The False Doctrine of a 7-year Tribulation

[Hobie]

There is not one verse in the entire Bible says their a 7-year Tribulation. Some try to claim Daniel 9:24-27 as teaching this, but unless one comes to this passage already having a predisposed bias, they will not find it there. This false idea is not scriptural and no biblical commentator, no theologian, no church in Christendom had ever taught such a doctrine. The doctrine basically did not exist before John Darby, and was promoted through the wide circulation of the Scofield Reference Bible in the early 20th century. The idea or doctrine of a 7-year Tribulation is simply not mentioned in Daniel 9. Here is a great explanation by my buddy palehorse..'There are many theories out there in regards to the 70th Week of the Daniel 9 prophecy. The most prevalent one talks about a 7-year tribulation just prior to Christ's second coming. Many believers in the 7-year Tribulation don't know that this belief is rooted in the Daniel 9 prophecy. In fact, one of the most important verses used to support this idea is Dan 9:27, which we will look at along with the entire prophecy. Also, it is from Dan 9:27 that the belief in "The Antichrist" and the rebuilding of the Jewish Temple on the temple mount comes from. The series of events outlined in this theory is that 1) there will be a secret rapture that takes all true Christians away leaving others behind, 2) then a 7-year tribulation occurs where those who were not taken in the secret rapture will get a chance to "clean up their act" so that when Christ's public appearance happens they can be judged worthy, 3) during the course of the 7-year tribulation the Antichrist will appear, make a covenant with the Jewish nation, then break that covenant in the middle of the 7 years, then hell walk inside the Jewish temple and declare himself to be God. But is this theory biblically accurate? That is just what my essay explores.

First, lets read through the entire prophecy so that we get the whole idea first and then well break it down.

Daniel 9
24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy. 25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times. 26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined. 27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

One thing that must be understood first is the a day for a year rule established in Eze 4:6. For every day that is mentioned in this and all other biblical prophecies they are equal to a prophetic year. There is virtually no debate about this point in Christian circles and well find that the rule holds true in this prophecy.

The Timeframe:
The angel Gabriel starts the prophecy by giving a block of time in verse 24, seventy weeks. Seventy weeks is equal to 490 days, or 490 prophetic years. That is our timeframe for this prophecy from beginning to end.

Verse 25 tells us when this timeframe begins, from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem. When did this occur? See Ezra 7; for this is the command where the rebuilding of Jerusalem was actually accomplished and that command was given by Artaxerxes, king of Persia; which occurred in 457 BC. There were two other kings that made similar commands to rebuild Jerusalem but those proved to not be fruitful.


This is the total 70-week block given by Gabriel in verses 25 & 27:
Block 1: 7 Weeks - (49 years) - Starts in 457 BC

Block 2: 62 Weeks - (434 years) - Starts in 408 BC

Block 3: 1 week - (7 years) - Starts in 27 AD


Lets look closely at the last week/ 7-year block (Block 3); for this is the period of time that many think will be the famous Seven-year Tribulation of the future:

3 ½ Years + 3 ½ Years = 7 years (one week)
o This block starts in 27 AD. What happened in this year? Christ was baptized, anointed, and started His public ministry.
o The "midst of the week" started in 31 AD (3 ½ years later). What happened in this year? Christ was killed on the cross. (New Covenant confirmed.)
o This block ends in 34 AD. What happened in this year? Stephen, the last disciple to the Jews, was stoned by the Sanhedrin and the Gospel went out to the Gentiles.

So we see that this breakdown perfectly follows the prophecy of Daniel 9 and we find that this prophecy was about the coming Messiah (Jesus Christ); history and later books of the Bible verify this.

 

[Hobie]

Why do people want to put this last week of the 70 at the end times? There is no biblical reason to do so and it breaks the block of time Gabriel started the prophecy with. Let's ask some further important questions;

Is the antichrist mentioned anywhere in Daniel 9:24-27? No. The "he" mentioned in verse 27 is Christ, not Antichrist, for Christ is the focus of the whole prophecy. Also, we find that only Christ makes convenants in the Bible. Is there any mention of a rebuilding of the Jewish temple? No. Any mention of sacrifices being restarted? No. Any mention of a covenant being broken? No. In fact verse 27 says the opposite, that the covenant would be confirmed. So why do people believe this ridiculous theory that there will be a 7-year tribulation at the end of the world?

Here are 10 reasons why the 70th week of Daniel 9 was actually fulfilled by Christ about 2,000 years ago:
1. Verse 24 defines Seventy weeks as a single block of time.
2. The 70th week must come after the 69th week; else it cant really be called the 70th week.
3. It is illogical and unbiblical to move the last week of this prophecy to the end of the world.
4. The focus of the prophecy is on the Messiah, not the antichrist. Messiah and Christ means anointed one who was anointed during the last week of the prophecy? Jesus Christ!
5. Verse 27 says a covenant is confirmed in the midst of the week, not broken in the midst of the week. Who creates/confirms covenants in the Bible? Christ only! See Romans 15:8 to see that it was Jesus who confirmed the promises made unto the fathers, not antichrist.
6. Verse 27 says he shall confirm the covenant with many. Compare this to Matthew 26:28.
7. Verse 27 says midst of the week (3 ½ years) the sacrifices would cease. When Christ died the temple veil was rent from top to bottom and the Jewish sacrifices ceased. (see Matt 27:51) This was the mark that signified any further sacrifices were of no effect in the sight of God.
8. Verse 27 says he shall make it desolate. Compare this to Matt 23:38. Who left the temple desolate? Christ!
9. The first 3 ½ years of the 70th week Christ ministered only to the Jews the second 3 ½ years the disciples ministered to the Jews; thus the 70th week is finished at this point, 34 AD, not a future time.
10. The disciple Stephan was stoned to death by the Sanhedrin in 34 AD which caused the Gospel to go to the Gentiles.

Further, check out Christs words in Matthew 18:21. 70x7=490 which is the 490 years of the Daniel 9 prophecy!

