The Southern Baptist Apocalypse - Sexual Abuse Report Released

[canadyjd]

Here ya go

it’s already started. Not a very good start

Retired Mobile pastor falsely tied to SBC abuser list by local news outlet | Baptist Press

And an innocent man’s reputation and long career is slandered on the news and they say, “oops sorry about that.”

They fallout will last for years in that community. His church will never recover, in some peoples minds, from this allegation.

And the real deviant was arrested and convicted (public records) in the 1980’s, so this isn’t a case of a church covering up abuse anyway. How very sad.

peace to you

 

[Baptist Believer]

it’s already started. Not a very good start

Retired Mobile pastor falsely tied to SBC abuser list by local news outlet | Baptist Press

That's careless reporting from a local news station, not an issue with the list.

 

[Reynolds]

Too many "good ole boy" individual churches that cover up their sins and bully out the victims. Oversight is needed in such a situation.
I attended a SBC church for a couple years. The pastor taught free will salvation, just say the prayer and your saved (no change of behavior needed), and refused to discipline sin. His worship leader was a cocaine addict who relapsed and kept leading worship (we left when he wouldn't discipline the sin). The turning the back to open sin is a problem in many churches where the family name holds more authority than Christ himself.

You find that in any denomination and non denomination.

 

[canadyjd]

That's careless reporting from a local news station, not an issue with the list.

How can it not be an issue with the list?

The list was suppose to be about the “cover up”, of these allegations. The perp was reported, arrested and convicted in the 1980’s which produced public records. Do we even know if he ever served as a pastor again? Now that would be a good story.

The news used the list. Yes, they were careless. They didn’t seek him out for comment. They didn’t do a proper background investigation.

But because of this list, this innocent man’s ministry, church, legacy is tarnished for many years and may never recover.

peace to you

 

[Revmitchell]

How can it not be an issue with the list?

The list was suppose to be about the “cover up”, of these allegations. The perp was reported, arrested and convicted in the 1980’s which produced public records. Do we even know if he ever served as a pastor again? Now that would be a good story.

The news used the list. Yes, they were careless. They didn’t seek him out for comment. They didn’t do a proper background investigation.

But because of this list, this innocent man’s ministry, church, legacy is tarnished for many years and may never recover.

peace to you

Not sure why that needs explaining for some reason it does.

 

[Baptist Believer]

How can it not be an issue with the list?

The list was correct. Most of this was public knowledge already.

The list was suppose to be about the “cover up”, of these allegations.

Was it?

Apparently, you didn't actually read the report. The report simply mentioned that which Executive Committee representatives claimed that they could not keep a list because it would violate the autonomy of the local churches, they kept a list from public records, from information forwarded to them, and by using Christa Brown's list (a woman they derided for years) as sources.

 

[canadyjd]

I said:

How can it not be an issue with the list?

The list was suppose to be about the “cover up”, of these allegations……

peace to you

You responded:

….
Was it?

Apparently, you didn't actually read the report…..

Let me turn to your first post to begin this thread:

The Guidepost Solutions' Report of the Independent Investigation of sexual abuse was released yesterday afternoon,…

…it uncovers (apocalypse) a pattern of covering up sexual abuse in the leadership of the SBC….

…It corroborates and details charges of deception, stonewalling, and intimidation of victims and those calling for reform….

…It documents callous cover-ups by some SBC leaders and credible allegations of sexually predatory behavior …

…Allegations of sexual violence and assault were placed, the report concludes, in a secret file in the SBC Nashville headquarters. …

It held over 700 cases. Not only was nothing done to stop these predators from continuing their hellish crimes…

….I cannot help but wonder what else this can be called but a criminal conspiracy.​

That sounds like the accusation is “coverup”, especially since the word “coverup is actually used.

Not only was it about the “coverup”, but the author thinks it went further into a “criminal conspiracy” to coverup the allegations.

