The Mormom's Are Coming!

Hi there, well please be very careful as you witness to them. They do have a way of turning things upside down at times using scriptrue. They also leave a lot out to make people join. Then when they are trapped they tell them the rest. I am sure you will not be trapped by them. I hate to say this but sometimes it is better to just say no to them and leave it at that. I know that sounds really cruel and very un- christian like but sometimes it is best!
But if you feel God is guiding you to do this then have your sword ready! (Bible) & be able to take them down with the truth. You never know if you have planted a seed.
Good luck and God bless, love in Christ Angie

 

I was going to suggest mrm.org. Very good site.

I'd also recommend http://www.carm.org http://www.saintsalive.com and http://www.equip.org

I've found Ed Decker's stuff to be partiularly helpful with Mormons.

Mike

 

I think tonight's the night; please let us know how it goes!

 

I know Mormon..but I think..

HELEN wrote:
ORMOND wrote (Bold):

There are some basic points that are important to know about the LDS doctrines:

1. They redefine many important terms. MAKE SURE YOU HAVE DEFINITIONS STRAIGHT BEFORE ANYTHING ELSE! Or
you will just be talking past each other and will 'seem' to agree when, if you knew what they were really talking
about, you would not agree at all.

Here are some of the terms:
God the Father: Yes but Heaven Father
Jesus yes but Jesus and brother man (Lucifer) but NOT Satan!
Holy Spirit yes but another Holy Ghost
salvation yes with Jesus
sin yes and sinner? sure!
atonement oh yes

heaven yes but after accept Jesus (or follow man with Jesus)
with three heavens or more..
hell eternal lake of fire? if again not accept Jesus plus anti-Jesus

... your discussion will hang up on these points at the beginning. You will never get any farther if you follow through
with comparing what they say with the Bible. Don't let them run you off the track. Stay with definitions and remind
them that you cannot have any other reasonable discussion unless you all agree with what you are talking about.

2. Here, however, are some related questions.

-- A. Is it true that you believe that God the Father once had a body and was also once human and a sinner? with sinner? what is mean?

-- B. Is it true that you believe Jesus and Satan are brothers? not true

-- C. Is it true that you believe that a man must pay for certain of his own sins?
don't understand.. what is explain

3. There are four things which the Bible says are finished and LDS doctrine says not:

-- A. creation (ask you: Man? or Jesus?)
-- B. the law Man (with accept Jesus) or Jesus?
-- C. atonement for all sin
-- D. general revelation

Bro Rockwell Butler

[ August 22, 2002, 03:13 PM: Message edited by: ormond ]

 

But I don't want (or not interest) Mormon coming my Baptist
because if Mormon is not Jesus saved (or not accept Jesus yet).
but I need Mormon Jesus saved then priesthood become
Christian powerful.

I wish Mormon come my Baptist for Mormon change to Christian.
or Christian-Mormon (options).
Mormon-Christian? weak or flat but better? few but hard to found.

Amen
Bro Rockwell Butler

[ August 22, 2002, 03:16 PM: Message edited by: ormond ]

 

Not real smart. . . I know you have good intentions, but they are very good at trying to make you doubt what you believe. Read your Bible 24 hours a day for about 3 weeks before they come and pray REALLLY hard about if this is what God wants you to do. May weaken your faith if you are not strong in what you believe!!!

 

Whatever you do, make sure that there are other Christians there with you that know the Bible as well and are not afraid to speak up . . . they come prepared. . . don't let them ahead of you.

 

It is almost certainly the canned first presentation materials that stress the need for a prophet and the story of Joseph Smith, Jr. instead of a “Jehovah’s” Witnesses Bible drill sort of encounter. If you make it hostile, you will lose your opportunity to talk reasonably with the Mormons. Common courtesy will make inroads but Bible “war” will harden them to their false gospel and end your opportunity.

If you can’t talk nicely without making everything a hostile argument then it is better not to talk to them at all. I certainly hope that you are nicer to them than your brothers and sisters in Christ here.

Remember, the Lord hold you accountable for the way you treat them. Hostility only hardens the heart of true believers in a false gospel. They have every reason in their world to ignore what you have to say. Don’t make it easy for them to shut out the gospel message forever. If you are a bad witness because of your hostility, you bear some of the blame if they reject the gospel.

(pardon the shouting)

THIS OPPORTUNITY IS MUCH TOO IMPORTANT TO PLAY RELIGIOUS GAMES OR TRY TO WIN AN ARGUMENT. THEY WILL NOT BE WON BY AN INTELLECTUAL VICTORY, THEY WILL BE WON BY THE GENTLE APPLICATION OF TRUTH, YOUR GENUINE CHRISTIAN CONCERN FOR THEM, AND THE WORK OF THE HOLY SPIRIT.

 

JESUS SAVES!

checkmate! you lose all other religions.
Mormon? abort!

Bro Rockwell Butler

[ August 22, 2002, 05:21 PM: Message edited by: ormond ]

 

Justified:

Go to a Christian bookstore and buy the following book: Mormonism Unmasked. It will cost about 8 dollars but is a excellant book with many sugestions on witnessing to them. You should be able to read it in a day or so in your leisure time. It will give you a lot of ammunitation to fight back. I have some of it posted on this site but only the beginning. I got this book so I can stay on top of them when they come by. One of the co-arthors was a Mormon and now a Christian and is the great, great granddaughter of Brigham Young. Her name is Sandra Tanner.

