The Seven Days of Creation

[37818]

It rules out your idea that there was time before the first day because Adam was there when God created male and female and Jesus says that that is from the beginning. In other words, Adam was there at the beginning of Creation. The days, of course, are 24-hour days because that is the meaning of the word and because we have the genealogies to give us a picture that it is 6000 years from Adam to you.

So you think.

 

[37818]

It is missing in the OT

We have an example in Mary's genealogy
Luk 3:23

And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed ) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli,

Yes. The Greek in the list are with the genitive case article, being translated "of." Joseph being "of Heli" being the son in law. The words, "the son," being added by the translator.

 

[37818]

And yet the earth existed. It is part of the original creation as is the heavens.



This verse is being misused. It was never intended to be used to prove millions of years it simply meant that those who were speaking were trying to speak of things about God for which they had no knowledge. We have knowledge on this issue because it is plain and clear in scripture.

What is not plain and clear in scripture is this Gap Theory or Ruin-Reconstruction Theory. Its not in scripture and scripture nowhere eludes to it, implies it, or allows for it. It is purely made up out of whole cloth.

Yeah, YEC interpretation. That mere saying that, does not prove my understanding wrong.

 

[Revmitchell]

Yeah, YEC interpretation. That mere saying that, does not prove my understanding wrong.

It does

Here is my second line

Oh what the heck here is a third line

 

[37818]

It does

So you think.

 

[church mouse guy]

So you think.

So all YECs think that Jesus is right that Adam and Eve were at the very beginning of Creation.

 

[rlvaughn]

I started this thread with hope to find some information – that those who believe that the 7 days of creation are 1000 years, indefinite periods, etc. would give a positive biblical argument supporting their position. I have read back on the four pages and, in my opinion, did not find that – with one exception. More of it seemed to be agreement with prevailing science, the argument from silence, or, extended, that since the text does not say 24 hours then it might be any one of the meanings attached to the word “day” in the Bible. However, I do not think I saw a positive argument why we should choose one of the other meanings over the 24-hour day meaning. If you feel I have overlooked your positive argument, please point it out.
The one who did give a positive statement of his position was Baptist Believer, who wrote:

There are a number of reasons, but the one that is most compelling to me is that we are still in the seventh day of creation. God "rested" in His creation (note, God was not tired, He has placed His presence in His creation, and He remains here.)

Hebrews 4:4-9
For He has said somewhere concerning the seventh day: “And God rested on the seventh day from all His works”; and again in this passage, “They shall not enter My rest.” Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it, and those who formerly had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience, He again fixes a certain day, “Today,” saying through David after so long a time just as has been said before,

“Today if you hear His voice,
Do not harden your hearts.” (note, the writer of Hebrews is referencing Psalm 95:7-11)
​

For if Joshua had given them rest, He would not have spoken of another day after that. So there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God.​

I do not agree with this line of argument, but recognize it as one setting out a position, rather than just negating someone else’s. I wonder, if you believe that God’s creative days were long periods, not 24 hours, do you agree that this line of argument above supports your conclusion? Would you use it? Why or why not?

 

[37818]

I started this thread with hope to find some information – that those who believe that the 7 days of creation are 1000 years, indefinite periods, etc. would give a positive biblical argument supporting their position. I have read back on the four pages and, in my opinion, did not find that – with one exception. More of it seemed to be agreement with prevailing science, the argument from silence, or, extended, that since the text does not say 24 hours then it might be any one of the meanings attached to the word “day” in the Bible. However, I do not think I saw a positive argument why we should choose one of the other meanings over the 24-hour day meaning. If you feel I have overlooked your positive argument, please point it out.
The one who did give a positive statement of his position was Baptist Believer, who wrote:

I do not agree with this line of argument, but recognize it as one setting out a position, rather than just negating someone else’s. I wonder, if you believe that God’s creative days were long periods, not 24 hours, do you agree that this line of argument above supports your conclusion? Would you use it? Why or why not?

Before I had understood the ramification of a truely global flood I held a day age interpretation of the 7 days based on Genesis 2:4, ". . . in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens, . . ." In the understanding that week of days being called "the day."

 

[37818]

So all YECs think that Jesus is right that Adam and Eve were at the very beginning of Creation.

I know Jesus is right. ". . . from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female. . . ." Being done on the 6th earth day.