Peace to you

 

[RighteousnessTemperance&]

Here are a few details from the report intro:

Despite collecting these reports for more than 10 years, there is no indication that Dr. Oldham, Mr. Boto, or anyone else, took any action to ensure that the accused ministers were no longer in positions of power at SBC churches. The most recent list prepared by the EC staff member contained the names of 703 abusers, with 409 believed to be SBC-affiliated at some point in time.​

Overall, it sounds like there was some key resistance high up. Despite this fact, they later reveal that…

Based on these efforts, it appears that nine (9) people remain in active ministry or connected to ministry. Two (2) of those people appear to be associated with an SBC church. The remaining seven (7) appear to be associated with churches that are not SBC-affiliated.​

So, a great many of the abuses were by non-SBC affiliates, and only 2 of these 409 SBC affiliates remain SBC. While that is still two too many, and resistance to procedure still unacceptable, it appears that SBC churches, and even the SBC itself, were still significantly purging themselves of abusers prior to the report.

https://static1.squarespace.com/sta...olutions+Independent+Investigation+Report.pdf

 

[AustinC]

Here are a few details from the report intro:

Despite collecting these reports for more than 10 years, there is no indication that Dr. Oldham, Mr. Boto, or anyone else, took any action to ensure that the accused ministers were no longer in positions of power at SBC churches. The most recent list prepared by the EC staff member contained the names of 703 abusers, with 409 believed to be SBC-affiliated at some point in time.​

Overall, it sounds like there was some key resistance high up. Despite this fact, they later reveal that…

Based on these efforts, it appears that nine (9) people remain in active ministry or connected to ministry. Two (2) of those people appear to be associated with an SBC church. The remaining seven (7) appear to be associated with churches that are not SBC-affiliated.​

So, a great many of the abuses were by non-SBC affiliates, and only 2 of these 409 SBC affiliates remain SBC. While that is still two too many, and resistance to procedure still unacceptable, it appears that SBC churches, and even the SBC itself, were still significantly purging themselves of abusers prior to the report.

https://static1.squarespace.com/sta...olutions+Independent+Investigation+Report.pdf

I applaud the SBC for courageously tackling what so many Christian denominations have avoided to their shame.

 

[canadyjd]

Here are a few details from the report intro:

Despite collecting these reports for more than 10 years, there is no indication that Dr. Oldham, Mr. Boto, or anyone else, took any action to ensure that the accused ministers were no longer in positions of power at SBC churches. The most recent list prepared by the EC staff member contained the names of 703 abusers, with 409 believed to be SBC-affiliated at some point in time.​

Overall, it sounds like there was some key resistance high up. Despite this fact, they later reveal that…

Based on these efforts, it appears that nine (9) people remain in active ministry or connected to ministry. Two (2) of those people appear to be associated with an SBC church. The remaining seven (7) appear to be associated with churches that are not SBC-affiliated.​

So, a great many of the abuses were by non-SBC affiliates, and only 2 of these 409 SBC affiliates remain SBC. While that is still two too many, and resistance to procedure still unacceptable, it appears that SBC churches, and even the SBC itself, were still significantly purging themselves of abusers prior to the report.

https://static1.squarespace.com/sta...olutions+Independent+Investigation+Report.pdf

It says only two are “associated” with a SBC church, whatever that means. Out of tens of millions of members.

It’s not really an “apocalypse”, is it?

peace to you

 

[RighteousnessTemperance&]

It says only two are “associated” with a SBC church, whatever that means. Out of tens of millions of members.

Yes, put that way, it could include volunteers working with kids.

It’s not really an “apocalypse”, is it?

That wording does seem rather extreme, and better aimed at the coming fate of sexual abusers.

No one should imagine that sexual abuse hasn’t been a huge problem in the past. That it’s now getting exposed is a positive sign.

Resistance to that exposure is bound to continue, until that resistance has also been exposed and dealt with.