The second Jewish temple (Herods temple) was destroyed in 70 AD when Jerusalem was ransacked by the Romans under Prince Titus (see Dan 9:26, youll see a prince shall destroy = Prince Titus). Compare the desolation spoken of in Dan 9:27 to the desolate of Matt 23:38 & Matt 24:13-16. This is the very sign, the destruction of Jerusalem, that Christ was warning the disciples about (see Luke 21:20-22).

Conclusion:
There is no 7-year Tribulation at the end of the world. That teaching comes from a huge mistake resulting in reading much more into a verse than what is actually there. There will be tribulation at the end but it wont be 7 years long for it falls outside of the Daniel 9 prophecy.

 

[Hobie]

So what are the ramifications....This means that there will be no second chance for salvation as many seem to be counting on. The false 7-year tribulation theory undermines the precept of living by faith for even a non-believer would suddenly change his ways after witnessing millions of people all over the world suddenly vanishing in one day.

 

[Hobie]

Here is a good history of this false doctrine and the reasons behind it...
https://secretsunsealed.org/content/PDF_downloads/futurismsincrediblejourney.pdf

 

[Yeshua1]

So what are the ramifications....This means that there will be no second chance for salvation as many seem to be counting on. The false 7-year tribulation theory undermines the precept of living by faith for even a non-believer would suddenly change his ways after witnessing millions of people all over the world suddenly vanishing in one day.

Its not nearly as bad as Ellen White getting Investigative Judgement heresy from misunderstanding Daniel 8:44!

 

[Hobie]

Well, Daniel 8:14 I think is what you meant, a vision Daniel had and has the following:
Daniel 8 King James Version (KJV)
14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.
15 And it came to pass, when I, even I Daniel, had seen the vision, and sought for the meaning, then, behold, there stood before me as the appearance of a man.
16 And I heard a man's voice between the banks of Ulai, which called, and said, Gabriel, make this man to understand the vision.
17 So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision.

Notice what it says, 'or at the time of the end' So the question you have to ask, is does it show when the hour of His judgment on the timeline to the end has arrived. And how does Hebrews 9 show us how the sanctuary is cleanses and by what?

Hebrews 9 King James Version (KJV)
1 Then verily the first covenant had also ordinances of divine service, and a worldly sanctuary.
2 For there was a tabernacle made; the first, wherein was the candlestick, and the table, and the shewbread; which is called the sanctuary.
3 And after the second veil, the tabernacle which is called the Holiest of all;
4 Which had the golden censer, and the ark of the covenant overlaid round about with gold, wherein was the golden pot that had manna, and Aaron's rod that budded, and the tables of the covenant;
5 And over it the cherubims of glory shadowing the mercyseat; of which we cannot now speak particularly.
6 Now when these things were thus ordained, the priests went always into the first tabernacle, accomplishing the service of God.
7 But into the second went the high priest alone once every year, not without blood, which he offered for himself, and for the errors of the people:
8 The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:
9 Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;
10 Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.
11 But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building;
12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
13 For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:
14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.
18 Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood.
19 For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people,
20 Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.
21 Moreover he sprinkled with blood both the tabernacle, and all the vessels of the ministry.
22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
23 It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these.
24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us:
25 Nor yet that he should offer himself often, as the high priest entereth into the holy place every year with blood of others;
26 For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.
27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

The Day of Atonement was a cleansing of the earthly tabernacle and according to the law, there is no cleansing from sin without shedding of blood. This was accomplished by the death of the lamb brought for offering. Without death, there can be no cleansing of sin. But Moses tabernacle was from a pattern he was shown, so what was the tabernacle not made with hands.

Hebrews 8:5

Who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount.

 

[Yeshua1]

Well, Daniel 8:14 I think is what you meant, a vision Daniel had and has the following:
Daniel 8 King James Version (KJV)
14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.
15 And it came to pass, when I, even I Daniel, had seen the vision, and sought for the meaning, then, behold, there stood before me as the appearance of a man.
16 And I heard a man's voice between the banks of Ulai, which called, and said, Gabriel, make this man to understand the vision.
17 So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision.

Notice what it says, 'or at the time of the end' So the question you have to ask, is does it show when the hour of His judgment on the timeline to the end has arrived. And how does Hebrews 9 show us how the sanctuary is cleanses and by what?

Hebrews 9 King James Version (KJV)
1 Then verily the first covenant had also ordinances of divine service, and a worldly sanctuary.
2 For there was a tabernacle made; the first, wherein was the candlestick, and the table, and the shewbread; which is called the sanctuary.
3 And after the second veil, the tabernacle which is called the Holiest of all;
4 Which had the golden censer, and the ark of the covenant overlaid round about with gold, wherein was the golden pot that had manna, and Aaron's rod that budded, and the tables of the covenant;
5 And over it the cherubims of glory shadowing the mercyseat; of which we cannot now speak particularly.
6 Now when these things were thus ordained, the priests went always into the first tabernacle, accomplishing the service of God.
7 But into the second went the high priest alone once every year, not without blood, which he offered for himself, and for the errors of the people:
8 The Holy Ghost this signifying, that the way into the holiest of all was not yet made manifest, while as the first tabernacle was yet standing:
9 Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;
10 Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.
11 But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building;
12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us.
13 For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh:
14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?
15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.
16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.
17 For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.
18 Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood.
19 For when Moses had spoken every precept to all the people according to the law, he took the blood of calves and of goats, with water, and scarlet wool, and hyssop, and sprinkled both the book, and all the people,
20 Saying, This is the blood of the testament which God hath enjoined unto you.
21 Moreover he sprinkled with blood both the tabernacle, and all the vessels of the ministry.
22 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission.
23 It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these.
24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us:
25 Nor yet that he should offer himself often, as the high priest entereth into the holy place every year with blood of others;
26 For then must he often have suffered since the foundation of the world: but now once in the end of the world hath he appeared to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.
27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

The Day of Atonement was a cleansing of the earthly tabernacle and according to the law, there is no cleansing from sin without shedding of blood. This was accomplished by the death of the lamb brought for offering. Without death, there can be no cleansing of sin. But Moses tabernacle was from a pattern he was shown, so what was the tabernacle not made with hands.

Hebrews 8:5

Who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount.

How about false doctrines of Ellen White?

 

[robycop3]

Hobie, are you adding preterism to your collection of false doctrines?

