Understanding John 1:12-13

[Van]

John 1:12-13 NASB
But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name, who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of a man, but of God.

Here is my interpretation:

"As many as received Him" refers to "those who believe in His (Christ's) name. Thus they accepted as truth their understanding of gospel of Christ. But in addition, the determination that they had "received Him," and not another gospel, indicates God's acceptance of their understanding and commitment to Christ.

"He gave the right to become" refers to God crediting the person's faith as righteousness based on His determination. Only those whose faith He credits as righteousness are given "right" to become born anew children of God.

This spiritual rebirth was not physical rebirth, of blood, and was not initiated by human lust or will, but by God alone.

The close coupling of receiving the right to become, and being born by the will of God indicates a rapid sequence of events, with no discernible delay between receiving the right (under the New Covenant) and becoming a spiritual child of God.

Thus, when 2 Thessalonians 2:13 says God chooses individuals for salvation, the idea is God chooses them by transferring them spiritually into Christ. That is why the verse could be translated as God choosing individuals "into salvation."

 

[Van]

Note the clear sequence of actions, first a person receives Him, refers to those who believe in His name. Thus the first action is lost person comes to put their faith, as worthless as it may be, in what he or she believes about Christ, such as Jesus is God incarnate, born of a virgin, lived a sinless life, died as a sinless sacrifice for the whole of humanity, and arose from the dead, demonstrating His promises are true.

Next, the person is given the right to become a child of God. This action is God crediting the lost person's faith as righteousness.

Lastly, having given the person the right to become a child of God, God causes the person to be spiritually born anew, becoming a new creation, a child of God.

 

[kyredneck]

The text is in the same vein as:

Acts Chapter 13

48​	And as the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of God: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

John Chapter 10

26​	But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep.
27​	My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

John Chapter 8

47​	He that is of God heareth the words of God: for this cause ye hear them not, because ye are not of God.

 

[Brightfame52]

Note the clear sequence of actions, first a person receives Him, refers to those who believe in His name. Thus the first action is lost person comes to put their faith, as worthless as it may be, in what he or she believes about Christ, such as Jesus is God incarnate, born of a virgin, lived a sinless life, died as a sinless sacrifice for the whole of humanity, and arose from the dead, demonstrating His promises are true.

Next, the person is given the right to become a child of God. This action is God crediting the lost person's faith as righteousness.

Lastly, having given the person the right to become a child of God, God causes the person to be spiritually born anew, becoming a new creation, a child of God.

If they received Him, an spiritual action, they had to be already spiritually alive, for otherwise we be dead spiritually , and cant do any spiritual activity.

 

[Brightfame52]

To receive Christ and know who He was took a special revelation from God, cant know Him by nature Matt 16:16-17

6 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.

17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

Earlier Jesus said Matt 11:27

27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.

 

[Brightfame52]

To receive Christ and know who He was took a special revelation from God, cant know Him by nature Matt 16:16-17

6 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.

17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

Earlier Jesus said Matt 11:27

27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him.

 

[canadyjd]

This is the first of a repeating theme in John that reveals the truth that coming into a right relationship with God is according to the will of God and not the will of the person.

John picked up this theme in Chapter 3 where he explains to be “born again” or born from above, is an act of the will of God Holy Spirit.

By Chapter 10 we find no one comes to the Father unless he is “drawn”, and it is only the sheep that already belong to Jesus (He calls them by name) that hear His voice and follow Him.

And to make the point very clear, Jesus tells some they do not believe BECAUSE they are not His sheep. He doesn’t say they are not His sheep because they don’t believe, but just the opposite.

These are beautiful verses rightly understood as elevating God’s saving grace to His elect.

Peace to you

 

[canadyjd]

Double post

 

[Van]

This is the first of a repeating theme in John that reveals the truth that coming into a right relationship with God is according to the will of God and not the will of the person.

John picked up this theme in Chapter 3 where he explains to be “born again” or born from above, is an act of the will of God Holy Spirit.

By Chapter 10 we find no one comes to the Father unless he is “drawn”, and it is only the sheep that already belong to Jesus (He calls them by name) that hear His voice and follow Him.

And to make the point very clear, Jesus tells some they do not believe BECAUSE they are not His sheep. He doesn’t say they are not His sheep because they don’t believe, but just the opposite.

These are beautiful verses rightly understood as elevating God’s saving grace to His elect.

Peace to you

More false doctrine regurgitated from the bogus doctrines of the dark ages.

1) Yes, we only come into a right relationship with God by the will of God and not our will.

2) Yes, we must be born anew by the will and causative action of God.

3) Yes, no one puts their faith in Christ unless drawn (attracted) by the Father, John 6:44.

4) No, those drawn to Christ are not saved already, or even chosen for salvation, as God chooses individuals for salvation through faith in the truth, 2 Thessalonians 2:13.

5) Therefore the lost can hear, understand and place their faith in Christ BEFORE they are chosen for salvation!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

6) Now we get the vile misrepresentation of scripture, the claim individuals cannot believe because they are not His sheep. What does John 10:26 actually say, people do not believe because they are not "OF MY SHEEP.' Of is the translation of "ek" and here points to the source of His sheep, those open to the word of God.

 

[canadyjd]

More false doctrine regurgitated from the bogus doctrines of the dark ages.

1) Yes, we only come into a right relationship with God by the will of God and not our will.

2) Yes, we must be born anew by the will and causative action of God.

3) Yes, no one puts their faith in Christ unless drawn (attracted) by the Father, John 6:44.

