The Hell-a-vision

[mcdirector]

Originally posted by Aaron:
He's done it again! One post by sanderson yields 93 posts of the We Hate Sanderson Club.

It probably would seem so much like this if Mr. Anderson would quit posting and leaving -- He's not involved in the mix except as at catalyst. I agree with Gina -- most of the thread was joking over something surrounding Mr. Anderson's post anyway.

 

[Frenchy]

I don't think so Aaron.
Most of it was joking around about Burt and Ernie, not expressing hatred for Steve Sanderson.
I found his behavior disheartening, disappointing, and a few other adjectives, but personal hatred for the man is not among them, so please don't include me in that idea.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

ME TOO!

 

[Gershom]

Originally posted by sanderson1769:
This sunday morning I preached a sermon against the Television, and all the garbage that is played on it.

For some reason Baptists have accepted this one pet sin of watching television and movies which I believe is probably hurting the cause of Christ morethan any other one thing in America.

Yes, some people fall into sin because of internet porn and chatrooms, but the television is something that if affecting 99% or more of Christians across America. When are we going to wake up and realize that the devil and the world should not control our entertainment and our children's minds?

The sermon ends with me demolishing a 27" television with a baseball bat. You can hear it here:

http://www.faithfulwordbaptist.org/page5.html

Sincerely,

Pastor Steven L Anderson
Faithful Word Baptist Church
www.faithfulwordbaptist.org

What about the internet? Are you gonna take a bat to what you're using to post this stuff or have you decided that the internet doesn't influence people? Tell us why you think it's okay use the internet as opposed to the TV. If you want to live by such standards, then get rid of your access or else your smashing a TV before the congregation is just a show.

 

[JackRUS]

Originally posted by Gina L:
I don't think so Aaron.
Most of it was joking around about Burt and Ernie, not expressing hatred for Steve Sanderson.
I found his behavior disheartening, disappointing, and a few other adjectives, but personal hatred for the man is not among them, so please don't include me in that idea.

Count me out too. We most likely will be joking with him some day in heaven.

He does need some prayer though. The pressure to come up with these types of legalistic sermons must be great at his church.

I was thinking though...since he lives in the Phoenix area it could be that he is sick and tired of watching his Cardinals lose year after year in football.

But anyway, how can ya hate a guy that looks like this?:

http://www.faithfulwordbaptist.org/index.html

(No jokes here please)

 

[Pipedude]

I finally listened to that sermon this afternoon. Yeah, it includes some questionable arguments, but it also includes some sound arguments.

His point is, Christians shouldn't have a TV.

It seems to me that you folks wouldn't pick apart his arguments except for your prior antipathy to his thesis. I say this because I've heard a few thousand sermons, and I've seldom heard any that didn't include logical errors. It's the type of problem that creeps into human speech almost invariably. I just endure it, knowing that my need for the water of life exceeds any problems I may notice with the vessel it is offered in.

I'll just bet that the pastor you listen to, if he opposes anything that others condone, errs occasionally in logic, too. But you don't even notice it, and you don't speak disrespectfully of him, because you don't hate his ideas.

It is unfortunate that Pastor Anderson scared a child with his TV smashing. With perfect foresight, he might have smashed the TV in a more controlled way--maybe snipping off the power cord and then one modest blow in the face with a hammer. But perfect foresight is a rare gift. I was a young preacher once.

Would you be up in arms if he scared a child by violently ripping up a picture of the Pope? Or slamming a copy of Mein Kampf to the floor and stomping on it? Or burning an issue of some Klan magazine in a metal tray? Or breaking a chair as Billy Sunday did? Or are you only horrified when Pastor Anderson opposes what you approve?

Always having been the class clown who craved attention, I guess I'll be able to stand it if you want to call me a nutjob for yet seven pages more. But people would have gone to jail in 1960 if they'd publicly displayed what today's Christians now feed on without giving it a second thought.

Something has changed, just as those who originally preached against TV said it would. You may be unwilling to lament the changes, but you might reconsider your eagerness to celebrate them.

 

[Petrel]

Originally posted by Pipedude:
Would you be up in arms if he scared a child by violently ripping up a picture of the Pope? Or slamming a copy of Mein Kampf to the floor and stomping on it? Or burning an issue of some Klan magazine in a metal tray? Or breaking a chair as Billy Sunday did? Or are you only horrified when Pastor Anderson opposes what you approve?

I'd be dismayed at all of those. Irrational violent outbursts are not an evidence of Christian virtue.

I don't think I'd say we approve of television, how can you approve of an inanimate object? Rather we don't see it as being inherently evil.

(Modification: Burning a single magazine is rather tame, if potentially dangerous.)

 

[Ransom]

Pipedude asked:

Would you be up in arms if he scared a child by violently ripping up a picture of the Pope?