There are many prophesied eschatological events that simply have not yet occurred ! And the great trib is one of them.

Rev. 3:10 says it'll come upon THE WHOLE WORLD, and that simply hasn't yet happened. And JESUS said that if it wasn't cut short, no flesh (man or animal) would survive. Jesus also said it'd be the WORST DISASTERS IN MAN'S HISTORY. Looking at its plagues in Rev, we can see why, with everything from huge earthquakes, pollution of most water, pollution of the atmosphere that obscures most natural light, and a hail of rocks, to name a few.

The main events of that last 7 years will be:
The "beast" & his sidekick, the false prophet, coming to power.
The beast's committing the AOD, proclaiming himself God.
The Gog-magog war.
The mark of the beast, likely an implanted microchip.
The great trib, with trib saints being created by Jesus.
The physical return of Jesus.

It's all in your Bible, if you care to study & BELIEVE it. Your guru, EGW, tried to ADD to Scripture, making up stuff that's not even hinted at in Scripture.

 

[Yeshua1]

Hobie, are you adding preterism to your collection of false doctrines?

There are many prophesied eschatological events that simply have not yet occurred ! And the great trib is one of them.

Rev. 3:10 says it'll come upon THE WHOLE WORLD, and that simply hasn't yet happened. And JESUS said that if it wasn't cut short, no flesh (man or animal) would survive. Jesus also said it'd be the WORST DISASTERS IN MAN'S HISTORY. Looking at its plagues in Rev, we can see why, with everything from huge earthquakes, pollution of most water, pollution of the atmosphere that obscures most natural light, and a hail of rocks, to name a few.

The main events of that last 7 years will be:
The "beast" & his sidekick, the false prophet, coming to power.
The beast's committing the AOD, proclaiming himself God.
The Gog-magog war.
The mark of the beast, likely an implanted microchip.
The great trib, with trib saints being created by Jesus.
The physical return of Jesus.

It's all in your Bible, if you care to study & BELIEVE it. Your guru, EGW, tried to ADD to Scripture, making up stuff that's not even hinted at in Scripture.

His Sda built on twin pillars of Sabbath Day for Church, and Investigative Judgement, both heresy, and so his church falls apart!

 

[Hobie]

Hobie, are you adding preterism to your collection of false doctrines?

There are many prophesied eschatological events that simply have not yet occurred ! And the great trib is one of them.

Rev. 3:10 says it'll come upon THE WHOLE WORLD, and that simply hasn't yet happened. And JESUS said that if it wasn't cut short, no flesh (man or animal) would survive. Jesus also said it'd be the WORST DISASTERS IN MAN'S HISTORY. Looking at its plagues in Rev, we can see why, with everything from huge earthquakes, pollution of most water, pollution of the atmosphere that obscures most natural light, and a hail of rocks, to name a few.

The main events of that last 7 years will be:
The "beast" & his sidekick, the false prophet, coming to power.
The beast's committing the AOD, proclaiming himself God.
The Gog-magog war.
The mark of the beast, likely an implanted microchip.
The great trib, with trib saints being created by Jesus.
The physical return of Jesus.

It's all in your Bible, if you care to study & BELIEVE it. Your guru, EGW, tried to ADD to Scripture, making up stuff that's not even hinted at in Scripture.

Lets look at the false doctrines of the Futurist and Preterist interpretation. Here is from Wikipedia where I am a editor and it is straightforward:

'One of the most influential aspects of the early Protestant historicist paradigm was the assertion that scriptural identifiers of the Antichrist where matched only by the institution of the Papacy. Particular significance and concern were the Papal claims of authority over both the Church, through Apostolic succession, and the State, through the Divine right of Kings. When the Papacy aspires to exercise authority beyond its religious realm into civil affairs, on account of the Papal claim to be the Vicar of Christ, then the institution was fulfilling the more perilous biblical indicators of the Antichrist. Martin Luther wrote this view, which was not novel, into the Smalcald Articles of 1537. It was then widely popularized in the 16th century, via sermons, drama, books, and broadside publication. The alternate methods of prophetic interpretation, Futurism and Preterism were derived from Jesuit writings, whose counter reformation efforts were aimed at opposing this interpretation that the Antichrist was the Papacy or the power of the Roman Catholic Church

Protestant Reformers, including John Wycliffe, Martin Luther, John Calvin, Thomas Cranmer, John Thomas, John Knox, Roger Williams, Cotton Mather, Jonathan Edwards, and John Wesley, as well as most Protestants of the 16th–18th centuries, felt that the Early Church had been led into the Great Apostasy by the Papacy and identified the Pope with the Antichrist. The Centuriators of Magdeburg, a group of Lutheran scholars in Magdeburg headed by Matthias Flacius, wrote the 12-volume Magdeburg Centuries to discredit the Catholic Church and lead other Christians to recognize the Pope as the Antichrist. So, rather than expecting a single Antichrist to rule the earth during a future Tribulation period, Martin Luther, John Calvin, and other Protestant Reformers saw the Antichrist as a present feature in the world of their time, fulfilled in the Papacy. '

Now in order to counter this view that the papacy was the Antichrist power it the church turned to the Jesuits who were summoned to counter the reformers' teachings, and here two Jesuit scholars stand out in particular. They are Ribera and Alcasar, and they developed the Futurist and Preterist systems of prophetic interpretation.

Spanish Jesuit Francisco Ribera published a commentary on the book of Revelation which proposed that the bulk of the prophecies would be fulfilled in a brief three-and-one-half-year period at the end of the Christian era. In that short space antichrist (a single individual, according to Ribera) would rebuild the Jerusalem Temple, deny Christ, abolish Christianity, be received by the Jews, pretend to be god, and conquer the world. Thus the Protestant contention that the apocalyptic symbols of antichrist denoted an apostate religious system was countered, and the focus of the prophecies was diverted from the present to the far distant future.

