The Sabbath- Do we still need to keep it?

[BobRyan]

Do you keep the Sabbath? If not, then you are breaking the law and under it's curse.

What does Mark 7 say about "invalidating the Word of God for the sake of the traditions of men"??

I Jn 5:2-3
2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

Rev 12:17
17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Rev 14:12
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Rev 22:14
14[b] Blessed are they that do his commandments,[/b] that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

I Jn 2:3-4
3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

1 Corinthians 7:19
Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but what matters is the keeping of the commandments of God.

 

[BobRyan]

Bob you are being redundant to say the least. There is no way that "HIS" commandments include the "Ten Commandments." .

DHK says of GOD THE SON-- pre-CROSS that HIS commandments DO NOT include the TEN Commandments of GOD!!

Jesus says this "Christ is NOT the Author the Ten Commandments" notion "because they are GOD's not Christ's" -- is dead wrong. Blind devotion to man-made tradition over the pure Word of God...

John 12
44 And Jesus cried out and said, "" He who believes in Me, does not believe in Me but in Him who sent Me.
45 "" He who sees Me sees the One who sent Me.
46 "" I have come as Light into the world, so that everyone who believes in Me will not remain in darkness.
47 ""If anyone hears My sayings and does not keep them, I do not judge him; for I did not come to judge the world, but to save the world.
48 "" He who rejects Me and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day.
49 "" For I did not speak on My own initiative, but the Father Himself who sent Me has given Me a commandment as to what to say and what to speak.
50 ""I know that His commandment is eternal life; therefore the things I speak, I speak just as the Father has told Me.''

 

[BobRyan]

Matt 5:27-28 27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

Instead of “less obedience” to each commandment of Christ the Creator – God calls for “more”. No wonder Paul says --

Romans 3:31 [b]“Do we then abolish the Law of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we Establish the Law of God”[/b]

I Jn 2:3-4
3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

1 Corinthians 7:19
Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but what matters is the keeping of the commandments of God.

Ephesians 6
1 Children, obey your parents in the Lord, for this is right.
2 HONOR YOUR FATHER AND MOTHER (which is the first commandment with a promise),
3 SO THAT IT MAY BE WELL WITH YOU, AND THAT YOU MAY LIVE LONG ON THE EARTH.

 

[BobRyan]

Reminds me of what D.L.Moody said about the TEN COMMANDMENTS!!

 

[DHK]

Reminds me of what D.L.Moody said about the TEN COMMANDMENTS!!

And what did Moody say about the Ten Commandments? Not the same thing that you think he said. He believed that the Sabbath Day was Sunday. You really ought to stop slandering him and trying to use him to justify your SDA theology. He did not believe in the Sabbath, but only considered Sunday to be the Sabbath. There is a big difference.

 

[grahame]

What's with all this red large lettering all the time? I don't mind a bit of emphasis on certain texts. But when folk emphasise everything they write, then it becomes a bit pointless. Not only that, but I find I can only focus on it from the other side of the room. :wavey: :laugh:

 

[BobRyan]

Always glad to help someone stay focused!

The reason they are always in that format - is that I am building files for the various points raised.. when a set of texts are found to be particularly efficient in answering a given point - I file them. So they always come back the same way.

As for the color highlights - I do it because there are many who are "reading-intolerant" and only scan for the highlights.

I post in larger letters because a few members here have said that they need larger letters to read the posts and they skip the posts with smaller fonts

In Christ,

Bob

 

[DHK]

There are some here that automatically assume that large red letters express a very angry person's thoughts.

 

[BobRyan]

Hey wait a second - what about red letters express a "Bible quote" and bold red indicates "read this - it is important".

 

[grahame]

Well, no it's not that I think people are angry. I apologise, I didn't mean to offend anyone. It was just an observation, that's all. Please don't be guided by my neanderthal ramblings. :smilewinkgrin:

 

[BobRyan]

In that case here is a colorful quote that includes some insights from DHK on what the Law of God is "still today" in terms of defining what sin is - (what mankind is held accountable for still today)...

Sin is sin Bob, when will you come to that realization--that God hates ALL sin.
Sin is a transgression of the law--God's law, Christ's law. The law that says:
Pray without ceasing;
Love your neighbor as yourself; (Lev 19:18)
Love the Lord your God with all your heart, strength, mind, and soul; (Deut 6:5)
http://www.baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=944316&postcount=272

Well first of all - glad to see DHK INCLUDING parts of the WORD of God in here that he is usually so happy to flee ... as "The commandments" and "laws" of God that define sin.


What about "Love Me and Keep My Commandments"??

4 "" You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth.
5 "" You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me,
6 but showing lovingkindness to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.

DHK

are just as much sin as lying (Exod 20:15)
and stealing, (Exod 20:16)

for they are commands as well.

Whoa! DHK is actually admitting that it is SIN to rebel against God's Commandments!!???