4) No, those drawn to Christ are not saved already, or even chosen for salvation, as God chooses individuals for salvation through faith in the truth, 2 Thessalonians 2:13.

5) Therefore the lost can hear, understand and place their faith in Christ BEFORE they are chosen for salvation!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

6) Now we get the vile misrepresentation of scripture, the claim individuals cannot believe because they are not His sheep. What does John 10:26 actually say, people do not believe because they are not "OF MY SHEEP.' Of is the translation of "ek" and here points to the source of His sheep, those open to the word of God.

Good grief…..

We don’t agree @Van. I didn’t mention you or your comments in my post.

Let’s agree to never mention each other or anything we post as we respond to the meaning of John 1.

Peace to you

 

[Van]

Good grief…..

We don’t agree @Van. I didn’t mention you or your comments in my post.

Let’s agree to never mention each other or anything we post as we respond to the meaning of John 1.

Peace to you

LOL,

1) Did I say Canadyjd mentioned me in post 9? Nope

2) Did I mention or address the poster? Nope

3) I said the doctrines regurgitated were false.

4) Here, again is what I actually said:

1) Yes, we only come into a right relationship with God by the will of God and not our will.

2) Yes, we must be born anew by the will and causative action of God.

3) Yes, no one puts their faith in Christ unless drawn (attracted) by the Father, John 6:44.

4) No, those drawn to Christ are not saved already, or even chosen for salvation, as God chooses individuals for salvation through faith in the truth, 2 Thessalonians 2:13.

5) Therefore the lost can hear, understand and place their faith in Christ BEFORE they are chosen for salvation!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

6) Now we get the vile misrepresentation of scripture, the claim individuals cannot believe because they are not His sheep. What does John 10:26 actually say, people do not believe because they are not "OF MY SHEEP.' Of is the translation of "ek" and here points to the source of His sheep, those open to the word of God.​

 

[canadyjd]

The only thing “vile” is the irrational hatred of the doctrine that God is in control of the salvation of mankind.

I’m done with you @Van.

If anyone else wants to discuss the gospel of John, I’ll be happy to engage.

Peace to you

 

[Brightfame52]

@Van

3) Yes, no one puts their faith in Christ unless drawn (attracted) by the Father, John 6:44.

Drawing there is the consequence of the New Birth, only the people with a new heart are drawn/ caused to come Ezk 36:26-27

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

New heart and spirit in us then the drawing, causing.

 

[Van]

The only thing “vile” is the irrational hatred of the doctrine that God is in control of the salvation of mankind.

I’m done with you @Van.

If anyone else wants to discuss the gospel of John, I’ll be happy to engage.

Peace to you

My clearly expressed view IS God is totally in control of salvation of mankind. More effort to create an issue where none exists.

The vile misrepresentation was the posters misquoting and misrepresenting John 10:26. Here is what I said:

Now we get the vile misrepresentation of scripture, the claim individuals cannot believe because they are not His sheep. What does John 10:26 actually say, people do not believe because they are not "OF MY SHEEP.' Of is the translation of "ek" and here points to the source of His sheep, those open to the word of God. [/indent​

​

 

[Van]

@Van

Drawing there is the consequence of the New Birth, only the people with a new heart are drawn/ caused to come Ezk 36:26-27

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

New heart and spirit in us then the drawing, causing.

On and on, falsehood after falsehood, non-germane verse after non-germane verse.

Does the passage say when the person gets a new spirit within them? Nope. But scripture says we are sealed in Christ, thus after God has transferred the person spiritually into Christ based on crediting their faith as righteousness, which they placed in the gospel which attracted them to Christ.

 

[Brightfame52]

On and on, falsehood after falsehood, non-germane verse after non-germane verse.

Does the passage say when the person gets a new spirit within them? Nope. But scripture says we are sealed in Christ, thus after God has transferred the person spiritually into Christ based on crediting their faith as righteousness, which they placed in the gospel which attracted them to Christ.

You cant accept what the scripture says. The drawing is from the being regenerated, given a new heart. So technically when drawn you are a new creature, not a stubborn, dead disobedient person in the flesh by nature.

 

[Brightfame52]

My clearly expressed view IS God is totally in control of salvation of mankind. More effort to create an issue where none exists.

The vile misrepresentation was the posters misquoting and misrepresenting John 10:26. Here is what I said:

​

Now we get the vile misrepresentation of scripture, the claim individuals cannot believe because they are not His sheep. What does John 10:26 actually say, people do not believe because they are not "OF MY SHEEP.' Of is the translation of "ek" and here points to the source of His sheep, those open to the word of God. [/indent​

​

So its obvious Jesus is saying, if you were of my sheep, you would believe me. All your maneuvering is unnecessary, go with the plain sense of the text.

 

[kyredneck]

All your maneuvering is unnecessary, go with the plain sense of the text.

"All your maneuvering juvenile claptrap is unnecessary, go with the plain sense of the text".

 

[Van]

You cant accept what the scripture says. The drawing is from the being regenerated, given a new heart. So technically when drawn you are a new creature, not a stubborn, dead disobedient person in the flesh by nature.

Yet another bogus off topic post addressing me. No one is regenerated until they are transferred into Christ, thus they are made alive (regenerated) together with Christ, Ephesians 2:5. I have gone over this point many times, but not one Calvinist even addresses this truth.

 

[Van]

So its obvious Jesus is saying, if you were of my sheep, you would believe me. All your maneuvering is unnecessary, go with the plain sense of the text.

On and on, now misrepresenting "of My sheep" as it it did not point to the fields white for harvest, is the bogus claim.