The Holy Bible AV1611

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

Here is the entire verse you quoted william in the AV1611.

The spirit it selfe beareth witnes with our spirit, that we are the children of God.

The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are the children of God. What does that have to do with the choice of Bible versions?

 

[StefanM]

Originally posted by Rev. Lowery:
Inregards to KJVOism

How is it unbiblical ????

And

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by DesiderioDomini:

What if evidence was uncovered that proved Jesus did not rise from the dead? What if it was TRUE? Because of my beliefs, I know this to be impossible, but would the real God want us to believe a lie? NO!!! I know that I do not have it all figured out, and I pray that I am constantly changed by the Spirit to conform to TRUTH, not claim I know it all.

Lets think about this for a second? Why would this brother even make a statement like this? Its because MVO'ist say everything is the truth how are they to know what the truth is. All MV's contradict each other at some place where as all KJV's never contradicts themself. </font>[/QUOTE]1Ki 7:26 And it was an hand breadth thicke, and the brimme thereof was wrought like the brim of a cup, with flowres of lillies: it contained two thousand Baths.
----
2Ch 4:5 And the thicknes of it was an hand breadth, and the brim of it like the worke of the brim of a cup, with flowers of Lillies: and it receiued and held three thousand baths.

----
So, if there are no contradictions in the AV1611...which is it...two or three?

 

[TCassidy]

Originally posted by StefanM:
1Ki 7:26 And it was an hand breadth thicke, and the brimme thereof was wrought like the brim of a cup, with flowres of lillies: it contained two thousand Baths.
----
2Ch 4:5 And the thicknes of it was an hand breadth, and the brim of it like the worke of the brim of a cup, with flowers of Lillies: and it receiued and held three thousand baths.

----
So, if there are no contradictions in the AV1611...which is it...two or three?

Your problem is not with the KJV but with the inspired Hebrew!

And it seems clear to me there is a difference between "it contained" and "it receiued and held." It seems reasonable to me to understand these verses in the context of it being able to receive and hold 3,000 baths but customarily only contained 2,000 as it was not usually filled clear full.

Let's not mistake a difficult reading in the Hebrew for a translation error in the KJV.

 

[StefanM]

Dr. Cassidy,

I'm not mistaking it for a translation error. I realize the problem is with the Hebrew, but I think it may be a textual corruption. My contention was this: KJVOists give no room for possible textual corruptions or anything related to underlying manuscripts. If the KJV is absolutely flawless in every way, as the KJVOs contend, then it should have "divinely resolved" all of the issues in the underlying text.

 

[StefanM]

Also, the difference between the two does not appear to be as pronounced in the Hebrew text.

The same Hebrew form is behind "contained" and "held."

The difference really amounts to this:
"Receiving baths, 3000 it held."
"2000 baths it held."

 

[william s. correa]

Originally posted by C4K:
Here is the entire verse you quoted william in the AV1611.

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />

The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are the children of God. What does that have to do with the? </font>[/QUOTE]It may not have anything to do with choice of Bible versions, But it sure points one toward the Right Spirit! I have Qouted a Word From that verse and not used it out of cotext. Listen to the message not the messanger! "The spirit it selfe beareth witnes with our spirit, that we are the children of God" says that you are children of the Living GOD By the witness of HIS Spirit living in Us! I say some of the MV's show to be Spiritual Mongoloids when they try to use foot notes and comments made by the translators or man himself when it comes to Gods Word! I am really not interrested in that! Only what the Spirit of God has to say thats what I am Delighted in! I try not to Quote from the AV 1611 Because I hold it dear to my heart and would not do it Justice! and neither do some others I hear Quoting from it! I read out it and hear it on the Radio every Morning at 8:00 am But "Thy Word Have I Hid in My heart that I might not sin Against thee"Psalms 119 :11 That Quote Might be from a revised Version of the AV 1611 but never the less I have truly Hid it in my heart! So where did that come from? God! and he said he would never leave me nor forsake me. I do not trust Codex Siniaticus and I'm sure neither would Erasmus from what is Taught in his History! God did not compell him to write it; He just made him willing to write the truth! If I am in a room and some one throws a Hornets nest in that room, then I am "WILLING" to Vacate the premisses! So God is going to Preserve his Word No matter what the RCC says! And He did it in the AV 1611 And in ALL revisions that were directly derived from IT that are the Word Of God! The TR is

all I need for Me!

 

[Bro Tony]

I just have to say it----WOW!!!!!

Bro Tony

 

[Ransom]

william s. correa said:

I say some of the MV's show to be Spiritual Mongoloids

They don't need your silly English KJV, or any other decent English translation for that matter. They've got their own Bible.

 

[robycop3]

Rev. Lowery:Inregards to KJVOism

How is it unbiblical ????

Actually, as C4K said in another thread, it's Ascriptural...not supported by any Scripture at all, from the KJV or any other version. Since Scripture is the highest written authority we have, and the KJVO myth is about Scripture, then it MUST BE SUPPORTED by Scripture to be true. And there's not one iota of such support! Therefore, advocating the KJVO myth is placing that myth ABOVE Scripture.