DHK

Sin is sin. All sin is a transgression of God's law. The fact is that you don't have a realization of God's law, Christ's law, and the holiness of God.

Hint: CHRIST IS GOD!!

But other than that -- what a great turn about for DHK!!

Can't believe I am actually seeing him do this!!

In Christ,

Bob

 

[DHK]

But other than that -- what a great turn about for DHK!!

Can't believe I am actually seeing him do this!!

In Christ,

Bob

Yes Bob, I believe in The Nine Commandments. That is, all Ten except the Sabbath. The Sabbath was given to Israel alone as is specifically explained in Exodus 31. One cannot get around that portion of Scripture. There is nowhere in the Bible that commands Gentile Christians to keep the Sabbath during this church age (that is, before the coming of Christ). Nowhere. You can't demonstrate that from Scripture, therefore you have an unbiblical doctrine.

 

[Brother Bob]

DHK;Christ did not teach them to keep the Ten Commandments. He taught them the gospel. He taught them about the new birth. He taught them the Great Commission. He taught them about his coming death, burial and resurrection. He avoided the law, unless it was deliberately brought up.

Yes Bob, I believe in The Nine Commandments. That is, all Ten except the Sabbath. The Sabbath was given to Israel alone as is specifically explained in Exodus 31. One cannot get around that portion of Scripture. There is nowhere in the Bible that commands Gentile Christians to keep the Sabbath during this church age (that is, before the coming of Christ). Nowhere. You can't demonstrate that from Scripture, therefore you have an unbiblical doctrine.
__________________
DHK

Which is it, keep them or not keep them. You speak both ways and hard to understand. A double minded man is unstable in his ways.

Also, to compare or righteous with God's righteous we are as filthy rags. That in no way means we then can sin.

1 Cor 6
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.
11 Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.
__________________

You can't pick and choose, you either take all of God's word or none.

 

[DHK]

Yes Bob, I believe in The Nine Commandments. That is, all Ten except the Sabbath. The Sabbath was given to Israel alone as is specifically explained in Exodus 31. One cannot get around that portion of Scripture. There is nowhere in the Bible that commands Gentile Christians to keep the Sabbath during this church age (that is, before the coming of Christ). Nowhere. You can't demonstrate that from Scripture, therefore you have an unbiblical doctrine.
__________________
DHK

Which is it, keep them or not keep them. You speak both ways and hard to understand. A double minded man is unstable in his ways.

The Sabbath was given to the Jews and only to the Jews. It was never given to the Gentiles, not to the Christians--Gentile or Jew.

Exodus 31:12-17 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, Speak thou also unto the children of Israel, saying,
13 Verily my sabbaths ye shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that ye may know that I am the LORD that doth sanctify you.
14 Ye shall keep the sabbath therefore; for it is holy unto you: every one that defileth it shall surely be put to death: for whosoever doeth any work therein, that soul shall be cut off from among his people.
15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, for a perpetual covenant.
17 It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.

The Sabbath was a specific sign between Jehovah and the nation of Israel, a sign of a covenant made between them and their generations forever. It has nothing to do with the Gentiles or Christians. This passage makes it very clear. In spite of the fact that God included the Sabbath day within the body of the Ten Commandments it has nothing to do with us today.

Also, to compare or righteous with God's righteous we are as filthy rags. That in no way means we then can sin.

With what kind of reasoning do you get that? You misquote 1Cor.6:9-11 continually, and so now do you take Isa.64:6 and twist its meaning. Let's take a look at this passage that you have quoted first:

1 Cor 6
9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.
11 Such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

A fornicator is not one who has once or even twice had an affair. He is one who lives a lifestyle of doing such.
An idolater is the same way. It is not one who has committed idolatry just a few times in his life; but one who continually lives that way.
An adulterer is not one who has slipped up in his married life once or even twice, but is one who does so continuously does so without any intent of repentance or change of mind.
The same is true of all others mentioned.

Your self-righteousness is your filthy rags. That includes your pride, your reputation which you think highly of, your Pharisaical attitude, your demeanour to others, your "always think your right attitude," and so on. That is what this verse is speaking of. Your own self-righteousnesses, your own good works. They are as filthy rags before God. They will not get you anywhere before God. They stink. They are just as bad as adultery, homosexuality, lesbianism, fornication, being effeminate, idolatry, and all the above mentioned sins in 1Cor.6:9-11.
It is all wickedness in God's sight. And all that wickedness keeps you out of heaven. It makes no difference in God's sight. Sin is sin.

You can't pick and choose, you either take all of God's word or none.

Finally you get it. You can't pick and choose.
Being a homosexual is just as bad as being a liar or being self-righteous, or displaying the sin of pride. Any one of them will keep you out of heaven.
And according to your theology (which I do not believe), if you die with unconfessed sin (any of them) you will go to hell.

