Translator Question

[BrianT]

Originally posted by H.R.B.:
Hey Brian T,
Could you please give me the verses about Satan being
the lion and Jesus being the Lion so I could see what you mean.
Thanks,
Heidi

Sure.

1 Pet 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:

Rev 5:5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.

Similarly, Satan is called a serpent, while Christ is compared to a serpent in John 3:14. Of course, it would be ridiculous to say that the KJV was giving Christ's title to Satan, or vice versa. Context. Besides, the KJV *all by itself* teaches that "morning star" is a title given to more than just Jesus (Job 38:7).

 

[Steve K.]

Just for kicks heres some more!
Acts 8:37 omitted in MV
Eph. 5:9 KJ fruit of the Spirit MV fruit of the light. What is that???
Luke 4:4 KJ That man shall not live by bread alone but by every word of God.
Luke 4:4 MV man shall not live by bread alone.
What is that???
Col. 1:14 MV in whom we have redemption.
Col.1:14 KJin whom we have redemption through his blood.
What is that???
GAL. 4:7 KJ an heir if God through Christ
Gal. 4:7 MV an heir of God.
What is that??
Eph. 3:9 KJ God who created all things by Jesus Christ.
Eph 3:9 MV God who created all things.
What is the motive for that? Don't use the originals excuse you don't have them and neither does anyone else.
1JN. 5:7 in the NIV is not the 1JN.5:7 in the KING JAMES. Look it up. It should outrage you to have someone change the doctrine of deity and tell you it is just easier to understand. The NIV has completely distorted the verse structure there and look close at the difference. Don't tell me or anyone else they don't change doctrine they do too.
Why eliminate references to the blood,the deity,the very name of God anywhere in the scripture? Yes you can find doctrine and truth in other versions but why would they take those things out? The changes go much deeper than thee and thou.Read Dr. Logsdon's testimony above and realize how afraid he is to face God for the cchanges they made in the NASV and ask yourself why you would recommend it to others.
I will continue to post these changes as long as people continue to slam the KJ.If anyone reading is interested in more info let me know . I have plenty more where that came from. Don't be deceived. I know you can find some truth in the new versions and I know how subtil the Devil is .I encourage everyone to check out biblebeliever.com for some real good info from men who know alot more than me about it.

 

[Steve K.]

Thank you Brian and thank God for his word .
Your demonstration above is proof of what a mess the MV's are. They have completely corrupted the verse structure of the KING JAMES BIBLE.The MV's split verse and combine verse so that you can't tell when they add and omit. Please keep the ammunition coming Brian.Show me some more material to use to prove the NIV is a work of Satan. I'll BE BACK.

 

[BrianT]

Originally posted by Steve K.:
Just for kicks heres some more!

Just for kicks, try answering some of our questions and discussing the verse comparisons *we* post. Unless your purpose here is to further illustrate the double-standards and dishonesty of KJV-onlyism.

Why eliminate references to the blood,the deity,the very name of God anywhere in the scripture?

Yes, why indeed? Perhaps you can explain it for us, comparing Acts 4:25, Jude 1:25, Phil 1:14, Rom 9:5, Psal 145:13, etc, etc, etc.

I will continue to post these changes as long as people continue to slam the KJ.

No one is slamming the KJV. We are opposing KJV-onlyism and falsehood in general: falsehoods you have made, and refuse to admit you were wrong when presented with verifiable facts. How is anyone supposed to believe in your credibility or your honesty?

I encourage everyone to check out biblebeliever.com for some real good info from men who know alot more than me about it.

I encourage everyone to check out http://www.kjvonly.org for some even better info from men who know a lot more than them about it.

 

[BrianT]

Originally posted by Steve K.:
Thank you Brian and thank God for his word .
Your demonstration above is proof of what a mess the MV's are.

How so? Why not actually trying to directly address a comment for a change?

 

[Steve K.]

