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The Political Church
- Thread starter Nevada
- Start date
Tom Butler
New Member
My guess would be Rick Warren's Saddleback Church in California. A church with 25,000 members packs a pretty good political wallop if it wants to be.
For example, in 2008 John McCain and Barack Obama appeared in a candidates' forum at Saddleback, with pastor Warren asking the questions. Now that's clout.
On the other hand, I don't see Joel Osteen's Lakewood Church in Texas in the same way. It has 45,000 or so in in Sunday Services, but I don't think Joel is really interested in exerting political influence.
For example, in 2008 John McCain and Barack Obama appeared in a candidates' forum at Saddleback, with pastor Warren asking the questions. Now that's clout.
On the other hand, I don't see Joel Osteen's Lakewood Church in Texas in the same way. It has 45,000 or so in in Sunday Services, but I don't think Joel is really interested in exerting political influence.
The church will be apostate and it will be the Muslims that have the greatest political power.
Salty - that's a good outline.
Theologically . . . Reconstructionists tend to be OPC Presbyterians. Presbyterians are Reformed and claim to be Calvinists but the TULIP interpretation came along well after Calvin was dead and I think he would have rejected that emphasis. The Dutch Reformed (CRC, RCA) are more true to Calvin's teaching. I have been meeting with a CRC church and have never heard a discussion of TULIP. Calvin spent ten times more space writing about prayer than predestination.
Theologically . . . Reconstructionists tend to be OPC Presbyterians. Presbyterians are Reformed and claim to be Calvinists but the TULIP interpretation came along well after Calvin was dead and I think he would have rejected that emphasis. The Dutch Reformed (CRC, RCA) are more true to Calvin's teaching. I have been meeting with a CRC church and have never heard a discussion of TULIP. Calvin spent ten times more space writing about prayer than predestination.
for instance
For decades if not centuries, the Roman Catholic Church wanted the USA to spend tax money to send an ambassador to Vatican City. Presidents opposed it, as did most politicians, who back in those days were largely Protestant (Remember Protestant America?
) Jimmy Carter, even John F. Kennedy.
Then, the political balance of power changed, and Ronald Reagan began the practice. If our government chooses an ambassador who displeases The Vatican, they tell our government not to send them.
Times change.
Today, there are many new citizens from India. Hindus, usually, though Jindall down in Louisiana is Catholic. Well, our new Pakistani citizens have noticed that these Indians have more poltical clout than they do, and this can shape US policy toward their region of the world.
Then, there is the Israeli lobby.
Yup. One has to look hard for the line between politics and religion, sometimes.
For decades if not centuries, the Roman Catholic Church wanted the USA to spend tax money to send an ambassador to Vatican City. Presidents opposed it, as did most politicians, who back in those days were largely Protestant (Remember Protestant America?
) Jimmy Carter, even John F. Kennedy.Then, the political balance of power changed, and Ronald Reagan began the practice. If our government chooses an ambassador who displeases The Vatican, they tell our government not to send them.
Times change.
Today, there are many new citizens from India. Hindus, usually, though Jindall down in Louisiana is Catholic. Well, our new Pakistani citizens have noticed that these Indians have more poltical clout than they do, and this can shape US policy toward their region of the world.
Then, there is the Israeli lobby.
Yup. One has to look hard for the line between politics and religion, sometimes.
SpiritualMadMan
New Member
This is a sad but true statement, *if*, the church refuses to take her place in Leading and Guiding the Nation with the Light from above.
My own view is that we are far too far gone for Legal or Political Activism, as important as they are, to save the Nation.
There is only one Nation Healing Promise in the Bible and that is 2 Chronicles 7:14 and it is addressed to God's People.
While attending Sherwood Baptist Church, they have a 24/7 Prayer tower, I asked the question what would it take to get a "good" church like Sherwood on it's knees.
And, this is the problem, as I, a Penetcostal see it, the majority of Pentecostals and Charismatics have sworn off Holiness unto the Lord and started preaching Godliness is a means for gain.
So, they are too distracted and self-absorbed in the materialism of this world. Not that a few Baptists aren't the same way.
But, (some) Baptists have a different problem they were never brought up on intercessory prayer, or warfare prayer and some tenents of the more radical versions of Calvinism lend themselves to accepting the end of the age as a given and therefore we should not bother to pray for any changes.
Yet, Abraham interceded for Lot and the cities of the plains. he didn't save the cities but his intecession saved Lot and his daughters.
And, we should have confidence that even as every time Israel repented and turned back to God, God healed their land.
He can do it again for us just as we had a Youth Revival in the 70's
Anyone remember a book by Willard Cantelon, "The Day The Dollar Dies"? And, the general hopelessness of the country until the Jesus People started waking the church up?
One last item to chew on. I believe that the church age is a parenthetical clause and that mainline Bible Prophecy has been suspended for an indeterminate time period until the Father decides enough is enough.
This means, if I am right, the conduct of the church may, note I said may, have the ability to either extend our Nations Life Span or abandon it.
One thing the church should repent of is the fact that we haven't taken good care of the Miracle of Our Nation as we should have.
We have squandered her majesty and righteousness in peripheral issues and allowed the enemy to seed tumors (many cancerous) in the organ of Government.
There is only one Healer that can Heal this Nation and His Name is Jesus.
2 Chronicles 7:14 is to all of us. If we will hear.