And

quote:Originally posted by DesiderioDomini:
________________________________________________
What if evidence was uncovered that proved Jesus did not rise from the dead? What if it was TRUE? Because of my beliefs, I know this to be impossible, but would the real God want us to believe a lie? NO!!! I know that I do not have it all figured out, and I pray that I am constantly changed by the Spirit to conform to TRUTH, not claim I know it all.
__________________________________________________

Lets think about this for a second? Why would this brother even make a statement like this? Its because MVO'ist say everything is the truth how are they to know what the truth is. All MV's contradict each other at some place where as all KJV's never contradicts themself.

Well, was Jehoiachin 8 or 18 when he began to reign?

And here's one to show ya JESUS isn't limited to one version per language. Please compare Isaiah 42:7 and 61:1-3 with what JESUS READ ALOUD in Luke 4:16-21. I and many others useta believe He was reading from the LXX, which His words in Luke match fairly well, But Doc Cassidy and some Hebrew scholars believe there were at least two vorlage Hebrew mss in use at that time/place...and investigation points more toward that explanation than to the LXX. In fact, there's a good possibility that the LXX was made from one of those vorlage mss. Whatever the truth may be, Jesus was reading aloud from a text that didn't match the Ben Chayyim Text used to make the Old Testaments of the KJV and several other versions.

Wanna suggest JESUS was reading from a corrupt version? Be my guest....OTOH, be someone else's guest!

 

[william s. correa]

Originally posted by Ransom:
william s. correa said:

I say some of the MV's show to be Spiritual Mongoloids

They don't need your silly English KJV, or any other decent English translation for that matter. They've got their own Bible.

Went right over your head!

 

[Ransom]

Went right over your head!

Maybe if you wrote English, people wouldn't mistake you for an incoherent babbler.

 

[william s. correa]

Originally posted by Ransom:
Went right over your head!

Maybe if you wrote English, people wouldn't mistake you for an incoherent babbler.

C-aey A-aey N -aey A -aey D-aey A-aey

 

[standingfirminChrist]

robycop. If you study it out, you will find that Jehoiachim began a reign beside his father when he was 8. When his father died 10 years later, Jehoiachim took full reign. No contradiction.

 

[Scott J]

The KJV just says that he reigned in his father's stead. It doesn't say anything about reigning as a co-regent.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

I try not to Quote from the AV 1611 Because I hold it dear to my heart and would not do it Justice!

Are you truly saying that the original 1611 is too sacred to quote from? I dare say that chances are you never saw it quoted before you joined this board.

And Roby - I differ with you on the Jehoiachim issue, there is no conflict in the KJV, it is a non-issue.

 

[robycop3]

Sorry, Sir...I was speaking of Jehoiachin, the king of Judah who spent 37 years in prison in Babylon before Evil-Merodach, Nebuchadnezzar's descendant, removed him from prison, giving him a daily allowance & feeding him at the king's table.

2 Kings 24:8, KJV...Jehoiachin was eighteenyears old [/b]when he began to reign, and he reigned in Jerusalem three months. And his mother's name was Nehushta, the daughter of Elnathan of Jerusalem.

2 Chron. 36:9, KJV...Jehoiachin was eight years old when he began to reign, and he reigned three months and ten days in Jerusalem: and he did that which was evil in the sight of the LORD.

Please read 2 Kings 24 & 2 Chron.36 closely, and then tell us where a co-regency is mentioned with Jehoiachin, or where a regent who reigned till J was old enough is mentioned. And then, please rell us whether you believe he was 8 or 18 when he began to reign.

I'm not trying to be smart-alec; just trying to point out some facts. Could the writer of either Kings or Chrinicles made a goof? I lean toward the eighteen reading because an 8-yr-old would hardly be such a grave sinner that God would have had him carted off to prison.

 

[DesiderioDomini]

William,

[attack deleted], I would now feel remiss if I did not speak my mind:

Please do not ever witness for this Spirit you claim to have. Your Spirit clearly has nothing to do with the Spirit of the Bible, because that God is not the author of confusion, and your posts have been nothing else. [attack deleted] You clearly want to stay that way, as you have repeatedly rejected loving rebuke and teaching. Therefore, I ask you simply keep it to yourself.

Dont try and come back with this "I cant keep it to myself" line. You must. When you are able to "rightly divide the truth" as the KJV commands, then I think you should be able to talk to people about God. As for now, you will only lead them further away.

Every single person on this board is now dumber from your presence over the past few weeks. I cringe to think of how many seekers came here looking for truth, and instead read your posts, and now reject Christianity altogether.

I am certain that fact doesnt bother you a bit, though.

[ May 18, 2006, 10:07 PM: Message edited by: C4K ]

 

[David J]

Originally posted by robycop3:
Sorry, Sir...I was speaking of Jehoiachin, the king of Judah who spent 37 years in prison in Babylon before Evil-Merodach, Nebuchadnezzar's descendant, removed him from prison, giving him a daily allowance & feeding him at the king's table.

