The Rev. Franklin Graham disinvited

[rbell]

I disagree with the decision, but it shows what happens when church and state are mixed.

I thought we as true Baptists believed that the state should keep their noses out of our business and we should keep our noses out of theirs? Have we not historically believed that?

Fine line, though...we as an "official" church body shouldn't get mixed up in state affairs...but individual believers have every right to do so...and some might argue a responsibility.

But when a Christian, acting as a private citizen, expresses belief, faith, etc., that is in no wise tantamount to "Government establishment."

Face it...He was nixed for having expressed the truth of the exclusivity of Christ for salvation. And you can't do that in our country anymore...at least not in the public eye. And definitely not in any realm that in any way intersects any form, function, structure, or operation of government.

And being honest...how many places are there anymore in which government does not at least play a tangential role?


****10 bonus points for the use of "tantamount" AND "tangential." :saint:

****minus 5 points for disagreeing with a mod.

 

[rbell]

Excellent perspective. We have been misled into thinking that the ceremonial status actually meant something.

You know...off-subject, but one of my high-schoolers said something utterly profound one time.

We were doing mission work in the Czech Republic. On the last day, we took the kids to Prague to be "tourists" for a day. We were visiting the St. Vitus Cathedral in Prague...one of the most magnificent cathedrals in existence--an 800 year-old marvel of architecture, art, engineering, and beauty.

One of my kids, on the tour, commented on the cathedral. What he said was so profound, I actually wrote it down. He said:

"You know...I know the church isn't the people...but this isn't even a place where folks meet God anymore. Walking around in this building makes me amazed. But I'm not humbled. I'm not awed."

May we never reach the point where our "religion" impresses the crowds...yet all the while they fail to see the God that could truly fill them with wonder, conviction, and awe.

 

[go2church]

Why is the Pentagon having a prayer service in the first place? I can imagine how that would go, "Dear Lord, help our bombs kill lots of people".

The Army looks real bad here, they should have been aware of what FG said before they invited him. It's not like it was some kind of secret.

Graham will probably be sending out a fund raising letter in the next week or so, who knew standing firm could be so profitable!

 

[Revmitchell]

Why is the Pentagon having a prayer service in the first place? I can imagine how that would go, "Dear Lord, help our bombs kill lots of people".

The Army looks real bad here, they should have been aware of what FG said before they invited him. It's not like it was some kind of secret.

Graham will probably be sending out a fund raising letter in the next week or so, who knew standing firm could be so profitable!

Such nonsense really shows the true attitude of liberals.

 

[lori4dogs]

Remember the joy and glee of much of the Muslim world when the four hijacked airliners were used as weapons to murder thousands of innocent people. The tragic loss of family members, children, office workers, travelers, etc was horrible enough but the scenes of Muslims dancing in the streets were inhumane, disgusting and outrageous.

God bless Rev. Graham for standing up for Jesus!

 

[rbell]

I think at any Washington D.C. gathering...it's quite likely that an appropriate prayer would be one of Jesus':

"Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do..."

 

[Scarlett O.]

Why is the Pentagon having a prayer service in the first place? I can imagine how that would go, "Dear Lord, help our bombs kill lots of people".

I checked your profile and see that you claim to be 39 years old. I was somewhat surprised at that.

Did you know that much of what goes on at the Pentagon does includes planning and finding ways NOT to bomb people? Did you know that there ARE Christians who work there and who do pray and that many of our men and women in uniform ARE Christians?

The Army looks real bad here, they should have been aware of what FG said before they invited him. It's not like it was some kind of secret.

Are you aware of what he said? When he said it? And the context of what he said? Are you aware that he has a son in Afghanistan?

Graham will probably be sending out a fund raising letter in the next week or so, who knew standing firm could be so profitable!

I, for one, am grateful that someone on a national level IS standing firm and proclaiming that Jesus is the only way to the only God.

About this funding raising thing - I have no clue what you are talking about.

 

[jaigner]

Why is the Pentagon having a prayer service in the first place? I can imagine how that would go, "Dear Lord, help our bombs kill lots of people".

The Army looks real bad here, they should have been aware of what FG said before they invited him. It's not like it was some kind of secret.

Graham will probably be sending out a fund raising letter in the next week or so, who knew standing firm could be so profitable!

I'm completely with you. (And I'm no liberal, revmitchell.)

