Under Grace or Under Law?...Round 3

[D28guy]

Brother Bob,

"You boxed yourself in a hole my friend."

I have not. from my post above...

"A christian fellowship has no buisiness expecting its people to not "break the 10 commandments" or help the sinning one with discipline for "breaking the 10 commandments". We are not under Law, but under grace.

Under grace however wrong is still wrong, and proper is still proper. Adultery is still wrong. The one who has fallen into that problem is living inconsistantly with who they are in Christ. They are one of Gods Spirit born Saints who is living like a lost person. And for the brothers and sisters who love him to step in and help him with discipline is the right thing to do because God has instructed us to do it."

Mike


Mike

 

[Brother Bob]

A christian fellowship has no buisiness expecting its people to not "break the 10 commandments" or help the sinning one with discipline for "breaking the 10 commandments". We are not under Law, but under grace.

Under grace however wrong is still wrong, and proper is still proper. Adultery is still wrong. The one who has fallen into that problem is living inconsistantly with who they are in Christ. They are one of Gods Spirit born Saints who is living like a lost person. And for the brothers and sisters who love him to step in and help him with discipline is the right thing to do because God has instructed us to do it.

Grace and peace,

Mike

That is double talk if I ever heard it. A double minded man is unstable in his ways.

 

[Brother Bob]

(DISCLAIMER: I do not hold to, nor do I endorse the beliefs of any church that would dare condemn anyone whose sins are truly blotted out.)

I agree because they don't get to the point these fellows are upholding.

 

[His Blood Spoke My Name]

HP,

I forgot this...



No. What we have been talking about on this thread is the believers standing before God, and eternal security. In that regard we have been completly freed from the bondage of, and condemnation of, the Law.

The reason is because we are to walk "in the newness of the Spirit" and not "the oldness of the letter", because "The letter kills, but the Spirit gives life".

Mike

Romans 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

Many who claim to be of Christ are still servants to sin, whether outwardly... or inwardly.

 

[D28guy]

Brother Bob,

"That is double talk if I ever heard it. A double minded man is unstable in his ways."

:laugh:

My friend, I love ya.

As a great man, Andy Taylor from Mayberry said several times...

"You beat all I've ever seen!" :tongue3:

God bless,

Mike

 

[Claudia_T]

Mike

are you saying that we are still under the law but not under the condemnation of the law?

 

[Claudia_T]

he will probably say yeah thats it, that sounds good! LOL!

 

[His Blood Spoke My Name]

A christian fellowship has no buisiness expecting its people to not "break the 10 commandments" or help the sinning one with discipline for "breaking the 10 commandments". We are not under Law, but under grace.

Under grace however wrong is still wrong, and proper is still proper. Adultery is still wrong. The one who has fallen into that problem is living inconsistantly with who they are in Christ. They are one of Gods Spirit born Saints who is living like a lost person. And for the brothers and sisters who love him to step in and help him with discipline is the right thing to do because God has instructed us to do it.

Grace and peace,

Mike

Yup, Brother Bob...

I think I see a problem here. This is so confusing... are we supposed to help? or not?

 

[Brother Bob]

He wants to punish you for breaking the Commandments Claudia, but believes we are not under them.

They believe sin is:
worry
Think not about tomorrow
breaking the civil law
speeding
going in a posted swiming hole
killing a beast about to eat you if its out of season.

But what is not sin is the breaking of the Ten Commanments, such as adultery, killing, lying, worshipping a cow, stealing, coveting your neighbors wife, etc

 

[His Blood Spoke My Name]

But what is not sin is the breaking of the Ten Commanments.

I am afraid that many with that mindset are going to hear the words 'Depart from me, ye that do work iniquity. I never knew you.

 

[Claudia_T]

Iniquity means lawlessness and Jesus will say He never KNEW them

Mt:7:23: And then will I profess unto them, I never KNEW you: depart from me, ye that work lawlessness.

1Jn:2:4: He that saith, I KNOW him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

 

[Claudia_T]

Brother Bob and His Blood,

I wish that there were more guys like you two on here...

of course though there is Bob Ryan and Heavenly Pilgrim

and Diggin and Me

...I guess instead of the Dirty Dozen we could be the Dirty Half Dozen


except that I guess I dont totally agree with all of you but for the most part, I think that I do

 

[D28guy]

Claudia,

"are you saying that we are still under the law but not under the condemnation of the law?"

Claudia,

WHERE...IN...THE...WORLD...do you get the idea that I am saying we are under the Law?

I have consistantly said....over and over and over again...that the sciptures clearly teach that we are no longer under the Law. And I am not contradicting that in any way shape or form when I say a fellowship should do as God instructs and lovingly help the brother with the appropriate help...disciplne...he needs.

This is not rocket science here! :laugh:

Mike

 

[Claudia_T]

Claudia,



Claudia,

WHERE...IN...THE...WORLD...do you get the idea that I am saying we are under the Law?

I have consistantly said....over and over and over again...that the sciptures clearly teach that we are no longer under the Law. And I am not contradicting that in any way shape or form when I say a fellowship should do as God instructs and lovingly help the brother with the appropriate help...disciplne...he needs.

This is not rocket science here! :laugh:


Mike

but why Mike if sin doesnt matter?

 

[Claudia_T]

I guess really I dont actually fit in with anyone here since I view everthing differently...

**sniffle**

 

[Claudia_T]

Brother Bob,

I know this is off topic but I had started a thread over there on Clothing and what we wear... I had the idea that Baptists were conservative on that, but nobody seems to care.

Are the people in the "Regular" Baptist Churches conservative when it comes to what people wear?

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

BB: He wants to punish you for breaking the Commandments Claudia, but believes we are not under them.

They believe sin is:
worry
Think not about tomorrow
breaking the civil law
speeding
going in a posted swiming hole
killing a beast about to eat you if its out of season.

But what is not sin is the breaking of the Ten Commanments, such as adultery, killing, lying, worshipping a cow, stealing, coveting your neighbors wife, etc

HP: Possibly it is not that they believe that Christ only forgives us for “breaking of the Ten Commanments, such as adultery, killing, lying, worshipping a cow, stealing, coveting your neighbors wife, etc” but not “breaking the civil law,speeding,going in a posted swiming hole,killing a beast about to eat you if its out of season.” Some might be paid for already, while the others still need to be pay for.

Now that is an interesting possibility.

 

[D28guy]

Claudia,

"but why Mike if sin doesnt matter?"

AAAAARRRRRRRRGGGGGGGG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WHEN HAVE I EVER SAID "SIN DOESNT MATTER" ???????

This is absolutly amazing. Just incredible...

(But I'm not gonna give up) :thumbs:

Mike

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Here is yet another thought. If it all has been paid for, and God remembers them of us no more, then how is God going to appreciate any change that we might make? All He see is Christ, remember?

P.S. I am beginning to feel invisable.

 

[Diggin in da Word]

Mike,

You have advocated that one who is a Christian has past, present and future sins covered through the atonement made by Jesus' blood.

You also advocated the church disciplining one in the church for abominable sins.

If the sins have been covered, you discipline? If Christ is going to allow that one in heaven anyway (in which case the person would be blameless for he would have seen Christ), why discipline one for a sin that will not be remembered against one?