2 Kings 24:8, KJV...Jehoiachin was eighteenyears old when he began to reign, and he reigned in Jerusalem three months. And his mother's name was Nehushta, the daughter of Elnathan of Jerusalem.

2 Chron. 36:9, KJV...Jehoiachin was eight years old when he began to reign, and he reigned three months and ten days in Jerusalem: and he did that which was evil in the sight of the LORD.

Please read 2 Kings 24 & 2 Chron.36 closely, and then tell us where a co-regency is mentioned with Jehoiachin, or where a regent who reigned till J was old enough is mentioned. And then, please rell us whether you believe he was 8 or 18 when he began to reign.

I'm not trying to be smart-alec; just trying to point out some facts. Could the writer of either Kings or Chrinicles made a goof? I lean toward the eighteen reading because an 8-yr-old would hardly be such a grave sinner that God would have had him carted off to prison. [/b]

Some people just have problems with facts. There is a contradiction and so what! It's a text problem. Honesty is the best policy people! It bothers me when people ignore what is staring at them and claiming it is not there. Yes there is a problem in the ancient text and yes we are not sure. How does being honest hurt anyone?

I'm disappointed in some of you who say there is not problem when there is a problem. Any one who can read can see this problem in the KJV. This problem goes beyond the KJV and also exist in other translations.

 

[william s. correa]

Originally posted by DesiderioDomini:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> quote:Originally posted by DesiderioDomini:
......Every honest christian would be GLAD to change their belief in light of UNDENIABLE FACTS.

What if evidence was uncovered that proved Jesus did not rise from the dead? What if it was TRUE? Because of my beliefs, I know this to be impossible, but would the real God want us to believe a lie? l..........

[Eek!] It sounds as if your faith is actually in your on "beliefs". Please say it ain't so.

I honestly have no idea where you got that, but rest assured, it is incorrect. Allow me to make it clear, BECAUSE OF MY BELIEFS, which if you read any of my posts you would know that I am not one to say "I believe" to anything I have not fully researched. Therefore, because I believe that Jesus rose from the dead, I know it is not possible for there to be any evidence that he in fact did not. However, what if I was wrong? What if there was a true salvation that was not Jesus? How idiotic would I be to be so proud as to reject it, and be damned? This is exactly the statement I use often when witnessing to atheists and many other religions. I listen to them, let them make their case, and I respect it. Then they are more than willing to do the same.

So far, my version of the truth has convinced a few, and they are still left at zero. This type of witnessing is lost on this IFB "us against the world" attitude. More often than not, opposing beliefs are ridiculed, and almost never understood. Most study mormonism for avenues to debate it.....I study to try and understand why they believe as they do, and use that to bring them to the truth. Should I really be worried that I will be swayed by studying another religion? Is my God really that weak? NO! I have enough faith to allow my beliefs to be constantly challenged, which ensures that I know why I believe what I believe.

Most of our young people still only know what we told them to believe. Why are we so afraid to let them know WHY? Why do we say "you must believe this way or you are wrong?" There are some UNDENIABLE TRUTHS in the bible, and I agree that we must keep those sacred in order to be able to differentiate between Christianity and the world, but things like KJVO overstep the bounds. And on top of that, its proponents refuse to allow this belief, which they claim is bound to all men, to be questioned honestly.

Exactly what is Christian about that? What would the Bereans have to say about such willful ignorance? Its ASININE!

In short, no, I dont have faith in my beliefs. I have faith in what I cannot see, but I KNOW WHAT I CAN SEE. I can see God's word, and I can see the incredible amount of evidence that proves Jesus is the Christ. I also see the evidence of other beliefs of mine, one of which is to reject KJVO. I dont need to have faith in what I CAN SEE, I have faith in that which I CANNOT SEE. Honestly, simple exegesis of Hebrews should lead even the simplest Christian to the same doctrine.

My rant is over....moving on to the rest....

quote:
What part of that is biblical?

Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle. 2Thess. 2:15

Yea, and which traditions were those? Lets try and use scripture in its context next time, shall we? There is no need to resort to such tactics.

2Th 2:13 But we ought always to thank God for you, brothers loved by the Lord, because from the beginning God chose you to be saved through the sanctifying work of the Spirit and through belief in the truth.
2Th 2:14 He called you to this through our gospel, that you might share in the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
2Th 2:15 So then, brothers, stand firm and hold to the teachings we passed on to you, whether by word of mouth or by letter.
2Th 2:16 May our Lord Jesus Christ himself and God our Father, who loved us and by his grace gave us eternal encouragement and good hope,
2Th 2:17 encourage your hearts and strengthen you in every good deed and word

Wanna try and show me where they were talking about "traditions" or "beliefs" which were not found either from scripture or from an apostle? Here, we are talking about a doctrine not found in scripture ANYWHERE, but also in direct opposition to KNOWN FACTS!

Forgive me if I fail to see the connection. </font>[/QUOTE]I forgive you!

 

[william s. correa]

2 Chron. 36:9, KJV...Jehoiachin was eight years old when he began to reign, and he reigned three months and ten days in Jerusalem: and he did that which was evil in the sight of the LORD. And so did wescott and hort!