Originally posted by npetreley:
Does anyone else but me see this whole "purpose driven life" and "purpose driven church" as being nothing more than feel-good trendy fluff filled with error and unscriptural assumptions?
Yes npetreley to get back to your question. I see it as a book of works. It seems to me the good Reverend has good intentions and pushes things to the point that we are to feel guilty, if we do not do it the way he lays it out, and we must work within a 40 day time limit. Rush, rush, rush, and do, do, do to be accepted. It has a lot of good points, but he is actually taking us back to the past.
Don’t get me wrong, for I’m not saying Pastor Warren is not saved. I’m just saying the book reveals from what position he comes from. The author states where he lives, and it is in the past. He states his understanding of scripture is from Israel's viewpoint. These people were of works, just as James says, and Mr. Warren seems to embrace that belief.
On page 9 he labels himself to be a proselyte of that religion – Quote “The Bible is clear that God considers 40 days a
spiritually significant time period. Whenever God wanted to prepare someone for his purposes, he took 40 days.” Unquote. And I completely agree with him. Then on page 12 as he winds up the ending before starting he wants us to “sign – up, commit – swear” to a 40 day “spiritual” journey on that path of 40’s. Well I believe we all should understand that “works” are dead today and so should 40 be kept out of our terminology when speaking of His grace today that we are in. Those days when God told His people if you do this, I’ll do that, are gone. The time of “their” testing is over. One came that ended the 40 assigned to Israel for testing. Christ fulfilled that for His people, and in the process, as they refused Messiah, God will make them “jealous” just as he promised “if they went to other gods”. Enter Damascus Road.
What Mr. Warren doesn’t understand is the significance of what he preaches. I see this same thing in not just other denominations, but also many Baptists. The Bible teaches us that forty (40) is Israel’s number. It is always tied to them. We do not find it ever attached to the Christian. Forty denotes a time of probation and divine testing. We must remember these are the people that God chose for Himself. All others were discarded. They wandered around for 40 years while being tested before getting to the Promised Land.
“Give me a man to fight with” Goliath taunted them for 40 days.
Forty days and forty nights Moses was on Mt. Sinai receiving the Law. Israel with their “works” of “calf” worship failed those 40 days and nights of testing.
Discipline and testing. The list goes on. Forty days Christ was tempted of the devil, with Christ the Victor. He was tested and won out.
We cannot find we are to “reverence” and apply to us that which God does not apply to us. That was then, and today all “forty” will do is take us either back in time, or into the tribulation as seen in the book of Revelation. And if I may say, we know there are some on this board that advocate just that. They expect to go through the “great tribulation”, and perhaps they may get their wish.
There are things that give away what people actually believe. I see Warren’s book mixing “works” with “grace”. If of “works” is it any more “grace”? If of “grace” won’t that produce “works”? Yes, but “grace” never even hints we are to go back to “works” to find the purpose of God, or of why we are here. The “grace” gospel of “through” faith puts us into the one that “did the works” for us. He is the one that we died with on the Cross, with whom we are made dead to sin that came by the “curse” of the Law that required works. Works is dead, as is those of “covenant”, those of “testing” who failed in that assigned for them in their allotted time, of their number forties (40’s). All things are now New. We are not to try and resurrect that which Jesus buried. We are not on probation, or in a “dispensation” of divine testing. We are saved and our mission is that of spreading the gospel of the “grace commission” of “believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved”. If we add anything to the words of Christ from heaven it will always take us back to those of the forties (40’s)
Are these just idle words of “misunderstanding”, or will scripture prove this to be true? Take the time to check it out. Israel is promised this earth, and 40 is never used otherwise. We can prove this even in this dispensation. Was there anything of significance that happened in the 1940’s. Most definitely, and it even hooks up with another number to give further relevance of what is going on, and giving us a sign post that God is on track of heading back this way. In 1948 Israel was recognized by the world again, as a “nation”. Forty will again be significant as the number eight (8) denotes a “New Beginning”. Israel is again recognized by the world, and in the tribulation “works” will again be required of His people. They will be back in prophecy once we not in prophecy are taken up.
We must decide which “church” we are in. Are we in the “church” in Antioch, or in the church at Jerusalem? Jerusalem says works brought us to faith, but Antioch says faith is apart from works, but works will come naturally for the “spiritual”.
James says: [/I]”What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?,”[/I] James 2:14. James' answer in verse 17,
”Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone,” Who is James taking to? He tells us in the very first verse in His book. He does not address me. His book is for informational purposes only to all today in this “dispensation”. He addressed the 12 tribes only.
Paul says:
”Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law”, Romans 3:28. How does Paul come to this conclusion?
”For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9. Not of works, lest any man should boast,” Ephesians 2:8-9. Who is Paul talking to? Me a Gentile as seen in verse 11,
”Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands.”
To me it sure looks like it will be “how” we believe, and “who” we believed that will determine the way we enter into the “kingdom”, i.e. going
by way of the tribulation, or coming
through Christ Jesus.
Christian faith, ituttut
