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The threat of Hugo Chavez

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by church mouse guy, Aug 5, 2005.

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  1. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy Well-Known Member
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    Didn't you see the list of political prisoners, missing people, and assasinated people, BiR? The only reason that it is not human rights abuse is that the left decides these things politically without any principles such as Christianity. Therefore, they tend to go with whatever is politically popular. Before World War II, the European left agreed with Hitler that Jews were abusive to European society.

    If you look at things from a Christian perspective, the abuse of civil rights and murder of prisoners in Venezuela is more serious than any of the events in Gitmo but the left sides with Chávez for racial and political reasons. That is because the left is not grounded in Christian principles but tries to incorporate them if they think that it is convenient. Chávez says that Jesus is a socialist and that the Catholic clergy in his country is diabolical, so he has excused himself, BiR.
     
    #21 church mouse guy, Aug 7, 2005
  2. Baptist in Richmond

    Baptist in Richmond Active Member

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    Change starts at home, CMG.....
     
    #22 Baptist in Richmond, Aug 7, 2005
  3. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy Well-Known Member
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    Veering to the left, BiR? What do we have that even approaches the human rights abuse under President Hugo Chávez Frías?

    The China Reform Monitor of the Council on Foreign Relations said this about Chávez:

    "Visiting Beijing, Venezuela's President Hugo Chavez stated, I have always been very Maoist, the Associated Press reports. Chavez a former army paratrooper and failed coup leader, who after being elected has increased the role of the military in Venezuelan society, repeatedly praised Chinese revolutionary Mao Tse Tung during meetings with Chinese officials. (1999)

    It is no wonder that World Net Daily announces today that he is buying more arms from China. Here is what he said about communism last Christmas:

    "Capitalists believe in an unequal society. Capitalism is the champion of inequality," he said.

    "Capitalism is the road that leads to hell."

    But he won his most ringing applause when he re-affirmed Venezuela's support for a "one China" policy and opposition to Taiwan independence.

    So Chávez sells out Taiwan. He said more:

    Mao Zedong and Venezuela's 19th century independence hero Simon Bolivar would have been mates had they met.

    Addressing students and teachers at Peking University, one of China's top schools, the charismatic Chavez won warm applause and chuckles on Friday when he declared himself to have been a Maoist from the time he was a child.

    "I think if Mao Zedong and Bolivar had known each other they would have been good friends because their thinking was similar," said Chavez, who quoted the late Chairman Mao several times.

    "Their inspiration came from the same place. It came from humanitarianism...I think if Bolivar had come to China he would have become a socialist," Chavez said speaking in Spanish through a Chinese translator.

    http://uk.news.yahoo.com/041224/325/f963s.html

    Remember, BiR, Shakespeare said that a man may smile and smile and smile and still be a villain.
     
    #23 church mouse guy, Aug 7, 2005
  4. Baptist in Richmond

    Baptist in Richmond Active Member

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    I never made any observations about the severity of the violations, did I? I certainly hope that you are not saying that the severity of the abuse in Venezuela somehow reduces the issues with our prisons in Iraq and Cuba.

    </font>[/QUOTE]Regardless of whether or not I share his beliefs, he most certainly has the right to feel that way. BTW, he was elected, wasn't he?

    When did I ever indicate otherwise??
     
    #24 Baptist in Richmond, Aug 7, 2005
  5. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy Well-Known Member
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    What happened in our prisons did not involve the deaths of anyone or the disappearance of anyone. That is what irks me about the left's complaints about human rights abuse--that is, the complaints are grounded in politics and not in Christianity. Meanwhile, Hugo Chávez Frías believes that Jesus is a socialist and that the clergy of his nation are diabolical. I should think that he is diabolical for his murders, not to mention his abandonment of the defense of Taiwan to curry favor with his Chinese masters.
     
    #25 church mouse guy, Aug 7, 2005
  6. ASLANSPAL

    ASLANSPAL New Member

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    Venezuela has a long storied past dealing with
    United States Oil companies...Nixon was spit
    upon when he went down there and our oil companies
    got a sweetheart deal for the longest time so
    I can see where a Hugo Chavez in a populist movement is able to use the United States as the
    bogey man and win elections...as for the documentation does Amnesty International fit
    you bias cmg.

    Change starts at home....we should always keep
    working to build our standards higher and besides
    who here is from Venezuela cmg ..perhaps they
    can chime in.

    http://web.amnesty.org/report2003/ven-summary-eng


    and for our Latino listeners

    http://www.amnistia.org.ve/

    and more
    http://www.amnestyusa.org/countries/venezuela/index.do


    oh ..my goodness here is another one..why do
    I have to do your work for you cmg ..quit
    being lazy.

    http://www.hrw.org/doc?t=americas&c=venezu


    and another more moderate
    http://www.ncbuy.com/reference/country/humanrights_toc.html?code=ve

    now cmg since you are so focused on Venezuela
    why not tell us of Columbia and their human
    rights abuses...don't let me have to do your
    work again or your fired! ;)

    Venezuelans are fully aware of any attempts of
    the United States putting in a puppet at the
    behest of oil companies who are seeing their
    costs going up and up..and they have short
    memory when it comes to the Rockefeller's raping
    them economically with Standard oil..so they
    choose Chavez to protect them from what
    they see as Uncle Sam with a stick an oil dipstick.