I know this book will be a great asset when they come back.

God Bless............Alex

[ August 22, 2002, 10:34 PM: Message edited by: Alex ]

 

It's very interesting that they sent three missionaries -- especially one who is 38. They probably expected to encounter resistance so they sent a "pro" with them. Did the 38-year-old lead their "team" or did he take the position of an observer? Also, was he some sort of leader in the local stake?

[QB]

Not surprising. Even if they know much about what the Bible teaches (chances are they don't) they have probably redefined most of the terms. They will probably go off to get some pat answers for your next visit.

Did they try to use their canned discussions or did they come to talk "freestyle"? From the sound of it, you had an atypical experience with them.

Be sure to keep them in prayer by name from now on. If you care to shoot me a PM with their names, I will do the same.

 

Either something happened in your conversations setting up the meeting that the two younger ones felt they needed some back-up, or you had an experienced elder and two "missionaries" in training (the 19 and 20 year olds).

When (if) they come back, be prepared for them to seriously attempt to take control of the situation. Right now, the elder is assuaging the two younger ones, and relieving the doubts that were caused by the fact that you asked biblically-based questions that they couldn't answer. He's also telling them that their biggest mistake was allowing you to control the situation.

 

Don't talk to them!
They say that they want to have prayer with you, but they want this under their terms.
They are trained to decieve you.
They want you to invite a spirit that is not the Holy Spirit to enlighten you.
READ
2John verse 10.
Do not let them in your house.

That is my advise.

 

Thank-you all for the prayers that were with us last night. I sat as a bystander for the most part, not out of fear, but to get a "feel" for them.
BB,

It is my belief that he was there as a back-up. I think he came as the "expert", probably for his studies/experience with the Baptists, but he held his tongue, interjecting when he deemed necessary. He came on a bit strong, though, as many Baptist do when dealing with cult members. He did calm a bit, but I could sense his impatience and desire to get out and not waste his time with us. The two younger Joe's where alot more patient. Hopefully he won't come back with them.

atestring, Calm down. We're ok. Saved by the blood of Christ, now and forever. We are well versed, in the cults, our specialty being those wonderful Jehovah's Witnesses. We had been witnesses for Jehovah to them for many years. But since we have moved, we haven't had any visits from them, maybe because we live in a Jewish neighborhood. Those people are just as lost as an athiest or local Catholic. They need to hear the truth the same as any other lost soul needing a Savior.

 

BB

I just read this post. I guess you just don't know Justified or you would never have said this.
There is a big difference between a lost person and those that know Christ, yet have a pathetic walk for Him.

He came to you for advice, which he is greatful for your taking the time to give the info. We never condone an unsaved persons belief, we desire to see them saved. Most people will think you condone their beliefs if you don't tell them this. Are you still willing to help us, if needed? If not, I know of other sources to go to.

 

I just read this post. I guess you just don't know Justified or you would never have said this.</font>[/QUOTE]You are correct. I do not know him. I only know him by what he posts. In the same way, I don't think anyone here really understands my point of view on many things but I've already been mistakenly pegged as a "liberal". I think we all have a ways to go in understanding each other.

In context, I posted this message (the part in caps) because there were a bunch of posts preceding it who sounded like they wanted you to have an extremely aggressive face-off with the Mormons instead of getting to know them and working through their beliefs with them carefully and Biblically. In the case of Mormon missionaries, the chances of making spiritual headway with them is almost nil (unless the Lord does a miracle) unless you carefully exchange their lies for truth. It is far too easy to drive them into atheism or farther into Mormonism through hyper-aggressive techniques. There is a time for pressing the point, but they have to have a foundation of truth first or you simply push them farther back into the quicksand of Mormon doctrine.

I wanted to make sure that he kept that perspective.

As for the comment that he should be nicer to the Mormons than he is to his Christian brothers and sisters here, I am referring specifically to his tendency to paint "liberals" or those he disagrees with in such broad terms that he slanders them. Consider his sigs to everyone of his recent posts -- "Better to stand for conservatism than to fall for liberalism" or worse, the current one ”Conservatives- Theology dictates morality/Liberals- morality dictates Theology”. That kind of broad brush characterization will get you nowhere with Mormons (or anyone else who disagrees with you).

I may have not expressed myself clearly enough on this point. I believe you should always let them know that you disagree with them whenever you do (most of the time), but you should look for places where there is agreement (it's rare, but Mormons aren't always orthodox to their faith and often they've picked up some Christian truth in spite of themselves).

I am truly sorry if I came across in an ugly fashion. I do not dislike your husband, but he does twist my tail now and then. I think the offensive message came from me in mid-twist.

I will be delighted to partner with you in this ministry. I have already been praying and will help in any way I can.

 

Wives have a way of doing that.

I am probably guilty of coming across as very harsh... As I explained in the previous post, the context of the message within the other messages is very important. I do not harbor ill will toward you or think you are beyond developing a friendship with. Also as I explained previously, your little .sig sayings and some of your blanket proclamations/characterizations/condemnations terribly annoy me because they aren't accurate or helpful in my opinion.

I do not regret what I said, but I do regret the way I said them, what I did not say in the context of the post, and how my statements probably appeared to you. I am truly sorry for any wrong I have done to you.

As I expressed in the previous post, I am very willing to work with you in this ministry (even if you don't let me, I'm going to continue praying anyway ) and am available to help in any way I can.