 

[loDebar]

I started this thread with hope to find some information – that those who believe that the 7 days of creation are 1000 years, indefinite periods, etc. would give a positive biblical argument supporting their position. I have read back on the four pages and, in my opinion, did not find that – with one exception. More of it seemed to be agreement with prevailing science, the argument from silence, or, extended, that since the text does not say 24 hours then it might be any one of the meanings attached to the word “day” in the Bible. However, I do not think I saw a positive argument why we should choose one of the other meanings over the 24-hour day meaning. If you feel I have overlooked your positive argument, please point it out.
The one who did give a positive statement of his position was Baptist Believer, who wrote:

I do not agree with this line of argument, but recognize it as one setting out a position, rather than just negating someone else’s. I wonder, if you believe that God’s creative days were long periods, not 24 hours, do you agree that this line of argument above supports your conclusion? Would you use it? Why or why not?

God 's yowm were ages, era, or epochs or whatever He wanted. The evidence is those that were here during this time before man, shouted at Light being given. They were surprised. The angels in Heaven sang Praises to Gid fr giving those in darkness Light. Their response indicates that beings who had never known darkness needed Light

 

[rlvaughn]

God 's yowm were ages, era, or epochs or whatever He wanted.

Without question, the word “day” (yom) is used three or four different ways in the Bible, for example – (1) a 24 hour cycle (day & night, evening & morning); (2) the period of light between sunrise and sunset (i.e. daylight); or (3) some unspecified length of time or a point or time. The context determines the meaning. IMO, the context of Genesis 1-2 supports the meaning of 24-hour days. When Moses in his writings uses “day” with a numerical adjective (first day, second day, three days, four days, etc.) he means days that we understand as days of 24-hour duration. I am not aware of any exceptions to this.

The evidence is those that were here during this time before man, shouted at Light being given. They were surprised. The angels in Heaven sang Praises to Gid fr giving those in darkness Light. Their response indicates that beings who had never known darkness needed Light

Would you clarify how you think this supports the idea of days as eras, eons in Genesis 1?

 

[Deacon]

I started this thread with hope to find some information – that those who believe that the 7 days of creation are 1000 years, indefinite periods, etc. would give a positive biblical argument supporting their position.

A thread on this topic is simply not going to give you the depth of information you need.
There are a number of different approaches to the problem of the age of the earth that do not take the Genesis day as 24 hour periods

1. Progressive Creationism (Bernard Ramm, Hugh Ross), I’d recommend You read Ross’ book, A Matter of Days, where he discusses biblical reasons to view the days as long periods.
2. Gap Theory, a rather old approach to the problem, popular in its time but quite lacking in biblical support.

These fall under the heading of “Day/Age” for the Genesis day.

Additionally another approach, Theistic Evolution, and/or Evolutionary Creationism may lengthen the Genesis day as well.

The late John Sailhamer suggested an approach he called Historical Creationism (Genesis Unbound). Somewhat like Walton his approach separates the Genesis day from the creation of the universe. “In the beginning...” is understood as a relative time period understood in a way similar to when we say, “In the beginning of a race there was an event that took place.”

If you are really looking for meaty information on this topic you will need to dig deeper than a thread.

Rob

 

[rlvaughn]

A thread on this topic is simply not going to give you the depth of information you need...If you are really looking for meaty information on this topic you will need to dig deeper than a thread.

Thanks, Rob. My wording left things open for misunderstanding, but they also must be taken in context. Yes, if I want a weighty tome on creationism, either young earth or old earth or otherwise, I will have to "dig deeper than a [Baptist Board] thread." But the context is that I am writing to members of the Baptist Board asking if they would give positive biblical arguments supporting their position. One can read a book, but one can interact with people on a discussion board.

IOW, the "information" I hope to find is what people on the BB think. Hope that clarifies.

 

[rlvaughn]

The one who did give a positive statement of his position was Baptist Believer, who wrote:

...

I do not agree with this line of argument, but recognize it as one setting out a position, rather than just negating someone else’s. I wonder, if you believe that God’s creative days were long periods, not 24 hours, do you agree that this line of argument above supports your conclusion? Would you use it? Why or why not?

In post #67 of this thread I referenced Baptist Believer's reasoning concerning Hebrews 4:4-9, the sabbath day, and extended periods of time. I haven't noticed whether anyone agrees with him. I'll play the devil's advocate and list two other biblical objections that are often raised to the 24-hour days of creation. These are from Richard Deem at "God and Science".