I told you the MV's change even the verse structure of the KING JAMES BIBLE . They split some and combine some so you can't even reference properly.There has to be a standard and there is it is the King James Bible.It was said the MV's don't change doctrine I proved beyomd a shadoe of doubt to an HONEST person that they do. They remove God's name and the name of Jesus so I will not call them the word of God. Look at the references you gave in the King James and you will see the destruction done by the new versions.If your God cannot preserve a bible for you I can't help that my God can and did!! KING JAMES BIBLE Just look at the name. What a blessing I have a bible.
"The enemy is much to smart to jump right up and say forget all you have learned of God it's not true anyway.So he's made a plan to take God from our minds by giving us new bibles changed alittle bit each time" Ever heard that song? That is a song about MY BIBLE. You got one about yours. TOO bad SO sad!

 

[Steve K.]

Brian you don't present facts just old accusations and they might work for some people but not me!!!!!!!!!

 

[Steve K.]

You want me to comment on your perversion? Gladly
Jude 25 The addition in yours undermines the doctrine of deity and really does not make sense.
Acts 4:25 yours says that God spoke through David by the Holy GHost
If you would have read the verses 24&25 in the King James instead of some silly comparison you would know it was God who spoke through David.But you know now thanks to the KING JAMES BIBLE!!

 

[Steve K.]

Want some more?
Your question about Psalm 145:13
My bible says Thy referring to the Lord in the prior verses.
Yours says "Your" I'm not impressed!

 

[GrannyGumbo]

Hang in there, Steve K., you've got yourself a straight-stick!

The way is getting narrower and the famine is getting closer~

"Even so, come, Lord Jesus."

 

[Author]

Originally posted by Steve K.:
Author you have the right reference to Jesus but check out Is.14:12-15. Not all editions will call Lucifer Morning Star but I have an NIV that does.

Thanks, Steve, for pointing that out and it is quite interesting and you are indeed right about the NIV in Isaiah 14:12, to wit:

12 How you have fallen from heaven,
O morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations!

I do not have an NIV myself (more about that in a moment), but it is readily accessible at several places on the net. All of the Bibles I do have, by the way, in that verse, refer to "son of the morning" or "son of dawn" (Young's Literal).

Carrying this further, and looking at Revelation 22:16 in the NIV:

16 "I, Jesus, have sent my angel to give you this testimony for the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, and the bright Morning Star."

As an author and publisher, I would (and do) read the verse in Isaiah (even in the NIV) as referring to A morning star and the one in Revelation as Our Lord referring to himself as THE Morning Star. And you will note that the latter is capitalized.

Sorry, Steve, but I do not see it as significant at all.

BUT... I do dislike the NIV, not because of the translation--that's fine despite, I know, many opinions to the contrary. What I object to is the copyrighted status. The Bible is (and should be) Public Domain. To copyright a Bible and restrict it's copying and desemmination by others is... well, unChristlike.

Now before you guys think I'm some kinda flaming liberal , I make my living by owning and enforcing copyrights. Steal one of my books and my lawyer will gleefully dive down your throat (somebody found that out the hard way a few years ago). But those copyrights are on stuff I created and it's my bread and butter, so I protect it. But God made the Bible possible. He gave us this great gift. We should share it widely and constantly with others.

And I am certainly practicing what I preach. My Mountain Church imprint is releasing the World English Bible next month (at least the New Testament, Psalms, and Proverbs). It's at the printers now. And we are NOT claiming any copyright and so state on the copyright ... er... NONcopyright page.

But... I suspect the NIV publisher (I do not recall their name at this moment) will not do that. There's an INCREDIABLE amount of profit in publishing the big Bibles (companies are making millions off the KJV!!). I expect to lose money on the World English, but I just feel moved to make it available.

And, Steve, the World English is at least closer to the KJV in Isaiah 14:12 than the NIV.

--Ralph

 

[BrianT]

Thank you Steve, for finally attempting to address some specifics.

Originally posted by Steve K.:
Jude 25 The addition in yours undermines the doctrine of deity and really does not make sense.

How so? And why does it mention Jesus by name, but the KJV does not - something you earlier said you rejected a Bible for omitting?