Spanish Jesuit, Luis de Alcazar also published a scholarly work on Revelation, to refute the Protestant Reformation on the Antichrist power. Alcazar's thesis, the opposite of Ribera's, was that all the prophecies of Revelation had been fulfilled in the past, that is, by the fifth and sixth centuries A.D., the early centuries of Christianity. He asserted that this prophetic book simply described a two-fold war by the church-its victory over the Jewish synagogue on the one hand (chaps. 1-11) and Roman paganism on the other (chaps. 12-19). Chapters 21, 22 Alcazar applied to the Roman Catholic Church as the New Jerusalem, glorious and triumphant. His writings were developed into a system of interpretation known as preterism.

Over time these specific systems of counter interpretations of the Antichrist spread and began to penetrate Protestant thought. Preterism was the first; it began to enter Protestantism in the late eighteenth century. Preterist interpretations of the prophecies have today become the standard view of liberal Protestantism.

The ideas of futurism, although refuted at first, eventually spread into Protestantism during the nineteenth century. Futurism, is currently followed in some form by most conservative Protestant bodies. Thus both spectrum of the Protestant denominations has picked up this counter reformation view set about to change the views of the papacy as the Antichrist power that was from the Reformers.

The false doctrine as you can see, basically are to put aside the Reformers view of the Antichrist. Preterist interpretation puts all prophecy pertaining to the Antichrist into the past so it is long gone, and the Futurist interpretation puts them into the future so the papacy could claim it was not this power.

 

[Hobie]

Here is from my old professor, Frank Holbrook:

The real distinctive frame holding together the picture of truth as perceived by Seventh-day Adventists is their understanding of the prophecies of Daniel and Revelation. In these apocalyptic prophecies Adventists have found their times, their identity, and their task.

Seventh-day Adventists arrive at their interpretations of Bible prophecy by employing the principles of the 'historicist school' of prophetic interpretation. This historicist view (also known as the 'continuous historical' view) sees the prophecies of Daniel and Revelation unfolding at various points in historical time, often encompassing the sweep of history from the times of Daniel and John (the human authors of these books) to the establishment of God's eternal kingdom.

A biblical illustration of this unrolling of the prophetic scroll along the continuum of human history is the prophetic dream given to the Neo-Babylonian king Nebuchadnezzar and its interpretation by the prophet Daniel (see Dan. 2:31-45). In his dream the king saw an image of a man composed of various metals of descending values: golden head, silver chest and arms, bronze belly and thighs, iron legs, feet and toes made of iron and clay. The dream concluded with a large stone, mysteriously quarried without human assistance from the side of a mountain, that fell with devastating force upon the statue, smashing it to pieces. As the wind blew these metallic elements away 'like the chaff of the summer threshing floors,' the stone 'became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth' (Dan. 2:35).

Daniel clearly identified the golden head as symbolizing the empire of Babylon under Nebuchadnezzar (vss. 37, 38). It was to be followed by three successive world kingdoms corresponding to the three different metals. History records that these were Medo-Persia, Grecia, and the 'iron monarchy' of Rome. In the latter part of the fifth century A.D. the empire of Rome in the West was fully broken up. Its parts came to form the nations of Western Europe-symbolized by the strengths and weaknesses of the feet and toes composed of iron and clay. The 'stone,' which will ultimately destroy these and all other human, political entities, is the eternal kingdom that 'the God of heaven will set up' at the end of human history (see vss. 44, 45, RSV).*

Thus the historicist system of interpretation sees in the apocalyptic prophecies of Daniel and Revelation the hand of Divine Providence moving across the ages, overruling events to bring about the fulfillment of God's purposes.

Jesus, our Lord, saw a similar unrolling of the prophetic scroll in Daniel 9:24-27, part of a much longer prophecy given to Daniel by the angel Gabriel in the early years of the Medo-Persian empire. In this portion, several important predictions were made. A period of 'seventy weeks' was to be allotted to Israel subsequent to their release from Babylonian captivity. On the principle that in apocalyptic prophecy a symbolic 'day' equals a literal year, this period translates into 490 years (70 weeks of seven days each equals 490 days, or 490 actual years). Near the close of this time the long-awaited Messiah would appear. This could and should have been Israel's finest hour when the Saviour of the world would 'make an end of sins,' would 'make reconciliation for iniquity,' and would 'bring in everlasting righteousness' (vs. 24).

But there was a shadow-a dark side to the prophetic picture. It implied a rejection of the Messiah, who would 'be cut off, but not for himself.' Tragic retribution would follow in the destruction of both Jerusalem and its Temple (vs. 26).

The Messianic aspects of this prophecy met their respective fulfillments in the life, ministry, and atoning death of Jesus Christ. But the destruction of the city and the Temple were still future events when the Saviour gave His important discourse on Olivet two days prior to His passion (see Matt. 24). On the basis of the prophecy recorded in Daniel 9, our Lord pointed to the impending national ruin (see Matt. 24:15; cf. chap. 24:1, 2; Luke 21:20-24), which met a fiery fulfillment by Roman arms about forty years later, in A.D. 70.

Daniel 9:26, to which Jesus alluded, is a part of a much larger vision occupying chapters 8 and 9 of Daniel's book and symbolizing events that extend from Persian times to the onset of God's final judgment (see chap. 8:13, 14). Here again is another striking example of the historicist perspective of apocalyptic prophecy that serves to confirm and to strengthen faith in God's leading across the centuries through all the play and counterplay of satanic opposition and human pride and ambition.https://sites.google.com/site/quotesofegw/daniel-revelation

 

[Hobie]

Here is good overview on it....
"There are... three major "prophetic schools" of interpretation... - Preterism, Historicism, and Futurism. Each of these schools view the prophecies of Daniel and Revelation differently...

One of the most well-respected Bible Commentators in the history of Christianity was England's well-beloved, E.B. Elliott. In 1862, the 5th edition of his classic four-volume Horae Apocalypticae - A Commentary on the Apocalypse, was published in London. The great Baptist preacher Charles Spurgeon, in his Comments on the Commentaries, considered Elliott's work "the standard.".... Elliott clearly reveals the three major contending schools of prophetic interpretation.

"For, in conclusion, the readers of this Historic Sketch will see that there are but three grand Schemes of Apocalyptic Interpretation that can be considered as standing up face to face against each other...

