Featured "This Is Why Switchfoot Won’t Sing Christian Songs Anymore"

I am a guitar picker by trade. I do other things, but that is my main source of income. I play songs about lost love, trains, sunsets, mother, criminals, people who drink too much, and folks who have to work hard for a living.

I see nothing wrong with a song that talks of a wife who's left, leaving the man struggling for the strength to go on. Or a song lamenting lost youth. Or a song about how disheartening a jail cell can be. These things happen to people. Singing a song about them is not glorifying anything.

There is nothing wrong with secular music, for entertainment's sake. There is nothing inherently sinful about bands who make a living doing it.

Should a carpenter only build Baptist churches ?

 

As you can tell from my posts in the "what are you listening to" thread, I love secular music and have no problem with it.

My problem is that I don't understand why this group and many other "Christian" artists label themselves as "Christian artists" when there's nothing discernibly Christian about their music.

 

A person who entertains (an artist) can be a Christian. I have no problem with a christian artist entertaining a secular world. It doesn't change the fact that they are Christians and artists. As long as they don't call their music christian music and play secular, they're not wrong.

And switchfoot's music is overtly christian, by the way. Before I knew they were a group of Christians I wondered if they were because of their songs

 

Nobody said otherwise.

Nor do I.

But that's what's happening here.

OK. I googled the phrase "Switchfoot lyrics" and these are the first three songs that came up:

Would you mind explaining to us what, exactly, makes these lyrics "overtly Christian"?

 

Knowing that they are Christians, it's not a stretch at all to view those lyrics in a christian light.

All three songs (the second one least of all) could easily be interpereted as God hasn't let go, no matter what you're going through.

The songs that made me think they were christian "back in the day" were songs like "Dare You To Move", "This is Your Life", and others. Lyrics like, "Where's your treasure? Where's your hope, if you gain the world but lose your soul?"

If a secular person were to sing the lyrics that you posted, I would assume that they were talking to a lover. But, knowing that it was a christian who penned the words, the double entendre is easily spotted.

Don't get me wrong, as I'm not saying that they are a witness with their music. Certainly some songs are, like the lyrics I quoted. But most of their stuff is, as I said, overtly christian. If you have ears to hear it.

That's what I love about their music. Firstly, it is "toned down", as in not screaming and hard rock. It has more of a "skateboard" feel to it, which is actually what "switchfoot" means. It means you are on a skateboard and your usual lead foot is back. From a christian perspective, even the name has a gospel connotation, as in "we're not like everyone else, there's something different".

These things are not a stretch at all. Knowing that they are christian, and interpereting their music in that light, makes it easy to see the christian message in their secular songs.

Again, I don't consider their music to be christian. But the fact that they are christian artists shows through in their lyrics.

 

How so?

I see. So, "you" is God now? What about the unregenerate? Do those things apply to them? Or does God's wrath abide on them?

You realize that's not exclusively Christian, right? That it could just as easily be a Buddhist statement about the suffering brought by material possessions and desires?

So then, it's not that the songs are "overtly Christian", as you previously claimed, but that you interpret them as implying Christian thoughts, due to your personal experience and pre-supposition.

Thanks for clarifying.

You still haven't explained what makes the lyrics you quoted "overtly Christian".

Actually, if you have to "have ears to hear" it, then, by definition, it's not overtly Christian.

What's different about them? They look like every other band of their genre. They sound like every other band of their genre. Their lyrics are like every other band of their genre. So what's "different" about them?

Again, that's inference on your part, not "overt Christianity" on their part.

I see. So then, we can chalk the numerous times you've told us their music is "overtly Christian" to...what? Delirium brought on by food poisoning? Fever induced hallucinations? What?

And yet, you can't show a single song that has Christian lyrics.

I'm sorry for coming across so aggressively on this, but I used to make the very same argument you're making, only about other artists until I finally realized that my insistence that those artists were Christians was based more on my misguided departure into heretical Emergent doctrines than any Biblical argument.

 

Firstly, I am trying to have a discussion of different viewpoints, instead of trying to smash another person's statements into oblivion. If you'd like to continue disucssion, I don't mind. But close minded ignoring of statements and only out to prove a person wrong is not the intent here, and I will not participate in it. I am going to answer your previous post, but beyond that depends on your willingness to engage in discussion instead of trying to be a jury finding my words guilty of something.

