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"The Good Pleasure of His Will"
- Thread starter Alan Gross
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Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
Jesus and I were Made human when we were conceived in our mother's wombs.
Are you saying Jesus and I were both dead before we were Made human?
So, could you just show God what His verse was supposed to say?
5 "Even when we were dead in sins, hath made alive {quickened} us together with Christ (by grace ye are saved),"
Is this it?:
'A Spiritually Dead sinner that Jesus Said, "You must be Born Again" is not "quicked" and "made alive" "with Christ" in The Grace of Salvation'
Is that what you are saying?
You single-minded, primary laser-focus being,
"Jesus is Not The Savior".
Is that what all the denials of Scripture and their complete reversal are all about?
I see why you & Van change them and adapt your own 'teachings', apart from The Bible, if that's the case.
"Jesus is Not The Savior" is your only goal?
Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
What does the word, "world" mean, in I John 2?
I John 2:2 "And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world."
What does the word, "world" mean, in I John 2?
1 John 2:15 "Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him."
What does the word, "world" mean, in I John 2?
Alan, you had no support for the claim, but I can just as accurately say none of them. To use such a ploy indicates the objective of deflection rather than discussion in my opinion.
John used the Greek word translated "world" to primarily refer to fallen mankind or the corrupt value system of fallen mankind.
John used the Greek word translated "world" to primarily refer to fallen mankind or the corrupt value system of fallen mankind.
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Who else needs salvation,
Jesus was never dead in sins. We were, He became one of us to save us.
Thanks for responding. However, you provided no specific verse. We were "made sinners" and were born condemned for our unbelief. Thus from the get-go we needed salvation. (Romans 5:19; John 3:18)
If your assertion is just your opinion, based on no particular scripture, fine. I will consider it such.
Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
The word 'world' used by John, you say, 'primarily' refers to two different things. So, 'primarily', 'world' could mean two different things.
Have you considered 'Bible Interpretation'?
Does the meaning of a word just fly off the page and smack you in the face and say, 'this word means this right here and I am beyond inquisition, in my initial assumption as to it's meaning, primarily' ?
Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
Adam died, in Fulfillment of God's Prediction of, "in the day you eat thereof, you shall surely die.
However, in order to satisfy a God-hating philosophy of, "Jesus is not the Savior", the Historical Record of 'death passed upon all men', as a Spiritual Reality, must be set aside to make room for new-fangled redefinitions of isolated terms, like, "made sinners" and bizarre concepts such as 'were born condemned for our unbelief', as opposed to we were sinners, by Nature, and capable of nothing but sin.
For example, your assumption that 'God credited your faith' is sin, composed by the reasoning of a sinner, using a mind affected by the fall of Adam.
Start with that as your beginning point, to chronicle men that reject God.
Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
Yeshua1, Some of these determinations that people would like to suggest are Infinitely over their head.
Jesus Died for The sins of His People, as you and the Bible say.
I try to Teach on these things.
Very few do and there is SO MUCH to TEACH THE IS RIGHT ABOUT GOD!!
Look at these and imagine some of these boys 'Telling God' the way they so it!!
His By Grace--"John Gill: A Body of Doctrinal & Practical Divinity-Doctrinal Book 2"
1.16.1 The COMPLACENCY and DELIGHT that The THREE DIVINE PERSONS Had in EACH OTHER, BEFORE THE WORLD WAS BROUGHT INTO BEING.
Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
I told you the result of my study. You assertions reflect disparagement, devoid of content. The two meanings are related, fallen mankind, and the corrupt value system of fallen mankind.
I am so sorry for you, Sir:
1) Adam volitionally sinned. That does not necessarily make us guilty of rejecting God, in the absence of supporting scripture. I oppose "new-fangled redefinitions.
2) To be dead in our sins does not necessarily mean we never set our minds on God and His gifts. See Matthew 23:13
3) I know what Romans 4 says, and God provided His word to guide me to Christ. You can claim Romans 4 does not mean what it says, but I will give your opinion all the weight it requires.
If you need a verse for our need of salvation, how about
Mat 10:28
“Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.
Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
Almighty God is The One Studying you.
Regardless of whether or not there is a relationship of some vague kind between the two DIFFERENT MEANINGS ALA' "The two meanings are related fallen mankind and the corrupt value system of fallen mankind."
Those two meaning given to the word, 'world' have no relationship to the word, 'world', in I John 2:2.
The word, 'world', in I John 2:2 has a DIFFERENT, THIRD, MEANING.
I John 2:2 "And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world."
Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
THREE ETERNALLY FATAL MISTAKES.
ETERNALLY FATAL MISTAKE 1), above,
ETERNALLY FATAL MISTAKE 2), above,
& ETERNALLY FATAL MISTAKE 3.), above, DENYING JESUS IS THE SAVOUR, IN ROMANS 4:24b, 25; "it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead; 25 Who was delivered for our offenses, and was raised again for our justification."
So you claim. Fine. Jesus became the propitiation or means of salvation for the whole world, all of fallen mankind. Jesus is God, Savior and Lord.
Alan Gross
Well-Known Member
"the whole world, all of fallen mankind"
This is not in keeping with any rule of Interpretation.
Claiming the Bible is not allowed to Interpret itself is not my claim.
