It was the republican's who told us we can better mange our money so get a 401k and forget about social security. Had the banks been allowed to fail, millions of retirees would have had to find work and millions ready to retire would have had to keep working.

I'll answer. SS provides a RROI of somewhere around under 1%. A person with a 401k has more sense than that. If people had their 401k (esp at or in retirement) invested in long-term allocations and then lost their money, I'm sorry...that's stupid and they got what they deserved. No asset allocation model in the world suggests anything else. The people (and I talk to them often) who had their money where they should have, MADE money during this time, or at least conserved ahead of inflationary pressures. So it boils down to basic philosophy. Even people who took their 401k out and put it in the corner bank would beat the RROI offered by Social Security. As noble as people might want to be, you cannot be a nanny for every citizien in this country.

 

[Martin Luther]

Gold is here to stay. But so are other investments that can either be good or bad. (How does every topic get turned to gold by gold bugs?). Ask the people who lost their shirt on gold in the 90s. Yep, they remember gold.

Paper investments are not here to stay; bonds, dollars and the like will be dropped like the plague for real assets including gold.

And for everyone who is so concerned with Biblical fidelity that they buy gold, I query this: How much jasper, onyx, and copper do you own? Do you Forex Denarii? And yes, Gold is mentioned in the news every day. So is Oil, Wheat, cattle futures, et.al.

The modern view on gold is that it has no value as a currency and everyone knows it has almost no industrial applications so then why show its price? They show its price to support the dollar. And to answer your question I have precious stones as well as hundreds of pounds of copper.

Societal collaps (sic) is another arugment (sic)for gold that can be sophistry. During Katrina, did anyone barter for gold in their micro economy? Of course not. It had no value. But a bottle of water did. Services did. A true economic collapse renders us to a point where tangible goods and services become the new currency. Last year during the storms in Cincinnati, people didn't rush out to buy/sell gold. They traded generators for food, flashlights for water, and the best investment in the word was a handful of Duracells.

Obviously people who save gold do it so they can BUY food in a non emergency scenario. Those I know who are "gold bugs" have basements full of food and water. They are survivalist and are prepared for the obvious.

As much as Obama is poor economically, I've yet to see one shred of evidence gold is going to be outlawed. He's not THAT stupid.

It's not a matter of stupidity. He is told what to do by his handlers.

No chance of a bank holiday due to the greenback. Now, there will be a bank holiday before Sept 30. It's called Labor Day.

The dollar is months away from certain death. If the Americans don't pull the plug this fall, then the Chinese will do so early next year.

Traders are still not giving up on the dollar. Check UUP.

When the Fed buys its own debt with printed money the end is not far.

And so much for bond market instability. Now, after October, get back to me after the Fed stops its purchase/repurchase.

I always appreciate people being interested in economics, but a little knowledge helps. Trivia is always better when it's factual. Reality beats fantasy. I'm just sayin.......

I would expect a Christian to have a bit more wisdom than this. It seems you lack the ability to see past the Bloomberg channel and modern economics. I am not a gold bug, but there is wisdom in owning real assets. That includes land, food, precious metals, guns, cars, etc. God says to stay out of debt, what possible reason could you give me to buy an "investment" derived from someone else’s debt? The more I ponder your post the more perturbed I get. It reeks with pride and contention. It is you who is about to get thrashed with "reality" and you don't have long to wait.

 

[TomVols]

The nature of unemployment being a lagging indicator keeps being reinforced. Today's unemployment numbers look worse than market expectations, and retail sales disappointed to boot. The market was caught off guard as Futures traded up significantly ahead of the news.

Back to the first statement: that's assuming that the economy has completely made a full turn towards "recovery" and that unemployment is in its lagging recovery stage. The other option no one's talking about: it's still on the downward cycle.

 

[Martin Luther]

The nature of unemployment being a lagging indicator keeps being reinforced. Today's unemployment numbers look worse than market expectations, and retail sales disappointed to boot. The market was caught off guard as Futures traded up significantly ahead of the news.

An economy cannot be sustained without industry. The myth of a service based economy is disintegrating before us. Banks are still loaded major write downs forth coming and we have yet to see the ramifications of the failing commercial real estate market which will dwarf the subprime mess. Excessive government spending will ensure a global departure from the dollar, a departure already six months underway.

 

[billwald]

50 years ago My Old Man told me that an ounce of gold buys a good man's suit. I buy cheap clothing but suspect that an ounce of gold will NOT buy two very good men's suits. In other words, the price of gold on the average keeps pace with inflation. An asset which generally paces inflation is NOT an investment.

A person who buys metallic gold from the sheisters pays 20% over their selling price thus the sales price has to increase 20% for them to break even. As in Jesus' day, the money is in the money trading business.

 

[Martin Luther]

50 years ago My Old Man told me that an ounce of gold buys a good man's suit. I buy cheap clothing but suspect that an ounce of gold will NOT buy two very good men's suits. In other words, the price of gold on the average keeps pace with inflation. An asset which generally paces inflation is NOT an investment.

A person who buys metallic gold from the sheisters pays 20% over their selling price thus the sales price has to increase 20% for them to break even. As in Jesus' day, the money is in the money trading business.

One fact makes your point null and void, manipulation. Gold should be much higher but it has been illegally shorted to give the appearance that fiat money has value when it does not. Also, since it is about to lose most of that perceived value, gold will be allowed by the banks to run its natural course. The banks like JP Morgan own Cash4Gold, and they have been buying as much gold as they can.

 

[TomVols]

I let the last tripe go by, but this is just too much:

1. There is absolutely no empirical evidence gold is being shorted. None.

2. Even if this did happen, what makes it illegal sandwiched between uptick rules? What SEC ruling is in violation?
3. Cash4Gold is NOT owned by JP Morgan Chase, but is a spinoff of parent company Albar Metals.
4. I've yet to see evidence that banks are buying gold voraciously. What's in it for them? Source?
5. Conspiracy theories are the means the unlearned use to justify their status and remain that way.

In other words, the price of gold on the average keeps pace with inflation. An asset which generally paces inflation is NOT an investment.

The last half of that is true. The first half is questionable. YoY ROI for Gold is a whopping 1.54%. Most elderly CD hawks curse banks when CDs get that low. :laugh:

 

[LeBuick]

http://news.goldseek.com/GoldenJackass/1249628400.php

A government should never steal money under any circumstance.

Stealing is just semantics... I guess you can call any tax you don't want to pay stealing but the problem is we gave them license in our constitution. If you believe our government stretches the powers granted in the constitution I would have to agree. Warrantless wiretaps steps all over the bill of rights and Nixon with his, "if the president does it then it's legal" are just two examples.

 

[billwald]

"Naked" price or money inflation isn't useful to most people. Only thing that should matter to a working class person is how many hours he needs to work to buy the stuff in his normal budget.

For most manufactured goods, people are getting more bells and whistles for less than we had to pay in terms of work hours 40 years ago. Especially tools and kitchen stuff. Clothing is cheaper. These days it is cheaper to buy new finished clothing than to buy the material and make your own. 40 years ago The Wife made the kid's clothing to save money. Now sewing is her amusement.

Since WW2 a small new sedan cost about a half year's pay for a working person but 60 years ago spark plugs lasted 3000 miles, tires and batteries 3 years if you were lucky and careful. Car got maybe 14 MPG.

Houses would cost about the same - maybe 2 years gross pay - if they were the same size on the same lot and the building permits cost the same.

Food is MUCH cheaper. Before WW2 half of our life's energy went into getting food and now it is closer to 5% - and half of what we eat is purchased ready to eat. Half the young people don't know how to cook!