Acts 4:25 yours says that God spoke through David by the Holy GHost
If you would have read the verses 24&25 in the King James instead of some silly comparison you would know it was God who spoke through David.

Maybe you do not understand the point. Why is the KJV missing "the Holy Spirit"? Why has it omitted it, and thus did something you said you would reject a Bible for doing?

Your question about Psalm 145:13
My bible says Thy referring to the Lord in the prior verses.
Yours says "Your" I'm not impressed!

Is that the only difference you noticed? How about the KJV totally omitting "The LORD is faithful to all his promises and loving toward all he has made."? Why? You earlier said you'd reject a Bible for omitting the name of God, yet here the KJV does it and you ignore it. Why?

 

[BrianT]

Originally posted by Author:
My Mountain Church imprint is releasing the World English Bible next month (at least the New Testament, Psalms, and Proverbs). It's at the printers now. And we are NOT claiming any copyright and so state on the copyright ... er... NONcopyright page.

Here's an interesting thought for you: suppose, hypothetically, at the last minute you changed your mind and added a copyright. Would the Bible stop being God's word even though the text itself did not change? How can man adding or subtracting a copyright change what the text itself is?

 

[Author]

Originally posted by BrianT:
Here's an interesting thought for you: suppose, hypothetically, at the last minute you changed your mind and added a copyright. Would the Bible stop being God's word even though the text itself did not change? How can man adding or subtracting a copyright change what the text itself is?

I think that's the point I was making, Brian... the Bible IS God's Word and no one (but HIM) deserves to have a copyright on it. But the NIV publisher having a copyright does not affect anything, it's just man claiming something he should not claim. In fact, when I was listing our forthcoming Good Book in various databases, I listed God as author. Hey, maybe someday I can get an in-person autograph. (c)2002 Creativity, Inc.

heh, heh... just kidding. (but not about the autograph)

--Ralph

[ December 23, 2002, 09:03 PM: Message edited by: Author ]

 

[AV Defender]

1 Pet 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:

Sure,Satan always counterfeits everything God does,just look at the Alexandrian bibles!!!!

 

[BrianT]

Originally posted by JYD:
Sure,Satan always counterfeits everything God does,just look at the Alexandrian bibles!!!!

Mark 3:24-26 (KJV) "And if a kingdom be divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. [25] And if a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand. [26] And if Satan rise up against himself, and be divided, he cannot stand, but hath an end."

 

[Steve K.]

Hey author good work!
Hey Brian read my post the answer is there.The king James does not list the Holy Spirit in that reference because the context is clear to a Bible believer It was GOD! Thanks Granny I aint budjin!

 

[Steve K.]

As an author and publisher, I would (and do) read the verse in Isaiah (even in the NIV) as referring to A morning star and the one in Revelation as Our Lord referring to himself as THE Morning Star. And you will note that the latter is capitalized
You have to admit it is more than a coincidence that they would give Lucifer the name God gives to his Son Jesus Christ.
Stay tuned brother there is plenty more where that came from.Look at the references from Brian Niv verses KJV and ntice how subtilly they have tore up the verse structure so you can't pin them down on adding and subtracting but God can and is never fear!

 

[Steve K.]

Check this nugget out,a quote from the chief editor of the NIV.
This {his NIV} shows the great error that is so prevelant in some orthodox Protestant circles,namely the error that regeneration depends upon faith...and that in order to be born again man must first accept Jesus as his savior.
Few clear and decisive texts say that Jesus is God.

 

[Steve K.]

Is that the only difference you noticed? How about the KJV totally omitting "The LORD is faithful to all his promises and loving toward all he has made."? Why? You earlier said you'd reject a Bible for omitting the name of God, yet here the KJV does it and you ignore it. Why
Did you read the foot note in your NIV?I did in mine.It says that the addition you are clinging to was found in one count it ONE dead sea scroll manuscript and NTHER! Don't base your defence in sinking sand you are getting in way to deep.Did you read the chief editor of th NIV quote above ? Is that what you believe? Is that what anyone reading this thread believes? That is the belief of the CHIEF EDITOR of the NIV.
Stay tuned folks we are just getting started.