This is getting bizarre!

One of the problems with judging someone's salvation is that personal prejudice almost always enters in. Baptists are often inherently suspicious of non-Baptists, KJVOs of MVers, Arminians of Calvinists, IFBs of Southern Baptists, and so forth (you could of course reverse those pairs), and a benefit of the doubt is rarely extended. Yet, everyone who judges thinks he does so objectively and according to Scripture alone. That's why it's hard to take the "X is not saved" discussions seriously.

 

Frogman and Helen if we are to not judge others how do you explain 1 Cor. chapter 5 and Matthew 18?

Of course we need to judge others motives, that is what keeps a wise man safe.

Jesus warned in Mt.7:15-16, "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits…"

 

That's why you are to judge actions and not what's in the heart (unless they state what is in their heart, of course). But, to judge whether someone is saved or not? If someone claims they accepted the Lord Jesus as their savior, I believe them, but I may tell them they need to clean up their act!

 

I agree

But I still think we end up judging their heart whether we admit it or not. How can you not?

Semantics

 

A man who is truly saved strives to emulate Christ. He lives his life in such a way that people can see Christ in him. He fills his heart and his life with the Love of Christ, he obeys the commandments and he shares the Godpel that saved his soul.

Many profess to be saved, but lets face facts. Belief is more than simply saying the words I believe, belief is knowledge and practice. The salvation prayer can be uttered by anyone. Why Satan himself knows the Salvation prayer. But reciting the prayer is not a ticket to heaven, for God knows the heart of a man. If the mans request for Salvation is heart felt and sincere, if the man is truly repentant and his committment is sincere, than his Salvation request will be accepted as promised in the Word of God (KJV).

If however he is simply reciting the prayer because he feels it is what everyone else wants hime to do and he has no real committment, and he is not repentant than he leaves as unsaved as he came.

God searches the hearts of men and He knows who is sincere and who is not. Two points stand out
1. Judge not lest ye be judged and 2. Many shall come in that day and say Lord Lord did we not....

 

1 Cor. 5:3 shows Paul, an inspired man of God did "judge" the fornicator;
the greek 'krino' and means properly to distinguish. It has been 'translated' to mean condemn, damn, etc.

But, in context of vs. 5 Paul obviously is not being judgmental of this persons spiritual position in Christ, though in the flesh he declares to the Corinthian church to deliver him over into the hands of satan for the destruction of the flesh; nothing is said of passing a judgment of condemnation upon this fellow.

Matthew 18 is likewise concerning discipline in the church, the closest thing to your belief that may be surmised from that context is the followg:

'let him be unto thee as an heathen or publican'

note the 'as' is a comparison. for purposes of cleansing the church and retaining fellowship in the body this one is to be 'as' a heathen.

"As" is a comparison word. It does not carry with it any degree of condemnation upon our part.

We just simply cannot judge the eternal position of any one person. If we could the excommunication of the RC church would be a true doctrine.

Bro. Dallas

 

5:11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.

5:12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?

5:13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

We are to judge SIN and TRUTH always. I never said we are to judge ones motives or position in Christ. I just said we all do it whether we admit or not. It's part of human nature. Not only that it's part of the evaluation process. To say you have never done so would mean you are perfect.

 

Dear Sunnydays,
thank you for your discussion of this topic. I was under the impression you were supporting the premise that we are able to make a 'judgment' upon the heart of another person in regards to their position in Christ.

I was also under the impression the original post of this thread was in opposition to that premise.

For what it is worth, it is true that we must 'judge' in the way of righteousness in order to keep the local church cleansed of those who would bring shame upon the cause of and name of Christ.

It is likewise true that in all situations requiring this type of action our first goal should be to seek reconciliation. NOT at the expense of repentance; but reconciliation by a spirit of love and grace should always be sought for and even when this cannot be acheived we are not passing a judgment upon the disciplined member, but only making a statement in regards to a timely issue of broken fellowship...that is as far as we are able to go in these situations.

Perhaps your position and my own position are not differing, but maybe our language only?

As you say, we all at one time have 'judged' others. This is something that I try to not do; it is something that probably has happened to each of us as well, because of this we should probably me more careful to not let ourselves be guilty of practicing it.

May God Richly Bless you in your walk and service with Him,
Bro. Dallas Eaton

 

Frogman I totally agree