The third day must have been longer than 24-hours, since the text indicates a process that would take a year or longer. On this day, God allowed the land to produce vegetation, trees and fruit. The text specifically states that the land produced trees that bore fruit with seed in it (3). Any horticulturist knows that fruit-bearing trees requires several years to grow to produce fruit. However, the text states that the land produced these trees (indicating a natural process) and that it all occurred on the third day. Obviously, such a "day" could not have been only 24 hours long.

The events of the sixth day of creation require time beyond 24 hours. On this day, God created the mammals and mankind. He also planted a garden, watered it, let it grow, and put man in it, with instruction on its care and maintenance. Then God brought all the animals to Adam to be named. This job, in itself would take many days or weeks. Next, God put Adam to sleep and created Eve. When Adam woke up, he used the Hebrew word pa‛ămâh, which means "at long last." If Adam has only needed to wait a few hours, it is unlikely he would have used this Hebrew word. The context suggests that Adam had to wait months to years before Eve was created. So, it is very unlikely all of this could have taken place in a 24 hour period of time, since much of it was dependent upon Adam, who did not have the abilities of God.

 

[loDebar]

Without question, the word “day” (yom) is used three or four different ways in the Bible, for example – (1) a 24 hour cycle (day & night, evening & morning); (2) the period of light between sunrise and sunset (i.e. daylight); or (3) some unspecified length of time or a point or time. The context determines the meaning. IMO, the context of Genesis 1-2 supports the meaning of 24-hour days. When Moses in his writings uses “day” with a numerical adjective (first day, second day, three days, four days, etc.) he means days that we understand as days of 24-hour duration. I am not aware of any exceptions to this.
Would you clarify how you think this supports the idea of days as eras, eons in Genesis 1?

Isa 61:2

To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD, and the yowm of vengeance of our God; to comfort all that mourn;

any time "in that day" in KJV regarding future conditions or time is more than one day. examples in Isaiah, Zech


yowm
day, time, year

1. day (as opposed to night)
   
2. day (24 hour period)
   1. as defined by evening and morning in Genesis 1
   2. as a division of time
      1. a working day, a day's journey
3. days, lifetime (pl.)
4. time, period (general)
5. year
6. temporal references
   1. today
   2. yesterday
   3. tomorrow

 

[rlvaughn]

any time "in that day" in KJV regarding future conditions or time is more than one day. examples in Isaiah, Zech

How are you applying to that Genesis 1, which is past rather than future, and "first day," "second day," etc. rather than "in that day"?

Thanks.

 

[SolaSister]

What do y’all make of the ‘yoms’ here? Exodus 20:11
Was Moses just making a point or does days mean days, like seven days in a week?

Exodus 20:11 New American Standard Bible (NASB)
11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them, and rested on the seventh day; therefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day and made it holy.

 

[loDebar]

How are you applying to that Genesis 1, which is past rather than future, and "first day," "second day," etc. rather than "in that day"?

Thanks.

I see your point, the verses were showing future events but the use of the words apply generally., yown can mean more than one 24 hr day, In the future examples, an age or time period, as we would use "in the day of the king" as more than one single day

 

[loDebar]

The beginning of the universe had to happen before this point.... how close idk maybe at the instant

Luk 10:18¶
And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.

Could have been eons before Gen 1:3... Light

 

[rlvaughn]

What do y’all make of the ‘yoms’ here? Exodus 20:11
Was Moses just making a point or does days mean days, like seven days in a week?.

I believe the days in Exodus 20:8-11 are as other days of 24-hour duration, and that the original readers would certainly have understood them in such a manner. Unlike the day, month, and year, the 7‑day cycle of a week does not correspond to anything in nature (like rotation of earth, orbit of earth, cycle of moon, etc.).

The beginning of the universe had to happen before this point.... how close idk maybe at the instant

Luk 10:18¶
And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.

Could have been eons before Gen 1:3... Light

That is an interesting thought. I am unaware of much information by which we may place the fall of Satan on a timeline. There is the text in Ezekiel 28:13-19 which has often been interpreted as about Lucifer or Satan (though some do not accept it as such). Intriguingly, it mentions "Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God" in a context that would be before his fall.