The Mark - Tattoo or Chip?

[Iconoclast]

I have a whole big shelf full of encyclopediae & other works of history, as well as eleven English Bible versions, & the occurrence of those events is found in NONE of them.

Ezk. 9 is not found in the English version of The Bible?

 

[JonC]

Ezk. 9 is not found in the English version of The Bible?

Not in the ESV...that is, the ESV New Testament. I looked.

 

[Iconoclast]

the book of Ezekiel is in the Old Testament. In the sekel chapter 9 verse 4 it's talking about the mark Is even in the ESV version

 

[Alcott]

Ain't y'all heard? It's really failing to keep the sabbath every 7th day!

 

[AustinC]

Since He hasn't yet issued it, I don't know. And it's called a seal, while the antichrist's is called a mark.

A seal is a mark. Think of the Kings seal. Think of the seal of a notary. It is a mark placed upon something to show its official approval.

In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory.
~ Ephesians 1:13-14

This is the mark of God, the Holy Spirit.

That mark of the antichrist comes after God does the following:

Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false, in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
~ 2 Thessalonians 2:11-12

That delusion may be the mark of the beast rather than believers who have the mark of the Holy Spirit.

 

[robycop3]

A seal is a mark. Think of the Kings seal. Think of the seal of a notary. It is a mark placed upon something to show its official approval.

In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory.
~ Ephesians 1:13-14

This is the mark of God, the Holy Spirit.

That mark of the antichrist comes after God does the following:

Therefore God sends them a strong delusion, so that they may believe what is false, in order that all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
~ 2 Thessalonians 2:11-12

That delusion may be the mark of the beast rather than believers who have the mark of the Holy Spirit.

The mark of the beast will be physical. It'll be required to do business. It'll likely be some kinda microchip, as tattoos, etc. can be altered. Insteada using cash or a card, merchants will hafta scan one's chip to do a transaction.

The strong delusion will be the belief that the beast/antichrist will solve all the world's problems, so most people will be like a frog in water being slowly heated so the frog is boiled before it realizes it.

 

[Two Wings]

A seal is a mark. Think of the Kings seal. Think of the seal of a

i think of a seal as an apparatus to keep separated. Wheel bearing seal. Pressurization seal.

a mark is something visible used in this case for identification. Mark the cylinder connecting rods. Mark the sweet tea.

 

[robycop3]

i think of a seal as an apparatus to keep separated. Wheel bearing seal. Pressurization seal.

a mark is something visible used in this case for identification. Mark the cylinder connecting rods. Mark the sweet tea.

Also, a seal holds things closed, such as an envelope. its frequent use in Scripture comes from using wax seals to hold scrolls shut . Ofter, they bore multiple seals to mark chapters or sections, & to keep the scroll from completely unrolling when its outermost seal was opened.

 

[AustinC]

i think of a seal as an apparatus to keep separated. Wheel bearing seal. Pressurization seal.

a mark is something visible used in this case for identification. Mark the cylinder connecting rods. Mark the sweet tea.

Think of the seal from a Kings signet ring. This is what it means when a seal is spoken of in the Bible. It's an authentication and mark establishing the authority of the one making the seal. This is what you get when you have a notary seal your document. It means it is authentic and true.

 

[AustinC]

The mark of the beast will be physical. It'll be required to do business. It'll likely be some kinda microchip, as tattoos, etc. can be altered. Insteada using cash or a card, merchants will hafta scan one's chip to do a transaction.

The strong delusion will be the belief that the beast/antichrist will solve all the world's problems, so most people will be like a frog in water being slowly heated so the frog is boiled before it realizes it.

I understand how you come to this conclusion. I think it's possible you are correct, but it is not certain. It is similar to the long held teaching about the Roman church and the pope as antichrist. It's one theory, but likely not it.
Recall that the Pharisees had a much different idea of Messiah than what actually happened. So our conjecture is likely far off from what will actually happen.

 

[robycop3]

Think of the seal from a Kings signet ring. This is what it means when a seal is spoken of in the Bible. It's an authentication and mark establishing the authority of the one making the seal. This is what you get when you have a notary seal your document. It means it is authentic and true.

Agree, like the great seal of the state of ******.
However, as you said, a mark ID's something, and is physical. A dog marks its territory with urine, which, while is invisible once it dries, is physical, & leaves a scent which any other dog (or cat) can smell. (Some other territorial animals do the same.)

 

[Two Wings]

Think of the seal from a Kings signet ring. This is what it means when a seal is spoken of in the Bible. It's an authentication and mark establishing the authority of the one making the seal. This is what you get when you have a notary seal your document. It means it is authentic and true.

yes ... I understand. I'm not arguing the point, just sharing how I understand the use of the terms.

The tupos of the signet ring ... the impact .. the stamp.