The 1st is that of the Praeterists; respecting the subject of prophecy, except in its two or three last chapters [of Revelation], to the catastrophes of the Jewish nation and old Roman Empire ... which Scheme, originally propounded, as we saw, by the Jesuit Alcasar, and then adopted by Grotius ... by Professor Moses Stuart in the United States of America, and by disciples in the German School in England ...

"The 2nd is the Futurist Scheme; making the whole of the Apocalyptic Prophecy, (excepting perhaps the primary Vision and Letters to the Seven Churches,) to relate to things now future, viz. the things concerning Christ's second Advent: a Scheme first set forth, [as] we saw, by the Jesuit [Francisco] Ribera, at the end of the 16th century; and which in its main principle has been urged alike by Dr. S.R. Maitland, Mr. Burgh, the Oxford Tractator on Antichrist, and others, in our own times and era, not without considerable success ...

"The 3rd is what we may call emphatically the Protestant continuous Historic Scheme of Interpretation; that which regards the Apocalypse as a prefiguration in detail of the chief events affecting the Church and Christendom, whether secular or ecclesiastical, from St. John's time to the consummation: - a Scheme which, in regard of its particular application of the symbols of Babylon and the Beast to Papal Rome and Popedom, was early embraced, as we saw, by the Waldenses, Wickliffites, and Hussites; then adopted with fuller light by the chief [Protestant] reformers, German, Swiss, French and English, of the 16th century; and transmitted downwards uninterruptedly, even to the present time. "It is the last of which [the Protestant Historicist School] which I embrace for my own part with a full and ever strengthening conviction of its truth." Horae, Vol. 4, pps. 562, 563.

Thus Elliott identifies:
1) The Preterist School which sees most of the prophecies being fulfilled in the past in the events surrounding the destruction of Jerusalem and the pagan Roman Empire;
2) The Futurist School which sees most of the prophecies in Revelation - from chapter 4 onward - as applying to events yet future;...
3) The Historicist School which sees the book of Revelation as largely predictive of actual events to occur throughout the history of Christianty from the time of John until the return of Jesus Christ.

The Historicist School contained the viewpoint of almost all Protestant Reformers from the Reformation into the 19th century. Elliot also shows clearly through historical research that both the Preterist and Futurist schools were definitely put forth by Jesuit scholars in their earnest attempts to divert the unanimous Protestant application of Daniel's "little horn" prophecy and Revelation's "beast" prediction to the rise and work of Papal Rome...."excerpts from End Time Delusions by Steve Wohlberg.
Preterism, Historicism, Futurism Explained | White Horse Media

 

[robycop3]

I believe the events of history, and proper exegesis of Scripture proves that the eschatological events are still future. There's been NO "manof sin/antichrist/beast" who will rule most of the world yet, NO marka the beast, NO worldwide great trib, and certainly NO physical, visible return of Jesus in like manner as He left, seen by all. But all those things, and more, are clearly prophesied in Scripture. "Scholars" may discuss back-n-forth about what they THINK those Scriptures mean, but they speak for themselves; no "deep thinking" needed. We see others of Jesus' prophecies given at the same time have literally come to pass, such as the destruction of J & the temple, so why don't people believe the others won't come to pass JUST-AS-LITERALLY ?

 

[Hobie]

I believe the events of history, and proper exegesis of Scripture proves that the eschatological events are still future. There's been NO "manof sin/antichrist/beast" who will rule most of the world yet, NO marka the beast, NO worldwide great trib, and certainly NO physical, visible return of Jesus in like manner as He left, seen by all. But all those things, and more, are clearly prophesied in Scripture. "Scholars" may discuss back-n-forth about what they THINK those Scriptures mean, but they speak for themselves; no "deep thinking" needed. We see others of Jesus' prophecies given at the same time have literally come to pass, such as the destruction of J & the temple, so why don't people believe the others won't come to pass JUST-AS-LITERALLY ?

Need to read this...
"the following points will reveal the failure of Futurism:

1. It doesn’t make sense that God would pass over 2000 years of Christian history in His prophecies, especially since the foundation prophecy of Daniel 2 reveals a straightforward historical succession from the days of Babylon all the way down to the end of time.[su_spacer]
2. A little historical research will reveal that the majority of Christian commentators on the book of Revelation down throughout Christian history have definitely seen the Church as being on earth from Revelation 4-20.
3. Revelation 4:1 does not describe the Rapture of the Church. It simply portrays John alone being taken up to heaven in a vision. Calling this “the Rapture” is really stretching it! John did not actually go to heaven in 4:1. His toes were still on Patmos.
4. Although the word “Church” is not used in Revelation 4-21, there are many prophecies and statements that clearly reveal that the Church is in fact on earth during those times.
5. The White Horse of the First Seal (Revelation 6:2): Although there are differences in the application of this symbol, a very large number have taken the same view as Pareus in his commentary (published in 1615). Elliott says, “In the four first seals he [Pareus] makes the horse the Church, Christ being its rider: – first white, with reference to its primitive purity; chiefly for the first 200 or 300 years: next red, with reference to its persecutions and blood-shedding of martyrs by the Pagan emperors …” (Horae, Vol. 4, p. 474).
6. The Fifth Trumpet (Revelation 9:4) does not hurt those who have “the seal of God on their foreheads.” This has often been applied to historical Christians in God’s Church.
7. The Time of the Sounding of the Seventh Angel (Revelation 10:7): During this time, “the mystery of God [will] be finished.” This “mystery of God” involves the preaching of Jesus Christ by His Church (Eph. 3:9, 10; Col. 4:3) and the fullness of Christ in the hearts of His people (Col. 1:26,27).
8. The Pure Woman (Revelation 12:1, 6, 13, 17): Paul describes Christ’s Church as a “chaste virgin” (2 Cor. 11:2) and as a “her” (Eph. 5:25). So does John in Revelation 19 which refers to Christ’s “saints” as “His wife” (19:7, 8).
9. The Faithful and Persecuted Saints against the Beast (Revelation 13, 14): The Beast makes “war with the saints” (13:7). “Here is the patience and faith of the saints” (13:10). “Here is the patience of the saints: Here are they who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus” (14:12). Who are these “saints”? Paul speaks of “all the churches of the saints” (1 Cor. 14:33). Thus wherever the saints are, there is Christ’s Church.
10. The Three Angel Messengers (Revelation 14:6-12, 14): Three final messages are represented as being given by angels right before the second coming of Jesus Christ. The first angel has the “everlasting gospel” to “preach” to all the world (14:6, KJV). This doesn’t mean that literal angels will shout from the skies. Not at all. Rather, these angels represent messages being given by Christ’s Church. It is the Church that is to “preach” the gospel to all the world before the end comes. Mat. 24:14.
11. The Faithful Garment-Keepers before Armageddon (Revelation 16:15, 16): Right before Armageddon, Jesus says, “Behold, I come as a thief, blessed is he that watches, and keeps his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame … Armageddon.” It is faithful Christians in Christ’s Church who hold onto the garments of His righteousness before the end.
12. The Martyrs (Revelation 6:9; 12:11; 17:6): Mystery Babylon is drunk with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus Christ. These martyrs are faithful Christians in God’s Church throughout history who have died for the truth of Christ.
13. The Called-Out ones (Revelation 18:4): Before the final plagues fall (vs. 8), Jesus says, “Come out of her, my people …” His people are His saints in His Church who have become trapped inside of spiritual Babylon.
14. The Voice of the Bride (Revelation 18:23): Jesus pleads through His bride (His Church) to His “other sheep” (John 10:16) who are yet trapped inside the deceptions of Mystery Babylon – before it’s too late.
15. His Bride (Revelation 19:7, 8): Before Jesus returns, His wife makes “herself ready.” This refers to Christ’s Church.
16. Martyrs who resist the Beast (Revelation 20:4): Many are killed for “their witness to Jesus and for the word of God.” During Earth’s final crisis, true Christians in Christ’s Church refuse to bow to the Beast, the Image, and the Mark – even until death.