Ripping up a picture of the Pope doesn't cause a loud smash and spray glass shards around the room.

The crying child sounded like a toddler to me, at most. Children of that age get scared when a balloon bursts, much less a picture tube imploding.

 

[samarelda]

I didn't listen to the sermon by Pastor Anderson but after reading a few posts the thought did cross my mind that I could picture a few preachers from the past bashing a TV...namely Billy Sunday and Robert Sheffy. Couldn't you just see Robert Sheffy doing that!!

I do think he could have preached against TV without the bashing. Bash his own at home if it makes him feel better. Believe me, I have felt like bashing some things in my life.

There are things that I don't agree with Brother Anderson on, and things I do agree with. I also feel there is a right and wrong way to do things--but I do feel he is very sincere. He is probably so tired of Christians sitting on the fence between Godly and worldly; that he has taken an extreme view. We as Christians do seem to walk as close to the world as we can.

If we could meet Pastor Anderson in person, he would probably be someone we would really like. He does have an innocent, wholesome look about him. I think he is lacking in tact. Which is worse? Zeal without knowledge, or knowledge without zeal? I know he has the zeal and I feel that as he matures God will polish off the rough edges. He has done that to all of us I am sure.

I think I will add him to my BB prayer list.

 

[Grasshopper]

http://www.faithfulwordbaptist.org/page5.html

This probably belongs on the Fundamentalist Forum:

We believe that God has preserved His Word in the King James Bible.


We believe only in the local church and not in a universal church.

We reject the teaching of Calvinism and believe that God wants everyone to be saved.

Hey Helen, your kinda guy.

We oppose worldliness, modernism, formalism, and liberalism.

And Television.

What a hypocrite! We are exposed for more "sin" on a computer than TV.

 

[Petrel]

Originally posted by Grasshopper:
What a hypocrite! We are exposed for more "sin" on a computer than TV.

Hey now! Maybe he just hadn't noticed.

 

[Frenchy]

Just listened to the sermon again and another word came to mind

HYPOCRITE...Talks about TV promoting violence what does he do but commits a violent act.

Talks about TV promoting profanity and sex. uses words that some would consider profanity, Queers, Fagots etc., and talks about sex SODOMY, BEASTIALITY etc.

Talks about TV promoting corrupt family values, but teaches it's ok to call people wicked and to look down upon them if they are not saved or cookie cutter image as he and his church.

No wonder people are screwed up that come out of churches like this. i counsel more girls who get pregnant being raised in these kinds of churches, than any other denomination.

he wants a study here's one. more kids when given the chance to break free from legalistic homes where they have been controled and sheltered do not know how to handle the real world and the temptations that await them. they fall into sin more than those who were raised in healthy balanced homes and churches. where they were able (in the teen years) to make THEIR own choice within limits, when it came to what they will watch, friends they want to hang out with etc. kids raised being taught right from wrong make wiser choices in the long run. Not the ones who were told do as I say no matter what and were sheltered from reality.

just a fact that i thought i'd share.

 

[Shiloh]

he wants a study here's one. more kids when given the chance to break free from legalistic homes where they have been controled and sheltered do not know how to handle the real world and the temptations that await them. they fall into sin more than those who were raised in healthy balanced homes and churches. where they were able (in the teen years) to make THEIR own choice within limits, when it came to what they will watch, friends they want to hang out with etc. kids raised being taught right from wrong make wiser choices in the long run. Not the ones who were told do as I say no matter what and were sheltered from reality.
------------------------------------------------
THAT'S A LIE!
I have been on the side reading this issue and frankly frenchy you are a hard one to take. You have never said one good thing about this preacher. What ever he does in his church is none of your business if you are not a member of it. If his people like his preaching let him alone. As far as I'm concerned the only thing this preacher did wrong is post on this liberal board. Anybody that takes any kind of a stand against sin you mock. I believe my Bible (KJV) tells me somewhere that fools mock sin. This should take some heat off this TV killing preacher.

By the way frenchy in case you think I have a bad attitude...I love you

 

[Frenchy]

That's ok shiloh you have a right to your opinion. you don't have to deal with these young people and adults who come out of churches like this as often as i do. I not only listened to this guys TV sermon but a few of his others, which have the same thread that runs through them. I listed those problem areas in my first post. looks like you are outnumbered on this, most on this thread have a problem with this preacher not just me. I agreed with Gina he is not to be hated, he needs our prayers and so does eveyone who attends his church.

I don't expect IFB to be on our side on this issue, so what you guys say does not bother me in the least.

 

[Frenchy]

Shilo hows this for an example from Gina L

Thank you JESUS for helping me get out of a similar church. I pray that the children being raised in that don't grow up being afraid of the true Gospel.

