The Nation of Israel

It seems to me that the Askenazim have a pretty good claim to the ancient kingdoms of Judah and Israel but what were the ancient borders?..Even if we knew that, what right do modern Jews have to violently expell the folks whose ancesters lived on the land before, during, and after the time of the ancient kngdoms?
I agree with Kansas...God knows the answer, but politicians surely don't...
Let's pray today for peace among these peoples.
Amen.

 

As do I. My response is:

1- No
2- No
3- No
4- Yes, depending on the situation at hand.

 

From Palestinian TV

From Palestinian TV

From Palestinian TV

From Palestinian TV

From Palestinian TV

From PMW website: http://www.pmw.org.il/

[ January 19, 2005, 08:13 AM: Message edited by: LadyEagle ]

 

I stand with you, Lady! What we are hearing here is replacement theology once again. God says that He is going to gather the Jews from all over the world and bring them back to the land. That started in 1948. Jews are still the first-born. Do you replacement types disown your number one child whenever that child is disobedient?

(Beam me up, Scotty, there is no ....)

 

Dispensationalists also interpret much of Revelation as allegoriical. That is a far step from claiming that they believe that "Bible prophecies are allegorical".

For years after I was saved, I swallowed the line that only dispensationalists take the bible seriously. Boy was I wrong.

 

No.

 

Thank you, CMG. You are right, this is replacement theology and the worst part is, people make up their minds based on Palestinian prejudice and PLO propaganda fed to the West. This is the saddest thing I've witnessed on this board in over 10,000 posts. I'm ready to leave this board over the blatant anti-Semitism expressed here. I want no part of it.

 

Oh, don't worry about these replacement people. They invade message boards because they are unpopular in person. I read the back of the book--we win.

Guess what? I purchased a great book called A Systemic Theology of the Christian Religion by J. Oliver Buswell. That is some good book!

 

Postmillenillism and other forms of eschatology were here long before 1948. It is not even close to attribute these beliefs to modern middle-esatern politics. They have far more historical precedence as Christian doctrine than does dispensationalism.

I'm not arguing their biblical accuracy one way or the other, just pointing out that we should deal truthfully and not make false accusations.

 

But, PA Jim, God and the Abrahamic Covenant predate all other forms of eschatology. Replacement theology seeks to destroy that Abrahamic Covenant and declare it null and void - which is feeds right into anti-Semitism. Or declares that the present occupants of Israel are imposters, not true Jews. Replacement theology also seeks to destroy Evangelical Christians who stand behind the Nation of Israel 100%, branding us Zionists, dangerous right-wing fundamental extremists. Satan is the Father of Lies, even those that seem innocuous at first glance.

The day Baptists as a group come out as an entity and no longer stand behind Israel (which has not happened - EVERY Baptist I personally know stands behind Israel 100%) is the day I no longer call myself a Baptist.

I've posted video clips from some of the imams in Palestine. Listen to what the end-game is: The two-state solution is just a process on the way to achieving the end result - annihilation of Jews - those who worship on the Sabbath. Next it is annihilation of those who worship on the First Day of the week. Until all lands are claimed for allah. This is the third jihad.

The size of Israel is approximately 1/500th of the size of the present Arab lands - most of which were obtained through the sword of allah. First Israel, then America. First the Little Satan and then the Great Satan. Their proponents are already here in America spewing their hatred of us. One of those caught on video was the imam who participated in the Memorial Service for 09/11 at the National Cathedral. And just what do you think the Islamic private schools all up and down the Eastern Seaboard preach?

Wake up, people. Their own ideology speaks volumes. Their own preachers of hate speaks volumes. Nobody needs to make false accusations.

Yes, CMG, I've read the back of the Book, too, and I know we win. Praise God. But threads like this make me sick to my stomach.

 

See what I mean? Millions of Godly Christians, their pastors, their elders and/or deacons, over countless past generations, are simply relegated to "preachers of hate" by you.

Ever hear of Dietrich Bonhoeffer?

"...In October 1944, Bonhoeffer was moved to the Gestapo prison in Berlin. In February 1945, he was taken to the Buchenwald concentration camp, and then to the Flossenbürg concentration camp, where he was hanged on April 9, 1945. Hans von Dohnanyi was executed soonthereafter.

...Protestant theologian Dietrich Bonhoeffer stands out among the Christian leaders during the Nazi era, for he was one of the few to actively resist the racist actions of the Nazi regime.

...Bonhoeffer's defense of the Jews, however, was based on Christian supersessionism - the Christian belief that Christianity had superseded Judaism as the new chosen people of God.
SOURCE

Executed for his defense of the Jewish people...and you call him a "preacher of hate". How sad.

 

Whether right or wrong, none of the eschatological positions grows out of modern day middle east politics. They all predate that by many years.

 

You're right, PL. PA Jim, the "preachers of hate" I was referring to are the Muslim imams. Please don't misinterpret my posts.

 

Regarding the OP:

1)No
2)No
3)No
4)maybe, under similar ideas tha have already been presented.

 

1. State of Israel was created by the UN in 1948.

2. Most of continental USofA was stolen from the Indian People.

3. If the UN ordered everything west of the Mississippi to be returned to the Indian People . . . how does this differ legally and morally from the UN "returning" land to the Jews?

 

Why did Joshua state that God HAD fulfilled all his promises to Abraham?

 

From the close of the Apostolic era to the middle of the 18th century the Church universally "believed" that the blessings and cursings of Israel were transferred to the Church.

It was not until J.N. Darby popularized dispensationalism that there was a theological need for the existance of a political state of Israel.

 

Answers to original thread--

1. A quailified yes. It has to start somewhere. Do people feel that the Jews in Israel today will somehow all be totally removed before the Lord establishes the full biblical borders of the promise to Abraham?

2. No

3. No

4. No, the so-called Palestinians have no historical right to the land they are now living on. They need to return to their countries of origin, or become Israeli citizens. Our country would not let the hispanics to come in and settle a region of our land, and then later claim to be an independent nation.

Bro Tony

 

LE, I didn't intentionally misinterpret your post. What I did do was fail to read carefully and therefore unintentionally misinterpret. My apology. BTW, check out the info on Bonhoeffer, he was quite a guy.

BTW...I think the "Israel first, then the US" argument is empty. Islam is a threat to the US, but Israel is of no strategic importance.