1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured "those he predestined, he called....": meaning of "called"?

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Calminian, Oct 15, 2019.

  1. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Messages:
    5,821
    Likes Received:
    798
    No, I don't believe this passage is referring to a general call at all. This is a specific calling or naming of the elect, those who will definitely be saved, whom God knew about from eternity past.
     
  2. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2018
    Messages:
    5,632
    Likes Received:
    461
    Faith:
    Baptist
    ROMAN'S 8:30 SAYS,

    "THOSE" GOD PREDESTINED

    "THOSE" HE, ALSO, secondly, CALLED, HE "NAMED", IN A SEPARATE ACTIVITY OF CALLING THEM A NAME IN ETERNITY PAST, IS REVEALED HERE IN THE BIBLE VERSE ROMAN'S 8:30!!!

    THEN, IN TIME,
    HE Effectively Saved them, when He JUSTIFIED THEM.

    ...

    Whew.

    That's 'something else' to know.

    What a thread.

    I'm am going to Trust and Worship God that The Eternal Triune Godhead Got those names right.
     
  3. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Messages:
    5,821
    Likes Received:
    798
    Those God foreknew (meaning foreknew) he predestined to become like Christ. Those predestined to be like Christ were reckoned (named, called, etc. perhaps written in the book of life). Those reckoned would all become justified (saved), in accordance with God's foreknowledge (meaning foreknowledge). Those justified would all be glorified (kept until they received new glorified bodies). None would be lost.

    I don't believe there is a temporal efficacious invitation included in this chain of events. You can argue for one, but I don't see it here. I do see, however, and unavoidable eternal security linking the justified and glorified, which seems to be highlighted further in the verses that follow.
     
  4. Noah Hirsch

    Noah Hirsch Active Member

    Joined:
    May 28, 2018
    Messages:
    160
    Likes Received:
    29
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    But it says that those whom God called He also justified. Thus, all those who are called in the sense that “called” is used in Romans 8:30 will be justified.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2000
    Messages:
    14,396
    Likes Received:
    672
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The main ones in Scripture He'd predestinated were Moses, Jeremiah, John the Baptist, & Jesus' disciples. There were others we don't know about, same as there is today. But the rest of us had to make the choice to come to Jesus.
     
  6. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Messages:
    5,821
    Likes Received:
    798
    That's kind of the point of the thread. What exactly does called mean in this passage? I've made my case, based on how Paul used the word elsewhere in his letter.
     
  7. Noah Hirsch

    Noah Hirsch Active Member

    Joined:
    May 28, 2018
    Messages:
    160
    Likes Received:
    29
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    We choose to come to Jesus, we came to Him willingly, but we did not do so of our own free will. It is God who changed our hearts and regenerated us, so that we did faith willingly. The fact that we come to Christ voluntarily (i.e. willingly) does not mean we come by our own free will. Man has a will, but he does not have a free will, free from the absolute divine sovereignty of God.

    Therefore although, we did make the decision of coming to Christ it was the work of God alone to regenerate us and grant us faith. The fact that we can to Christ willingly is not repugnant to the fact that God predestined us to come to faith and be justified. According to Romans 8:30 it is those whom God calls that He justifies. This call must not be His general call therefore, in which He offers the gospel freely to all men, but must be His effectual call of His own, that is, His sheep, the elect.

    If we do believe and come to Christ in faith does not God justify us? Yes, He does, but we must also take into account that it is those whom He calls that He justifies and none other. All those and those only whom God has predestined He also effectually calls. All those and those only whom God effectually calls He also justifies. All those and those only whom God justifies He also will glorify.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2000
    Messages:
    14,396
    Likes Received:
    672
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I have said many times, & will continue to say long as necessary that GOD DOESN'T WANT ROBOTS ! He wants people to love & obey Him of their own volition. Remember, He told Peter thatHe's being patient because He would like ALL to come to repentance of their own free will.

    No one is created predestined to be lost! ALL have a chance for salvation ! The same vat of plastic can be divided so that one part becomes a flower vase while another part becomes a garbage bin. But that bin can still be embessished & decorated into a flower vase !
     
  9. Noah Hirsch

    Noah Hirsch Active Member

    Joined:
    May 28, 2018
    Messages:
    160
    Likes Received:
    29
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    I acknowledge that God wants people to love and obey Him voluntarily. It is not that I disagree that God wants willing obedience and love that comes from a willing heart, but I distinguish between free will and volition. Yes, God commands men to according to their volition to come to Him and worship Him. Man may do things according to his volition, that is, willingly and voluntarily without having a free will. By “free will” I do not understand doing something voluntarily or willingly, but the idea that man’s decisions are not sovereignly brought to fruition and directed by divine providence.
     
    • Like Like x 1
Loading...