Steve, you are working to promote anger and hatred. If you want to teach that television is wrong, and really feel it's important to do so, here's a few ideas.

1. Say it with words.

2. Teach alternatives

3. Do not associate lack of sin with the presence of violence

4. Don't frighten little kids to teach them of the love of God

5. Teach your people what right looks like, to love God, and sinful behavior will begin to stop.

I was in a church like yours, where appearances were focused on. Don't do this, don't do that, let's be loud and yell and scare the hell out of people.
It really messed me up. I grew to look just great, but I didn't grow an inch spiritually until I got in a church that said "this is who Jesus is, this is what he did, this is how he lived, this is what we imitate".
And it was spoken and taught, not yelled and screamed.
When you went to school and college, your teachers didn't yell and scream and act violently because it's not how people learn and mature. We don't yell and scream and act violently towards our children because that's not how they learn and grow.
What makes you think that if I'm at your feet to learn from you, I'm going to learn and grow if you yell and scream and act violently?

I won't. I will be afraid of you. I may be scared into acting right, but it will not come from my heart or out of love for Christ, it will come out of fear and I'll struggle to keep up the decent behavior. Teach me to love Christ, and my behavior will change for the good.

 

[bapmom]

Sooooo, now we have 8 pages all dedicated to "bashing" one pastor of a church? How is that any better than him bashing in the screen of a TV in his own church on his own time in front of a congregation which is in his church by their own choice?

 

[Petrel]

The TV did nothing to deserve it.

 

[Mexdeaf]

Frenchy said:

He wants a study here's one. more kids when given the chance to break free from legalistic homes where they have been controled and sheltered do not know how to handle the real world and the temptations that await them. they fall into sin more than those who were raised in healthy balanced homes and churches. where they were able (in the teen years) to make THEIR own choice within limits, when it came to what they will watch, friends they want to hang out with etc. kids raised being taught right from wrong make wiser choices in the long run. Not the ones who were told do as I say no matter what and were sheltered from reality.

SO TRUE!!! I have seen the same thing. BALANCE is the key.

 

[Frenchy]

Exactly Mexdeaf BALANCE is the key! glad someone gets it

 

[bapmom]

Originally posted by Petrel:
The TV did nothing to deserve it.

 

[rbell]

Originally posted by bapmom:
Sooooo, now we have 8 pages all dedicated to "bashing" one pastor of a church? How is that any better than him bashing in the screen of a TV in his own church on his own time in front of a congregation which is in his church by their own choice?

Bapmom, I disagree with your assessment. Much of these 8 pages were banter...folks having fun about the "Bert & Ernie" stuff.

Remember...this guy put this sermon on the internet. It's public. Theatrics like his little stunt give those of us who DO preach against sin but don't do it stupidly a bad name. My labeling his stunt as stupid behavior (which it was) is in no way is comparable to what he did.

I said it before...much of his sermon (I listened to all of it) I found myself in agreement to, in principle. The TV does carry an unprecedented amount of trashy programming. We have seen moral decay in that realm. And responsible Christian parents should monitor and control what their kids are watching (as well as teach them discernment).

But...His word choices ("faggot" and other such crude, inappropriate words) were terrible, and his sermon contained a ton of factual errors. Responsible ministers check their sources and don't preach using hearsay, rumor, or urban legend.

My consternation was reserved, however, for his VIOLENT outburst. Not just the outburst itself (which was a dumb idea), but if you'll remember he said, "So, if your wife or kids ask you, 'why do we need to get rid of the TV?'" and then he commenced immediately into his shenanigans. His destroying the TV was IN HIS WORDS a response to his family's questions!

So, is that how a Christian husband and father should respond to a wife or kid that is questioning them about an issue...with destructive force? This caused me to worry on two fronts:
(1) This guy's attitude and actions will attract abusive, autocratic men (who lord over their families) to this church.
(2) Does this guy treat HIS family like that? I think that when you put your sermon on the World Wide Web, and their are behaviors like that displayed, it's a valid question.

Please don't get me wrong. We have six channels on our TV's at home. Our kids don't, and won't, have TV's in their rooms. I would support someone who feels led to ditch the TV. But in ministry, it's not just what we do...it's how we do it...the attitude and manner in which we carry out these things--that matter a bunch.

Also, not everyone in his church may be there by choice, bapmom. There are probably kids there (and maybe even wives) who HAVE to be there. What about them? I've cleaned up too many messes caused by legalistic, pharasaical parents who hammer rules but forget relationships. Two outcomes are predominant:

(1) The kids exposed to this become a little disciple of this kind of attitude; or
(2) Out and out rebellion takes place.

I feel that this guy's actions are worth discussing. He put them out there publicly...and, as usual, he "posts and runs."