    If you really look at it cmg...bush has been
    selective on his human rights issues ..it seems
    most are oil rich countries..I quess the others will have to wait.

    Oh yeah cmg do some research and report back to us
    about Nigeria..surely oil companies are not abusing the population there ..surely. :rolleyes:
     
    #26 ASLANSPAL, Aug 8, 2005
  7. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy Well-Known Member
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    Oh, I listed the missing and the dead and the illegally held by name up above in this thread. And I linked it.
     
    #27 church mouse guy, Aug 8, 2005
  8. Daisy

    Daisy New Member

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    Venezuela has lots of oil! I've been betting they would be next!

    Why bother getting OBL himself when we can invade oil-rich countries instead?
     
    #28 Daisy, Aug 8, 2005
  9. Baptist in Richmond

    Baptist in Richmond Active Member

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    [​IMG]

    Greetings Daisy, my like-minded leftie!!!

    A sincere wish that all is well with you and "Mr. Daisy,"

    BiR
     
    #29 Baptist in Richmond, Aug 8, 2005
  10. Daisy

    Daisy New Member

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    Hi back at 'cha! It looks as though the heat wave is breaking here - cold front coming through. Yippee! We may get rain today! Mr. Daisy is learning to swim and having fun with it.

    How are you and yours?

    My brother out in Seattle was predicting Venezuela back in 2000 as the first country to be invaded. He's lost twice already, with Afghanistan & Iraq.

    One of the pluses re Venezuela is that we can claim that the Western Hemisphere is our domain. Now, if we can only trick/scare/bribe Mexico & Canada to go along with it....
     
    #30 Daisy, Aug 8, 2005
  11. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, Daisy, but that's an area where both you and Pat Buchanan have been wrong. You both assumed that because we invaded Iraq in 2003 that it would be only the first in a string of invasions - Iran, Syria, Egypt, Saudi Arabia, now Venezuela.

    Both you and Mr. Buchanan need to learn that past performance does not guarantee future results.
     
    #31 KenH, Aug 8, 2005
  12. Baptist in Richmond

    Baptist in Richmond Active Member

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    Give them time, Ken: it's still only 2005.

    Hope you are doing well, and that your weekend was a great as mine,
    BiR
     
    #32 Baptist in Richmond, Aug 8, 2005
  13. Daisy

    Daisy New Member

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    One can only hope!
     
    #33 Daisy, Aug 8, 2005
  14. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    Bush can barely sustain even a minority level of support for the war in Iraq at the moment. Not exactly a position of strength to launch several more in the next 3 years and 5 months.
     
    #34 KenH, Aug 8, 2005
  15. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy Well-Known Member
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    I think that Bush is just trying to help Uribe keep Colombia out of the hands of Chávez. Chávez is a thug.
     
    #35 church mouse guy, Aug 9, 2005
  16. Baptist in Richmond

    Baptist in Richmond Active Member

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    #36 Baptist in Richmond, Aug 10, 2005
  17. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy Well-Known Member
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    It's clear that Iran is trying to build the atomic bomb for use mainly on Jerusalem. Iran as well as the Arab states in the area do not want Iraq to become some sort of secular republic like Turkey because it threatens Islamism and the new attempt by Islam to conquer the world.

    Some are saying that Bush will have to re-instate the draft either before or after the next Nine Eleven and that Venezuela will have to be dealt with seriously also.
     
    #37 church mouse guy, Aug 10, 2005
  18. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy Well-Known Member
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    The Commandant is at it again, trying to gouge the USA. Specifically, President Chávez is trying to tack on a $4 billion surcharge onto certain oil companies:

    Thirty-two publicly traded oil companies — including Shell, (RD) Exxon Mobil, (XOM) Repsol YPF, (REP) Chevron, (CVX) BP (BP) and Total (TOT) — are accused of owing $4 billion in back taxes for overproduction, something they deny.

    http://www.investors.com/editorial/IBDArticles.asp?artsec=5
     
    #38 church mouse guy, Aug 18, 2005
  19. elijah_lives

    elijah_lives New Member

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    "BTW, he was elected, wasn't he?"

    So was Stalin!
     
    #39 elijah_lives, Aug 18, 2005
  20. Sonjeo

    Sonjeo New Member

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    Boy, why such an interest in what Chaves is doing with American oil companies. After all the regime's and puppet dictators this coutnry has supported for corporate interests with disregard to what was better for the host country you would think American overseas oil has a little coming to itself. The U.S. does nothing but push away the democratically elected government of Chavez and the
    Venezuelan people even to the point of hypocritically trying to back efforts to overthrow it and so Chavez should be criticized in trying to play hardball. Boy we can sure dish it out but when it comes to taking it, man, it's the crime of the century. Reap'in what we sow.
     
    #40 Sonjeo, Aug 19, 2005
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