Not making consideration of other meanings is something other than 'reading', for the sake of honesty.
"Is he the God of the Jews only? is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also:" Romans 3:29
"For they are not all Israel, who are of Israel;" Romans 9:6b
"I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. Romans 9:15.
16 "So, then, it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that showeth mercy." Romans 9;15b, 16.
18 "Therefore hath He mercy on whom He will have mercy, and whom He will He hardeneth." Romans 9:18
22 "What if God, willing to show His wrath, and to make His power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction;
23 And that He might make known the riches of His glory on the vessels of mercy, which He had before prepared unto glory,
The Vessels of Mercy
Include Some (Not All) Jews,
and Many Gentiles (Verse 24)
24 Even us, whom He hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
25 As He saith also in Hosea, I will call them My people, who were not My people; and her beloved, who was not beloved.
Gentiles Are Included:
Supported from Hosea (Verses 25-26)
26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not My people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.
Only Some Jews Are Included:
Supported from Isaiah (Verses 27-29)
27 Isaiah also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved; Romans 9;22-27.
30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, who followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, who followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Why {Wherefore}? Because they sought it not by faith but, as it were, by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling Stone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Zion a stumbling Stone and Rock of offence; and whosoever believeth on Him shall not be ashamed. Romans 9;30-33.
Acts 10:34
Then Peter began to speak: "I now truly understand that God does not show favoritism,
Romans 9:24
including us, whom He has called not only from the Jews, but also from the Gentiles?
Romans 10:12
For there is no difference between Jew and Greek: The same Lord is Lord of all, and gives richly to all who call on Him,
Romans 15:9
so that the Gentiles may glorify God for His mercy. As it is written: "Therefore I will praise You among the Gentiles; I will sing hymns to Your name."
Galatians 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Romans 1:16
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
Romans 8:28
And we know that God works all things together for the good of those who love Him, who are called according to His purpose.
Romans 8:30
And those He predestined, He also called; those He called, He also justified; those He justified, He also glorified.
ARE YOU SURE?
IS IT WITHIN THE REALM OF POSSIBILITY
TO PROPOSE AND GIVE CONSIDERATION
TO THE WORD, 'WORLD', IN I JOHN 2:2,
as to WHETHER, OR NOT
IT COULD HAVE ANY OTHER MEANING
SOMEWHERE, SOME TIME,
AS A THEORY??
You are going to lose if you do.
This is not in keeping with any rule of Interpretation.
Claiming the Bible is not allowed to Interpret itself is not my claim.
Not making consideration of other meanings is something other than 'reading', for the sake of honesty.
"Is he the God of the Jews only? is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also:" Romans 3:29
"For they are not all Israel, who are of Israel;" Romans 9:6b
"I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. Romans 9:15.
16 "So, then, it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that showeth mercy." Romans 9;15b, 16.
18 "Therefore hath He mercy on whom He will have mercy, and whom He will He hardeneth." Romans 9:18
22 "What if God, willing to show His wrath, and to make His power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction;
23 And that He might make known the riches of His glory on the vessels of mercy, which He had before prepared unto glory,
The Vessels of Mercy
Include Some (Not All) Jews,
and Many Gentiles (Verse 24)
24 Even us, whom He hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
25 As He saith also in Hosea, I will call them My people, who were not My people; and her beloved, who was not beloved.
Gentiles Are Included:
Supported from Hosea (Verses 25-26)
26 And it shall come to pass, that in the place where it was said unto them, Ye are not My people; there shall they be called the children of the living God.
Only Some Jews Are Included:
Supported from Isaiah (Verses 27-29)
27 Isaiah also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved; Romans 9;22-27.
30 What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, who followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, who followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Why {Wherefore}? Because they sought it not by faith but, as it were, by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling Stone;
33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Zion a stumbling Stone and Rock of offence; and whosoever believeth on Him shall not be ashamed. Romans 9;30-33.
Acts 10:34
Then Peter began to speak: "I now truly understand that God does not show favoritism,
Romans 9:24
including us, whom He has called not only from the Jews, but also from the Gentiles?
Romans 10:12
For there is no difference between Jew and Greek: The same Lord is Lord of all, and gives richly to all who call on Him,
Romans 15:9
so that the Gentiles may glorify God for His mercy. As it is written: "Therefore I will praise You among the Gentiles; I will sing hymns to Your name."
Galatians 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Romans 1:16
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
Romans 8:28
And we know that God works all things together for the good of those who love Him, who are called according to His purpose.
Romans 8:30
And those He predestined, He also called; those He called, He also justified; those He justified, He also glorified.
ARE YOU SURE?
IS IT WITHIN THE REALM OF POSSIBILITY
TO PROPOSE AND GIVE CONSIDERATION
TO THE WORD, 'WORLD', IN I JOHN 2:2,
as to WHETHER, OR NOT
IT COULD HAVE ANY OTHER MEANING
SOMEWHERE, SOME TIME,
AS A THEORY??
You are going to lose if you do.
just another misapplication of Romans. It is not made as created but made as deemed or ordained or placed as sinners.
How is it we condemned already? Which we are. Jesus said God said all judgement was given to the Son and Jesus said He judge afyter the flesh, I judge no man/ So How was I condemned?
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