Futurism views all of the above passages as applying only to the “tribulation saints” who are forced to face a future one-man Antichrist after the Rapture. Yet this view ignores over a thousand years of Christian history and bloodshed during which faithful martyrs in the Church of Jesus Christ stood up against the real Beast and Harlot of Babylon."...The Failure of Futurism | White Horse Media

 

[Revmitchell]

So who is it that sees Revelation 4 as being the rapture of the church?

 

[robycop3]

No sensible person argues that the Church isn't on earth, but JESUS is not physically here. (He comes SPIRITUALLY wherever/whenever 2 or more are gathered in His name, as He said.)
Yes, there have been Christian martyrs almost from the time Jesus began His earthly ministry, with John The Baptist being an early one, same as the pre-Christian martyrs were. And there'll be trib martyrs, as the antichrist's forces will kill anyone they find not worshipping that man or his image.

And the RCC is portrayed as a harlot in Rev. 17. It's NOT the beast; the harlot rides(controls) the beast for a time, til the beast turns on her. And rev. 17:18 clearly defines that harlot as the city of Rome, Italy, now the seat of the Vatican. There should be no question there, as, at that time, Rome was that great city that reigned ober the kings of the earth, something that continued after the Roman empire as the RCC gained power. While Rome's political power waned, its RELIGIOUS power grew. Remember, that org is called "ROMAN Catholic" !

The antichrist will be the greatest persecutor of Christians ever, as he will have both Satan's power and the most-modern tech behind him. Christians will have it tough, as they can't buy or sell, or likely, even hold a job, plus, the forces & agents of the beast will be trying to discover & kill them. But God won't let them all be wiped out.

And besides the beast's agents, the great trib will be upon them, killing them, as well as their human enemies. But again, God won't allow them all to be killed. Those who will be killed will be considered by God to be martyrs, same as the earlier martyrs.

 

[robycop3]

So who is it that sees Revelation 4 as being the rapture of the church?

I certainly don't. I believe John was taken in the spirit to the vicinity of God's throne, and while he didn't see God's face (as no mortal man may see His face & live) he saw His throne & those spiritual beings who serve Him from His presence. Certainly, it wasn't the "rapture".

 

[Hobie]

Well all I can tell you is the RCC tried to hide what the Reformation clearly held and brought out. Here is even more I came across on this...

"Jesuits Introduce Futurist Counterinterpretation
For some time following the launching of the Reformation, Roman Catholic leadership carefully avoided exposition of the prophecies of Daniel and the Apocalypse. They seemed unable to parry the force of the incriminating Protestant applications of the prophecies concerning Antichrist, which were undermining the very foundations of the Catholic position. Upon the first outbreak of Luther's antipapal protest two Catholic doctors, Prierias and Eck, in the true spirit of the Fifth Lateran Council (1512-1517), had boldly reasserted the Lateran theory and declared the papal dominion to be Daniel's fifth monarchy, or reign of the saints, and identified the existing Roman church with the New Jerusalem.

But the reformers, with declarations by pen and voice, forcefully stated that the Papacy was the specified Antichrist of prophecy. The symbols of Daniel, Paul, and John were applied with tremendous effect. Hundreds of books and tracts impressed their contention upon the consciousness of Europe. Indeed it gained so great a hold upon the minds of men that Rome, in alarm, saw that she must successfully counteract this identification of Antichrist with the Papacy, or lose the battle. The Jesuits were summoned to aid in the extremity, and cleverly provided the very method needed both for defense and for attack.

From the ranks of the Jesuits two stalwarts arose, determined to lift the stigma from the Papacy by locating Antichrist at some point where he could not be applied to the Roman church. It was clearly a crisis of major proportions.

Two Conflicting Alternatives Brought Forth
Rome’s answer to the Protestant Reformation was twofold, though actually conflicting and contradictory. Through the Jesuits Ribera, of Salamanca, Spain, and Bellarmine, of Rome, the Papacy put forth her futurist interpretation. Almost simultaneously Alcazar, Spanish Jesuit of Seville, advanced the conflicting preterist interpretation. These were designed to meet and overwhelm the Historical interpretation of the Protestants. Though mutually exclusive, either Jesuit alternative suited the great objective equally well, as both thrust aside the application of the prophecies from the existing Church of Rome. The one (preterism) accomplished it by making prophecy stop altogether short of papal Rome's career. The other (futurism) achieved it by making it overleap the immense era of papal dominance, crowding Antichrist into a small fragment of time in the still distant future, just before the great consummation. It is consequently often called the gap theory.