 

[Brother Bob]

A fornicator is not one who has once or even twice had an affair. He is one who lives a lifestyle of doing such.
An idolater is the same way. It is not one who has committed idolatry just a few times in his life; but one who continually lives that way.
An adulterer is not one who has slipped up in his married life once or even twice, but is one who does so continuously does so without any intent of repentance or change of mind.
The same is true of all others mentioned.

All of the above is false. How can you say you have to do it over and over and over before you are guilty. Yikes!!!!

Your self-righteousness is your filthy rags. That includes your pride, your reputation which you think highly of, your Pharisaical attitude, your demeanour to others, your "always think your right attitude," and so on. That is what this verse is speaking of. Your own self-righteousnesses, your own good works. They are as filthy rags before God. They will not get you anywhere before God. They stink. They are just as bad as adultery, homosexuality, lesbianism, fornication, being effeminate, idolatry, and all the above mentioned sins in 1Cor.6:9-11.
It is all wickedness in God's sight. And all that wickedness keeps you out of heaven. It makes no difference in God's sight. Sin is sin.

Again, you speak as a man who needs help. IMO

And according to your theology (which I do not believe), if you die with unconfessed sin (any of them) you will go to hell.
__________________
DHK

I know and you believe if you die committing adultery you will be singing with the angels. foolish IMO

 

[BobRyan]

The Sabbath was given to the Jews and only to the Jews. It was never given to the Gentiles, not to the Christians--Gentile or Jew.

How sad that such Bible-denying man-made traditions are chanted in loud chorus to drowned out the still small voice of scripture speaking truth to the soul.

As for scripture...

"From Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before ME to worship" Isaiah 66.

"The SABBATH was MADE for MANKIND" Mark 2:27.

So what of the empty vapid traditions of man set in firm opposition to these clear statements of scripture?

Mark 7
6 And He said to them, ""Rightly did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written: " THIS PEOPLE HONORS ME WITH THEIR LIPS[/b], BUT THEIR HEART IS FAR AWAY FROM ME.
7 " BUT IN VAIN DOTHEY WORSHIP ME, TEACHING AS DOCTRINES THE PRECEPTS OF MEN.'
8 ""Neglecting the commandment of God, you hold to the tradition of men.''
9 He was also saying to them, ""You are experts at setting aside the commandment of God in order to keep your tradition.[/b]
10 ""For Moses said, " HONOR YOUR FATHER AND YOUR MOTHER[/b]'; and, " HE WHO SPEAKS EVIL OF FATHER OR MOTHER, IS TO BE PUT TO DEATH';

11 but you say, "If a man says to his father or his mother, whatever I have that would help you is Corban (that is to say, given to God),'
12 you no longer permit him to do anything for his father or his mother;
13 thus invalidating the Word of God by your tradition[/b] which you have handed down; and you do many things such as that.''

 

[BobRyan]

Yes Bob, I believe in The Nine Commandments. That is, all Ten except the Sabbath.

#1. Christ already addressed that heresy.

Matt 5
17 ""[b]Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets[/b]; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill.
18 ""For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest letter or stroke shall pass from the Law[/b] until all is accomplished.
19 ""[b]Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same[/b], shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but [b]whoever keeps and teaches them[/b], he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

#2. There are MANY references in SCRIPTURE to "THE TEN COMMANDMENTS" -- there are NO references in scripture to "THE NINE COMMANDMENTS"...

Only in made made traditions do we find such error.

In Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

DHK said --
The Sabbath was given to Israel alone

That is what you say --

But what does GOD say in Scripture?

"From Sabbath to Sabbath shall ALL MANKIND come before ME to worship" Isaiah 66.

"The SABBATH was MADE for MANKIND" Mark 2:27.

 

[BobRyan]

DHK said --
are just as much sin as lying (Exod 20:15)
and stealing, (Exod 20:16)

for they are commands as well.

Just as much sin as Sabbath breaking Exodus 20:8-11 for it is commanded as well...

In Christ,

Bob

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

DHK, you truly act as a fighter in a corner. All over you apprear to be on the retreat. I believe simply because you are talking against your own better knowing, consciously.

If Christ says He is the LORD of the Sabbath Day, to a Christian that is Christ's Command to him to regard the Lord's Day.

If God says that "if Jesus had given them rest" and that "therefore the Sabbath remains for the People of God", then that's a Command, the LORD "God thus concerning the Seventh Day spake".

If the Scriptures say that the Sabbath remains for the People of God "because He entered into His own Rest AS GOD IN HIS OWN", we, believers in Jesus, understand the greatest of all commands from the Saviour, that God has entered upon His Sabbath rest at last "through the Son ... in these last days". "GOD IN HIS OWN": IS, "God, in the exceeding greatness of His power exercising ..." (Eph1), "refreshing Himself" (Ex31:17). That is a Commandment to Israel of God, to keep the Seventh Day Sabbath

Etcetera, by the score, in and from the New Testament.