To be consistently "Biblical"

[mandym]

You certainly are a piece of work, aren't you. Those first two posts you referenced: These are NOT a personal attack on anyone; I am stating my view of a DOCTRINE. And you know that.

If anyone has insisted that you are without a genuine relationship with the on true and living God then that was inappropriate. But when one says your view is heretical or unorthodox it is the exact same thing as your expression of doctrines you disagree with.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Mandym: But when one says your view is heretical or unorthodox it is the exact same thing as your expression of doctrines you disagree with.

HP: What an absolute farse.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

This notion that if one disagrees with another over doctrine that somehow that is to be equated on an equal level as calling another a heretic or their doctrines heresy, or calling one a blasphemer or their beliefs as blasphemy, is nothing short of guilty parties trying to somehow cover for their own inept, unwise, and personal attacks on others. I would not buy that fallacious notion in a million years.

One can disagree over doctrine with others without using or even thinking any such notions as those mentioned above. Those who claim they are equivalent in nature are fooling no one but themselves.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Mandym: There is a huge difference between having a heretical view and being a heretic.

HP: What huge difference? A heretic would be classified as one holding heretic views. If one believes another holds heretical views in their opinion, to that one such a one would be a heretic. Who do you think you are fooling other than yourself?

 

[mandym]

HP: What huge difference? A heretic would be classified as one holding heretic views. If one believes another holds heretical views in their opinion, to that one such a one would be a heretic. Who do you think you are fooling other than yourself?

UH, no...a heretic is one who is lost. A view that is heretical is one that is extreme and with no ounce of truth. Just because one has a heretical view does not make them a heretic.

 

[Michael Wrenn]

Well, personally I am tired of this. Anyone may think what they will about me and post what they will. I won't respond in kind. God will sort it out, and I am content to let Him.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Mandym, your ignorance of the use of words is showing.

 

[Thinkingstuff]

I thought a heretic was

a professed believer who maintains religious opinions contrary to those accepted by his or her church or rejects doctrines prescribed by that church. - Webster Dictionary

However I prefer Thomas Aquinas definition better

a species of infidelity in men who, having professed the faith of Christ, corrupt its dogmas

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

This notion that if one disagrees with another over doctrine that somehow that is to be equated on an equal level as calling another a heretic or their doctrines heresy, or calling one a blasphemer or their beliefs as blasphemy, is nothing short of guilty parties trying to somehow cover for their own inept, unwise, and personal attacks on others. I would not buy that fallacious notion in a million years.

One can disagree over doctrine with others without using or even thinking any such notions as those mentioned above. Those who claim they are equivalent in nature are fooling no one but themselves.

GE:

I absolutely agree.
But this attempt at fooling the counter-party takes on a more subtle, more venomous and slanderous character when the accuser of his brethren starts his Love- and Grace-only machine-gun rattling, and in one volley cuts his opponent into stinking char-coaled shreds.

It's the OLDEST trick out; that of utter hate in love's apparel and demeanor.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

GE: in one volley cuts his opponent into stinking char-coaled shreds.

HP: An interesting way to illustrate your point. :laugh:

 

[Michael Wrenn]

Oh, yes, they are just concerned for my soul. But that doesn't mask the hatred and contempt with which they express this feigned concern.

They are not my brothers, just as a pit viper is not my brother.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Maybe I am a bit naive, but I would like to believe that some are simply blinded as to the truth in some areas, and that God has sent them to me to teach me how to love others even when we disagree. :thumbs:

 

[DHK]

Maybe I am a bit naive, but I would like to believe that some are simply blinded as to the truth in some areas, and that God has sent them to me to teach me how to love others even when we disagree. :thumbs:

One who holds to certain unorthodox and unbiblical beliefs does not, by definition make them a heretic. Perhaps heresy is a strong word, and the word "unbiblical" ought to be used more frequently. But just as an example what would you do with a post or with a believer who believe the following. It is a quote from another thread.

I gave you Scripture after Scripture. You failed to answer my post, but simply answered with a personal attack.
Here is how it breaks down.

1. You believe the sin nature is actually in the flesh--the blood, the actual flesh--carbon, nitrogen, iron, oxygen, etc. It is a belief that matter is evil.
That is a belief that the Gnostics hold.