Just wondering go2, have you heard of the "American Patriot's Bible," a nationalistic piece of garbage veiled as a copy of God's Word? It hijacks holy Scripture and uses it for a purely patriotic agenda. The worst thing about tit is how it presupposes that we have God on our side, particularly in our military agenda. I wonder if God is really pleased that we slaughter His image-bearers in His name.

Not sure how you feel about it, but thought I would ask. I also don't see much of a reason for a Pentagon prayer service.

 

[matt wade]

(And I'm no liberal, revmitchell.)

That's debatable.

 

[jaigner]

That's debatable.

Not really. Thanks for a compelling comment.

 

[sag38]

Why is the Pentagon having a prayer service in the first place? I can imagine how that would go, "Dear Lord, help our bombs kill lots of people".

The Army looks real bad here, they should have been aware of what FG said before they invited him. It's not like it was some kind of secret.

Graham will probably be sending out a fund raising letter in the next week or so, who knew standing firm could be so profitable!

Mix liberalism with pacifism and and presto you get stupid statements like this. .

 

[go2church]

Seems like there are plenty here that need to unwrap the flag from their Christianity, it's blocking your ability to see straight. I'll meet you half way the Pentagon can a have a prayer service, but how about a Imam lead. What you don't want a Muslim praying in the Pentagon!? Can't have it both ways folks. It's all or nothing, I choose nothing.

Graham is known entity, that the Army invited him anyway and is now backing away makes them look very bad indeed.

That there are Christians serving at the Pentagon or in the Army is off topic really, but I would be willing to engage the conversation on another thread, "Should Christians serve in the military?" There are many believers, Baptist and otherwise, who don't think so.

I don't think Graham should "give in" to his critics, this is a free country and he should be able to say what he thinks. But he or any other minister shouldn't be leading prayer services at the Pentagon. As to is son, has nothing to do with anything, Graham is his own man as his own son. When I get my fund raising letter I will let you know.

I have heard of the Patriot's Bible and I agree with your line of thinking. Every time I walk past a stack I turn them over covers face down.

 

[jaigner]

I have heard of the Patriot's Bible and I agree with your line of thinking. Every time I walk past a stack I turn them over covers face down.

I hide them behind the TNIV.

 

[lori4dogs]

I believe that 'political correctness' may well be the noose that hangs this country. The Dome of the Rock in Jerusalem, has huge Arabic words all along its outside proclaiming:

“The unity of God and prophecy of Muhammed are true. The Sonship of Jesus and the Trinity are false.”

What if you had a Church with signs outside of it condemning Islam in this country??

 

[matt wade]

I believe that 'political correctness' may well be the noose that hangs this country. The Dome of the Rock in Jerusalem, has huge Arabic words all along its outside proclaiming:

“The unity of God and prophecy of Muhammed are true. The Sonship of Jesus and the Trinity are false.”

What if you had a Church with signs outside of it condemning Islam in this country??

There are churches like this. One here in Jacksonville has received tons of criticism from every Islamic group imaginable.

 

[Jedi Knight]

Does our CONSTITUTION use reference to the Lord of the Bible or "god" of the Korahn? Seems this WAS settled long ago before liberals wanted to reinvent the wheel.

 

[Revmitchell]

Seems like there are plenty here that need to unwrap the flag from their Christianity,

Conservatives do not lead dual hypocritical lives. We include God in our churches, homes, schools, governments, etc. If you do not like a country founded on Biblical principles you are in the wrong country. China might be a good alternative.

 

[Magnetic Poles]

Conservatives do not lead dual hypocritical lives. We include God in our churches, homes, schools, governments, etc. If you do not like a country founded on Biblical principles you are in the wrong country. China might be a good alternative.

If you don't like a country founded on the values of The Enlightenment, you are in the wrong country. Iran might be a good alternative.

Funny how if our country were founded on Christianity, the founders failed to mention it in our secular Constitution.

 

[go2church]

Many are missing the point. I don't care what you think, believe, pray, say or put on the outside of your whatever building. But the government doesn't get to be the arbitrator of what is prayed, said or believed nor do they get to support one religion over the other. Hosting a prayer service and inviting a Christian minister to pray is acting as an arbitrator and supporting one religion over the other.

Where am I again? Isn't this supposed to be the BAPTIST Board? What happened, this is basic, Baptist 101 stuff.

 

[jaigner]

It's almost like Christians want the government and society as a whole to make them feel comfortable. As Christians, we shouldn't be worried about that. This is a kingdom of the world and it will pass away, should Christ tarry. Our business shouldn't be trying to change the government, it should be reaching out to people, like the Muslims or anyone else.