But sealed in the Spirit includes, I think, a similar act as that wheel bearing seal. holds the bearing grease in and keeps the dirt out.

 

[dad2]

Revelation is apocryphal language. We read of God sealing his children so the angels know them and care for them.
Satan, ever the imitator, seals those whom God has not sealed.
When the time comes, this seal will be obvious. I don't think it is actually any physical chip or tattoo. I think it is a spiritual seal that marks one as an enemy of God enslaved to Satan and sin.

Yet one needs that mark to buy or sell, so it seems more than spiritual.

 

[AustinC]

Agree, like the great seal of the state of ******.
However, as you said, a mark ID's something, and is physical. A dog marks its territory with urine, which, while is invisible once it dries, is physical, & leaves a scent which any other dog (or cat) can smell. (Some other territorial animals do the same.)

Is the visibility physical or spiritual? God sees both the mark on His saints and the mark of the beast, but do humans see that mark?
Seeing as how Revelation uses apocalyptic language, I doubt it is a physical mark. (But, honestly, we are both living in a world of conjecture that is worthless for today.)

 

[Two Wings]

but do humans see that mark?

Humans will be made aware of it. Rev 14. the 3rd angel.

The deception by the father of lies will draw men into the "lair" ... then will be so invested they will take the delusion ... and regardless of the certain death ... take the mark. It has to be accepted, too.

 

[robycop3]

I understand how you come to this conclusion. I think it's possible you are correct, but it is not certain. It is similar to the long held teaching about the Roman church and the pope as antichrist. It's one theory, but likely not it.
Recall that the Pharisees had a much different idea of Messiah than what actually happened. So our conjecture is likely far off from what will actually happen.

Scripture plainly shows the beast/antichrist will be one man,

Is the visibility physical or spiritual? God sees both the mark on His saints and the mark of the beast, but do humans see that mark?
Seeing as how Revelation uses apocalyptic language, I doubt it is a physical mark. (But, honestly, we are both living in a world of conjecture that is worthless for today.)

An implanted chip won't likely be visible. But look at this: we're headed for a cashless, cardless society of cryptocurrency. Yet, merchants will still place a specific value on their wares. People will still hafta purchase food, clothes, etc. Insteada cash registers, stores will have kiosks for scanning customers' chips. Consumers won't be carrying spiritual marks to buy and sell!

Much of Revelation is literal. There'll be a literal beast/antichrist & a literal false prophet who'll be his sidekick. And the plagues of the great trib are literal, as is the visible return of Jesus, which will be seen by all.

 

[Two Wings]

Scripture plainly shows the beast/antichrist will be one man,

An implanted chip won't likely be visible. But look at this: we're headed for a cashless, cardless society of cryptocurrency. Yet, merchants will still place a specific value on their wares. People will still hafta purchase food, clothes, etc. Insteada cash registers, stores will have kiosks for scanning customers' chips. Consumers won't be carrying spiritual marks to buy and sell!

Much of Revelation is literal. There'll be a literal beast/antichrist & a literal false prophet who'll be his sidekick. And the plagues of the great trib are literal, as is the visible return of Jesus, which will be seen by all.

There are lots of places which are "card only" all over the nation. There's a store in Portland which requires apple pay ... grab your wares and wave your phone over this reader. It already knows what's in your bag.

the long held teaching about the Roman church and the pope as antichrist.

I've heard False Prophet, not antichrist. I doubt the pope will become the antichrist, but I can CERTAINLY see the False Prophet.

 

[robycop3]

There are lots of places which are "card only" all over the nation. There's a store in Portland which requires apple pay ... grab your wares and wave your phone over this reader. It already knows what's in your bag.



I've heard False Prophet, not antichrist. I doubt the pope will become the antichrist, but I can CERTAINLY see the False Prophet.

The beast is not called the antichrist in Scripture, but it's obvious he will be just that. Anyone who would proclaim himself to be God is definitely antichrist!

In Rev. 17, 'beast' refers both to the man & his empire; one must use the context to discern which app if for a certain sentence.

Also, there have been, and are, many false prophets. But Revelation mentions "the" FP. Unbountedly, he will be the most-false prophet who will ever be, working some miracles by Satan's power, such as calling down lightning and making his boss' statue speak without electronic machinery.

And I believe that "man of sin, that Wicked", & 'beast' all refer to the same man.

 

[Two Wings]

the unholy trinity, right ... the counterfeit to The Trinity

Father, Son, Holy Spirit

dragon(Satan), antichrist (man of lawlessness, prince of persia ... etc), false prophet.

I think the dragon is the entity we'll not see until the end of the 7th millennium

The antichrist is representing the dragon physically on earth ... perhaps by overtaking a man's body who was just immediately killed (the miraculous healing of a mortal wound)

false prophet ... to administer the religion of all to the beast/dragon/satan.