Answered already in my post. You just ignored it.

Answered in my post.

Answered in my previous post.

Short answer, yes I did.

So Jesus' words were not overtly christian? The Bible isn't overtly christian?

The fact that they are (supposedly) saved, on their way to Heaven, have their sins forgiven? I'd consider that different. Now, on the outside, their songs are uplifting, positive songs.

I disagree. That's all that can be said. There's no argument for difference of opinion.

"Overtly Christian" and "Christian" are not the same thing. They sing secular songs with overtly christian words. I don't see what the confusion is here, unless you're just trying to attack me, instead of discuss Switchfoot.

I did. You just dismissed it. The same way that I could dismiss "Do unto others..." as something anyone could say.

I don't look to them for doctrine. I believe that they (the people in the group) are christians, and it shows through in their songs. I don't believe that a lot of the time that is even their intent, and I don't begrudge them that. They aren't a "christian group". They are a secular group of christians. I don't know the lifestyle they live, or what denomination they belong to. But through their songs I personally believe that they are trying to have a personal walk with God.

The OP was about them not doing christian songs. I am perfectly ok with that. Not performing christian music does not mean that one is not a christian. Same way as I am thinking of trying to break into the Country scene as a christian performing secular songs. But in this case, I believe that their music shows a definite head-knowledge of God at the very least.

 

Here is your post, in its entirety:

As you can see, it says nothing about the unregenerate or how those things apply to them. All it says is that you infer that "you" means "God", based on your presuppositions.

Actually, it wasn't. Here is your post in its entirety:

Please note that, nowhere in your post do you explain how it is exclusively "Christian", or how it could not just as easily be interpreted as being a Buddhist statement about the folly and suffering caused by material possessions or desires.

Well, you didn't answer it in your previous post because it came after your post.

You also didn't answer it because it wasn't a question, but an observation.

Even shorter answer: baloney. You didn't explain what makes them overtly Christian. All you did was to show that you interpret them as being "Christian", for some reason, because of your presuppositions and personal experiences.

What's more, you go to say that, in order to see these "overt Christian lyrics", one has to have "ears to hear", which means that, by definition, they are not overt, but are inferred and subjective.

And, to top it all off, at the end of your post, you admit that you don't consider their music Christian.

No, Jesus' words are not overtly Christian when they're quoted out of context and with no frame of reference. For instance, Jesus said, "a house divided against itself cannot stand". But taken out of the context of Matthew 12:22-32, it is not only not overtly Christian, but has nothing to do with Christianity at all.

And what does that have to do with their music?

Just like a million other bands of their genre.

Yeah, my daughter used to make the same argument when she was wrong. Of course, that was when she was five years old.

I'm sorry you don't know what "infer" means, but the fact is, what you're describing is the very definition of inference, not "overt".

Seriously??? You wouldn't happen to post as "Vibise" over on CARM, would you?

Still waiting for you to give examples.

You didn't. I even quoted your post in its entirety.

Taken out of the context of the passage it comes from, it is something anyone could say.

Yeah, I can't tell you how many times we've gone to church to worship "You", and sing songs like "O, You Our Help In Ages Past", "A Mighty Fortress Is Our You", and, my favorite, "You Will Take Care Of You".

Sometimes, we recite the Apostle's Creed, "I believe in You the Father..."

You believe that because you want to believe that and your desire to believe it causes you to infer it from their songs, not because any of their songs actually say so.

 

How so?

But they don't do that in the song your quoted.

"It was a beautiful let down
When I crashed and burned
When I found myself alone unknown and hurt
It was a beautiful let down
The day I knew
That all the riches this world had to offer me
Would never do

In a world full of bitter pain and bitter doubt
I was trying so hard to fit in, fit in,
Until I found out
I don't belong here
I don't belong here
I will carry a cross and a song where I don't belong
I don't belong"[/QUOTE]

I don't see Christ in that song at all. All I see is the singer whining.

 

I'm not asking you to convince me. I'm just asking you to explain what part of that song you consider to be a Christian song.

How strange that you would invest your time in a discussion forum when you're not interested in a discussion.

 

But your interpretation of the song is your inference of what you want the song to say, not what the lyrics actually say.