But the possibility of litigation is real, not an imagined fear. Perhaps this report will help provide guidance.

 

[Reynolds]

I applaud the SBC for courageously tackling what so many Christian denominations have avoided to their shame.

Well then, now I know what the SBC is doing is wrong.

 

[Baptist Believer]

That sounds like the accusation is “coverup”, especially since the word “coverup is actually used.

The cover-up was the way sexual abuse allegations were routinely ignored and victims who reported the crime/sin were treated by the Executive Committee. There was also a cover-up about whether or not it would be possible to keep a list as a resource for churches to use as a method of clearing prospective ministers and leaders. There was also a cover-up of the way key leaders of the Convention -- and "Conservative Resurgence" heroes -- were implicated in sexual abuse themselves, or covering it up.

Not only was it about the “coverup”, but the author thinks it went further into a “criminal conspiracy” to coverup the allegations.

Yes, that's Russell Moore's opinion.

"Apocalypse" is his word and it is fitting. Apocalypse is a prophetic unveiling/revealing of the true state of things that were previously covered.

 

[Marooncat79]

That's careless reporting from a local news station, not an issue with the list.

That’s the point

 

[Reformed1689]

Why the SBC Allegation List Should NOT Have Been Released

 

[Revmitchell]

The Bad and the Ugly of the SBC Guidepost Sex Abuse List (Is it Worth the Paper It's Printed On?) - Protestia

 

[canadyjd]

The cover-up was the way sexual abuse allegations were routinely ignored and victims who reported the crime/sin were treated by the Executive Committee. There was also a cover-up about whether or not it would be possible to keep a list as a resource for churches to use as a method of clearing prospective ministers and leaders. There was also a cover-up of the way key leaders of the Convention -- and "Conservative Resurgence" heroes -- were implicated in sexual abuse themselves, or covering it up.


Yes, that's Russell Moore's opinion.

"Apocalypse" is his word and it is fitting. Apocalypse is a prophetic unveiling/revealing of the true state of things that were previously covered.

Thank you for agreeing with me the issue was about a “coverup”, even though this particular man was reported, arrested, convicted. We don’t know if he ever returned to ministry, but we do know the retired pastor falsely accused as a direct result of the “list” being reported will likely never live to see his good name and ministry restored.

Only two people on the “list” are currently involved in SBC churches. That’s not much of an apocalypse.

peace to you

 

[Reformed1689]

We don’t know if he ever returned to ministry, but we do know the retired pastor falsely accused as a direct result of the “list” being reported will likely never live to see his good name and ministry restored.

Exactly. This handling is unbiblical. God wrote Matthew 18 the way he did for a reason.

 

[Revmitchell]

Thank you for agreeing with me the issue was about a “coverup”, even though this particular man was reported, arrested, convicted. We don’t know if he ever returned to ministry, but we do know the retired pastor falsely accused as a direct result of the “list” being reported will likely never live to see his good name and ministry restored.

Only two people on the “list” are currently involved in SBC churches. That’s not much of an apocalypse.

peace to you

There is already a national list and those convicted of sex crimes would be revealed in background checks. Adding bureaucracy to start another list is nothing but redundant.

I do believe that a good change that can come out of this is that churches who refuse to deal with these issues be disfellowshipped.

 

[AVL1984]

There is already a national list and those convicted of sex crimes would be revealed in background checks. Adding bureaucracy to start another list is nothing but redundant.

I do believe that a good change that can come out of this is that churches who refuse to deal with these issues be disfellowshipped.

Personally, I have never understood why some of these churches didn't report these things to the authorities, but instead covered them up and allowed many of these people to go on to other churches and ministries. Being a member of an SBC-affiliated church, I am mortified at the actions of these people. There was so much of this kind of action when I was in the IFB circles, and I hated to see it perpetrate on other churches, and now finding that it's been a steady practice in the SBC churches as well....abhorrent!