According to the Protestants, the vision of Babylon and the supporting Beast is divinely interpreted in chapter 17 of the Apocalypse. It was on this that the Reformers commonly rested their case—the apostate woman, the Roman church; the city, seven-hilled Rome; the many waters, the many peoples; the Beast, the fourth, or Roman beast of Daniel; the sixth head, the Caesars; and the seventh, the popes.

Roman Catholics as well as Protestants agree as to the origin of these interpretations. The Roman Catholic writer G.S. Hitchcock says:

• “The Futurist School, founded by the Jesuit Ribera in 1591, looks for Antichrist, Babylon, and a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem, at the end of the Christian dispensation.
• “The Praeterist School, founded by the Jesuit Alcasar in 1614, explains the Revelation by the Fall of Jerusalem, or by the fall of Pagan Rome in 410 A.D.” (G.S. Hitchcock, The Beasts and the Little Horn, p. 7.)

Similarly, Dean Henry Alford (Protestant), in the "Prolegomena" to his Greek Testament, declares:

• “The founder of this system [Futurist] in modern times…appears to have been the Jesuit Ribera, about A.D. 1580." (Henry Alford, The New Testament for English Readers, vol. 2, part 2, p. 351 [bottom numbering].)
• “The Praeterist view found no favour, and was hardly so much as thought of , in the times of primitive Christianity. … The View is said to have been first promulgated in anything like completeness by the Jesuit Alcasar … in 1614.” (Ibid, pp. 348, 349 [bottom numbering].)

Francisco Ribera (1537-1591)

About 1590 Ribera published a 500-page commentary on the Apocalypse, denying the Protestant application of Antichrist to the Church of Rome. Ribera’s death at fifty-four halted the preparation of further commentaries. Those that were printed passed through several revised editions—at Salamanca about 1590, Lyons and Antwerp in 1593, Douay in 1612, and Antwerp in 1603 and 1623.

Since its inception his basic thesis has been virtually unchanged. He assigned the first few chapters of the Apocalypse to ancient Rome, in John’s own time; the rest he restricted to a literal three and a half year’s reign of an infidel Antichrist, who would bitterly oppose and blaspheme the saints just before the second advent. He taught that antichrist would be a single individual, who would rebuild the temple in Jerusalem, abolish Christian religion, deny Christ, be received by the Jews, pretend to be God, and conquer the world—all in this brief space of three and one half years!

• Places Antichrist’s coming at the close of the seals
• Places trumpets under the seventh seal
• Death of the witness is literal time
• Antichrist's persecutions last three and one half years
• Judgements upon Rome for ultimate apostasy—in Revelation 17 Ribera admits the woman to be not only pagan Rome but also Rome Christian after a future falling away from the pope. (Francisco Ribera, Sacram Beati Ioannis … Apocalypsin Commentarij, chap. 14, pp. 282, 283).
• Repudiates Augustinian earthly millennium
• Antichrist’s reign counted by literal days
• Babylon is Rome past and future, not present

Robert Bellarmine (1542-1621), focused his attack on the year-day principle.

• Capitalized on Luther’s hesitation over Apocalypse
• Main assault centered on year-day application
• Assigns symbols to past and future, thereby eliminating application to the long papal ascendancy of the Middle Ages.
• Exploits variations on time of the Antichrist

The heart of Bellarmine’s thesis was both clever and plausible, though deceptive. (1) Antichrist is an individual Jew, and not an apostate Christian system. (2) Therefore the length of his exploits must harmonize with the life period of one man—three and one half literal years, and not 1260 years.

Luis de Alcasar (1554-1613), Spanish Jesuit of Seville

• Made the seals the early expansion of apostolic Christianity
• God’s longsuffering, warnings, and punishments were allotted to the Jews
• The trumpets were judgments on fallen Judaism
• The two witnesses—the doctrine and holy lives of the Christians
• After the persecutions Christianity would arise with new glory and convert many Jews
• Revelation was the apostolic church, bringing forth the Roman church
• The first beast of Revelation 13 declared to be the persecuting arrogance of pagan Rome—the second beast, its carnal wisdom
• Revelation 17, the mystical meaning of idolatrous ancient Rome
• Revelation 18, its conversion to the Catholic faith

LeRoy Edwin Froom, The Prophetic faith of Our Fathers, The Historical Development of Prophetic Interpretation, Vol. 2, Review and Herald, Washington, D.C., 1948, excerpted, pp. 464-532.....A History of the Foundation of Futurism and Preterism

 

[Yeshua1]

Well all I can tell you is the RCC tried to hide what the Reformation clearly held and brought out. Here is even more I came across on this...

"Jesuits Introduce Futurist Counterinterpretation
For some time following the launching of the Reformation, Roman Catholic leadership carefully avoided exposition of the prophecies of Daniel and the Apocalypse. They seemed unable to parry the force of the incriminating Protestant applications of the prophecies concerning Antichrist, which were undermining the very foundations of the Catholic position. Upon the first outbreak of Luther's antipapal protest two Catholic doctors, Prierias and Eck, in the true spirit of the Fifth Lateran Council (1512-1517), had boldly reasserted the Lateran theory and declared the papal dominion to be Daniel's fifth monarchy, or reign of the saints, and identified the existing Roman church with the New Jerusalem.

But the reformers, with declarations by pen and voice, forcefully stated that the Papacy was the specified Antichrist of prophecy. The symbols of Daniel, Paul, and John were applied with tremendous effect. Hundreds of books and tracts impressed their contention upon the consciousness of Europe. Indeed it gained so great a hold upon the minds of men that Rome, in alarm, saw that she must successfully counteract this identification of Antichrist with the Papacy, or lose the battle. The Jesuits were summoned to aid in the extremity, and cleverly provided the very method needed both for defense and for attack.

From the ranks of the Jesuits two stalwarts arose, determined to lift the stigma from the Papacy by locating Antichrist at some point where he could not be applied to the Roman church. It was clearly a crisis of major proportions.