2. You believe that even before creation Jesus had a physical body. Mormons believe that God used to be a man; used to have a physical body. You belief here is akin to Mormonism.

3. You don't believe that the humanity of Christ came from Mary. In effect you are denying the humanity of Christ. Not only do you deny the humanity of Christ you deny the actual incarnation. [God come in the flesh] or "the en-fleshment" of God. The flesh came from Mary.

4. When one denies the humanity of Christ they are on the way to denying the deity of Christ. Christ was fully man and fully God at the same time. You take away one, you take away the other.

5. You have disqualified Christ from his mediatorial ministry in heaven, which is only possible if he suffered fully, in every aspect as a man. That would include as an infant from conception onward. But you deny the full humanity of Christ.

6. Jesus did not qualify as our Great High Priest until after he suffered and died for us on the cross. Yet you say he was our mediator from the time of Adam onward. This also is unbiblical. We see from the OT, that Abel and Cain brought their sacrifices right to God himself. Christ did not mediate for them.

These are only some of the heresies that you have spread on this thread.

These are serious doctrines that are being attacked. IMO, it is not just unbiblical, but it is heretical.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

DHK: One who holds to certain unorthodox and unbiblical beliefs does not, by definition make them a heretic. Perhaps heresy is a strong word, and the word "unbiblical" ought to be used more frequently. But just as an example what would you do with a post or with a believer who believe the following. It is a quote from another thread.

HP: There is wisdom in what you are saying. It is a strong word, and is a word that has enflamed the passions of men to do unreasonable things in the past, and well could in the future. I for one will not use those terms, even when I read posts like you set forth. Certainly I do not agree with the poster referred to, but neither will I label such a one or such doctrines on a board such as this as a heretic, heresy, blasphemer or blasphemy. Unbiblical? Absolutely. Not in accordance to truth? Absolutely.

If in fact a belief is clearly held by even a cult or false religion, I might make mention of the connection if it is absolutely within reason to do so, but I would try to be clear not to suggest that a believer is one in the same with those I make reference to in regard to a certain belief or doctrine. Even true believers may in fact be unduly influenced by heathen culture/beliefs at times. I would count Augustine in that category. I have never once said he was a heretic, or outside of the faith. I do believe he was indeed wrong in some of his stated positions and wrong in his treatment of those that questioned his beliefs, but even then I will leave him to His Master to be judged, especially on this board.

Yes the doctrines you point out are indeed serious. Just the same, on a discussion board, to promote love on towards another as much as lieth within us, your thoughts to curtail the use of stronger terms is still wisdom. Civil discussion between those we know full well disagree with us demands caution and kindness to be in order as much as lieth within us and within the guidelines of this forum.

I have and will continue to use caution not to go beyond those softer means of spoken sentiment. Others would do well to heed your advice. You as the moderator can and should set the tone in this matter for all to follow. Again, I like what I hear you saying.:thumbs: Lead on!

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

What are the criteria and or credentials to become a heretic?

Edited ... Ah, never mind ...

 

[Michael Wrenn]

What are the criteria and or credentials to become a heretic?

Edited ... Ah, never mind ...

To have different beliefs from the mob you're in the middle of.

 

[12strings]

Oh, yes, they are just concerned for my soul. But that doesn't mask the hatred and contempt with which they express this feigned concern.

They are not my brothers, just as a pit viper is not my brother.

I hate to tell you this, BROTHER, but unless you truly believe these people on this board are not believers, they ARE YOUR BROTHERS, and you will be eternally happy sharing a heavenly home with them...Cheers!

 

[Michael Wrenn]

I hate to tell you this, BROTHER, but unless you truly believe these people on this board are not believers, they ARE YOUR BROTHERS, and you will be eternally happy sharing a heavenly home with them...Cheers!

Icon and I have buried the hatchet -- and not in each other. And things are better between me and some others, too.

So, let's move on, shall we?

 

[Thinkingstuff]

Icon and I have buried the hatchet -- and not in each other. And things are better between me and some others, too.

So, let's move on, shall we?

At least you're being called brother. That means you're a Christian and not so off as to be heretical because then you wouldn't even be that.

 

[Michael Wrenn]

At least you're being called brother. That means you're a Christian and not so off as to be heretical because then you wouldn't even be that.

Yes, that's true.