The TD Jakes/Elephant Room controversy

[freeatlast]

Lets don't get too free with words like "leave a church if the Pastors fails to see things your way". We see too much of this these days and I would say stay and be a light to your church and stand up for the truth. Now if your church goes in a hereitcal direction then that is a horse of a different color.

The reason it is happening is because of so many pastors failing their churches. This one is already on that road. I would leave.

 

[annsni]

Lets don't get too free with words like "leave a church if the Pastors fails to see things your way". We see too much of this these days and I would say stay and be a light to your church and stand up for the truth. Now if your church goes in a hereitcal direction then that is a horse of a different color.

For that, we have no worries. If there is anything our pastor will not stand for is heretical teaching. I asked hubby (another pastor at our church) if our senior pastor knows that Jakes will be there and he said they haven't discussed it yet but they are having their pastor's meeting today so we'll see if it comes up.

Freeatlast - How do you know that my pastor is failing the church in regards to this? Yes, we've had some issues in the past but one thing I can say about my pastor - he stands squarely on Scripture and will not compromise on that. I believe that if we do go through with this, two things will happen:

#1 - The attendees of the Elephant Room (the pastors on the panel) are going to get Jakes into a corner and get him to tell the truth. They will not allow wishy washy answers but will get the issue out in the open for all to see, thus fully exposing a heretic - or else we will see that Jakes has changed his beliefs on this matter.

#2 - If Jakes is a heretic as we believe, we will be staying after the Elephant Room is over to discuss the truth of the Trinity and we will have a teaching on the Biblical stance and why Jakes is 100% wrong in what he believes. That would teach all of our attenders to be discerning and to be able to answer the heresies that they hear in the "church" (mostly on TV).

ETA: I just wanted to say that if my pastor was all excited that Jakes was on the Elephant Room because he thought he was a good teacher, I'd agree that it would be time to leave but I know for a fact that he knows that Jake's past teaching on this subject is heretical. We signed up to become a site to show the Elephant Room before we knew who was going to be on the panel so we cannot falsely accuse my pastor of anything untoward.

 

[freeatlast]

For that, we have no worries. If there is anything our pastor will not stand for is heretical teaching. I asked hubby (another pastor at our church) if our senior pastor knows that Jakes will be there and he said they haven't discussed it yet but they are having their pastor's meeting today so we'll see if it comes up.

Freeatlast - How do you know that my pastor is failing the church in regards to this? Yes, we've had some issues in the past but one thing I can say about my pastor - he stands squarely on Scripture and will not compromise on that. I believe that if we do go through with this, two things will happen:

#1 - The attendees of the Elephant Room (the pastors on the panel) are going to get Jakes into a corner and get him to tell the truth. They will not allow wishy washy answers but will get the issue out in the open for all to see, thus fully exposing a heretic - or else we will see that Jakes has changed his beliefs on this matter.

#2 - If Jakes is a heretic as we believe, we will be staying after the Elephant Room is over to discuss the truth of the Trinity and we will have a teaching on the Biblical stance and why Jakes is 100% wrong in what he believes. That would teach all of our attenders to be discerning and to be able to answer the heresies that they hear in the "church" (mostly on TV).

ETA: I just wanted to say that if my pastor was all excited that Jakes was on the Elephant Room because he thought he was a good teacher, I'd agree that it would be time to leave but I know for a fact that he knows that Jake's past teaching on this subject is heretical. We signed up to become a site to show the Elephant Room before we knew who was going to be on the panel so we cannot falsely accuse my pastor of anything untoward.

It is no different then inviting a JW into your home in front of the children and then trying to correct all the error. Wisdom says do not let them in. If your pastor goes through with this he is unwise and for that I would leave the church.
We are not to study error. We are to study truth and then when error comes along we can clearly see it and then confront it but we are not to seek it out as a teaching tool as that is unwise.
Every church has some (most) who are babes in Christ and even the slightest error causes them to doubt. Any Pastor who allows his people to be subjected to error is not wise. I would leave as such actions shows he has no business in the leadership position.
It would be different if the leadership of the church met in private with those who teach false doctrine, but this is not the case./ This is why I always cringe about discussion boards that do not protect the truth. I wonder how many have had their faith farmed by discussion boards? Thankfully there are some here that knows the truth and do combat the error of others, but it is still a very dangerous place for a babe to be.

 

[annsni]

It is no different then inviting a JW into your home in front of the children and then trying to correct all the error. Wisdom says do not let them in. If your pastor goes through with this he is unwise and for that I would leave the church.
We are not to study error. We are to study truth and then when error comes along we can clearly see it and then confront it but we are not to seek it out as a teaching tool as that is unwise.
Every church has some (most) who are babes in Christ and even the slightest error causes them to doubt. Any Pastor who allows his people to be subjected to error is not wise. I would leave as such actions shows he has no business in the leadership position.
It would be different if the leadership of the church met in private with those who teach false doctrine, but this is not the case./ This is why I always cringe about discussion boards that do not protect the truth. I wonder how many have had their faith farmed by discussion boards? Thankfully there are some here that knows the truth and do combat the error of others, but it is still a very dangerous place for a babe to be.

#1 - I doubt there will be many new believers there at the broadcast and if they are
#2 - There will absolutely be discussion about what the truth is and what the truth is not. No one will leave there thinking that Jakes is correct if he in fact believes in modalism.
#3 - It is a great teaching tool. The last time we saw the ER, there were things we disagreed with and have gone on to have discussion about it. I believe this will be the case.

Again, this may be a moot point because I haven't discussed with my pastor the issue here and I'm not aware if he is even aware of who will be there yet. He just may shut the program down - I have no idea. I'm writing this from home and haven't seen the pastoral team (other than my husband) since last Friday - before I had even heard about this.

 

[preachinjesus]

For what it's worth, I dont think Jakes cares about explaining his view of the Trinity. If asked he'll just repeat a rehearsed line. Jakes, like many other pastors in his tradition, don't care about this stuff. That us why I believe this is a foolish conversation (the one for Elephant in the Room) that will accomplish nothing.

Now if they go after him for his false doctrine of the prosperity gospel then I will be a little bit happier. I still don't like these conversations.

 

[annsni]

For what it's worth, I dont think Jakes cares about explaining his view of the Trinity. If asked he'll just repeat a rehearsed line. Jakes, like many other pastors in his tradition, don't care about this stuff. That us why I believe this is a foolish conversation (the one for Elephant in the Room) that will accomplish nothing.

Now if they go after him for his false doctrine of the prosperity gospel then I will be a little bit happier. I still don't like these conversations.

I agree but I do think this bunch of guys will give such direct questions that he'll need to answer. We'll see.

I think it's good for a group of men to get together like this and discuss their differences in public for the church to be able to see how to deal with the "non-essentials" but I do question the wisdom of bringing in someone outside the "non-essentials", you know? I guess we'll have to see how this one goes.