Two Conflicting Alternatives Brought Forth
Rome’s answer to the Protestant Reformation was twofold, though actually conflicting and contradictory. Through the Jesuits Ribera, of Salamanca, Spain, and Bellarmine, of Rome, the Papacy put forth her futurist interpretation. Almost simultaneously Alcazar, Spanish Jesuit of Seville, advanced the conflicting preterist interpretation. These were designed to meet and overwhelm the Historical interpretation of the Protestants. Though mutually exclusive, either Jesuit alternative suited the great objective equally well, as both thrust aside the application of the prophecies from the existing Church of Rome. The one (preterism) accomplished it by making prophecy stop altogether short of papal Rome's career. The other (futurism) achieved it by making it overleap the immense era of papal dominance, crowding Antichrist into a small fragment of time in the still distant future, just before the great consummation. It is consequently often called the gap theory.

According to the Protestants, the vision of Babylon and the supporting Beast is divinely interpreted in chapter 17 of the Apocalypse. It was on this that the Reformers commonly rested their case—the apostate woman, the Roman church; the city, seven-hilled Rome; the many waters, the many peoples; the Beast, the fourth, or Roman beast of Daniel; the sixth head, the Caesars; and the seventh, the popes.

Roman Catholics as well as Protestants agree as to the origin of these interpretations. The Roman Catholic writer G.S. Hitchcock says:

• “The Futurist School, founded by the Jesuit Ribera in 1591, looks for Antichrist, Babylon, and a rebuilt temple in Jerusalem, at the end of the Christian dispensation.
• “The Praeterist School, founded by the Jesuit Alcasar in 1614, explains the Revelation by the Fall of Jerusalem, or by the fall of Pagan Rome in 410 A.D.” (G.S. Hitchcock, The Beasts and the Little Horn, p. 7.)

Similarly, Dean Henry Alford (Protestant), in the "Prolegomena" to his Greek Testament, declares:

• “The founder of this system [Futurist] in modern times…appears to have been the Jesuit Ribera, about A.D. 1580." (Henry Alford, The New Testament for English Readers, vol. 2, part 2, p. 351 [bottom numbering].)
• “The Praeterist view found no favour, and was hardly so much as thought of , in the times of primitive Christianity. … The View is said to have been first promulgated in anything like completeness by the Jesuit Alcasar … in 1614.” (Ibid, pp. 348, 349 [bottom numbering].)

Francisco Ribera (1537-1591)

About 1590 Ribera published a 500-page commentary on the Apocalypse, denying the Protestant application of Antichrist to the Church of Rome. Ribera’s death at fifty-four halted the preparation of further commentaries. Those that were printed passed through several revised editions—at Salamanca about 1590, Lyons and Antwerp in 1593, Douay in 1612, and Antwerp in 1603 and 1623.

Since its inception his basic thesis has been virtually unchanged. He assigned the first few chapters of the Apocalypse to ancient Rome, in John’s own time; the rest he restricted to a literal three and a half year’s reign of an infidel Antichrist, who would bitterly oppose and blaspheme the saints just before the second advent. He taught that antichrist would be a single individual, who would rebuild the temple in Jerusalem, abolish Christian religion, deny Christ, be received by the Jews, pretend to be God, and conquer the world—all in this brief space of three and one half years!

• Places Antichrist’s coming at the close of the seals
• Places trumpets under the seventh seal
• Death of the witness is literal time
• Antichrist's persecutions last three and one half years
• Judgements upon Rome for ultimate apostasy—in Revelation 17 Ribera admits the woman to be not only pagan Rome but also Rome Christian after a future falling away from the pope. (Francisco Ribera, Sacram Beati Ioannis … Apocalypsin Commentarij, chap. 14, pp. 282, 283).
• Repudiates Augustinian earthly millennium
• Antichrist’s reign counted by literal days
• Babylon is Rome past and future, not present

Robert Bellarmine (1542-1621), focused his attack on the year-day principle.

• Capitalized on Luther’s hesitation over Apocalypse
• Main assault centered on year-day application
• Assigns symbols to past and future, thereby eliminating application to the long papal ascendancy of the Middle Ages.
• Exploits variations on time of the Antichrist

The heart of Bellarmine’s thesis was both clever and plausible, though deceptive. (1) Antichrist is an individual Jew, and not an apostate Christian system. (2) Therefore the length of his exploits must harmonize with the life period of one man—three and one half literal years, and not 1260 years.

Luis de Alcasar (1554-1613), Spanish Jesuit of Seville

• Made the seals the early expansion of apostolic Christianity
• God’s longsuffering, warnings, and punishments were allotted to the Jews
• The trumpets were judgments on fallen Judaism
• The two witnesses—the doctrine and holy lives of the Christians
• After the persecutions Christianity would arise with new glory and convert many Jews
• Revelation was the apostolic church, bringing forth the Roman church
• The first beast of Revelation 13 declared to be the persecuting arrogance of pagan Rome—the second beast, its carnal wisdom
• Revelation 17, the mystical meaning of idolatrous ancient Rome
• Revelation 18, its conversion to the Catholic faith

LeRoy Edwin Froom, The Prophetic faith of Our Fathers, The Historical Development of Prophetic Interpretation, Vol. 2, Review and Herald, Washington, D.C., 1948, excerpted, pp. 464-532.....A History of the Foundation of Futurism and Preterism

Historical premil was held by many ECF in first 3 centuries of church, and the Amil view became dominant under influence of Augustine behind it in 4th century!

 

[Hobie]

Historical premil was held by many ECF in first 3 centuries of church, and the Amil view became dominant under influence of Augustine behind it in 4th century!

The evidence of the Papacy as the antichrist entity is all through history, so they tried what we call today 'a coverup'...

"The Reformation preachers unanimously identified the papal system as the Antichrist, and the Roman Church as Babylon—causing a mass exodus of believers out of the Catholic institution.

Because Rome realized that the Reformation could jeopardize her position as a religio-political power, she employed five strategies in what became known as the Counter Reformation. One of those strategies was the creation of futurism and preterism, two different interpretations of the prophecies in Daniel and Revelation. These interpretations contradicted the reformers' stance of historicism. "....Futurism and Preterism