Unity Thread for Calvinists and Arminians

[Herald]

Correct.- This idea comes from the current climate of tolerance ,and diversity being carried over into the realm of theology as an intruder.:thumbs:

There are times when the Church must divide. Division doesn't mean that the individuals involved must be surly or hateful; it simply means that it's best if they separate for conscience sake.

Sometimes an individual Christian is forced by providence to attend a church in which they are in disagreement with on some doctrinal area. The Calvinist-Arminian debate may be one such area. It's best if that person remains silent on the issue and not seek to cause division; but if the opportunity presents itself to attend a like-minded church it would be best for all involved if he did so.

 

[TCGreek]

I think we should call a truce, since Scripture supports both; at least so each side thinks.

 

[jonathan.borland]

If God elected us according to foreknowledge, then foreknowledge predates election, and consequently it may just be that our current volitional decisions actually predate the foundation of the world in God's mind, who knows the end from the beginning.

 

[Herald]

If God elected us according to foreknowledge, then foreknowledge predates election, and consequently it may just be that our current volitional decisions actually predate the foundation of the world in God's mind, who knows the end from the beginning.

I've used the following demonstration to explain how God eclipses time and space and how His omniscience operates. Like all human attempts at explaining the divine this demonstration is fatally flawed, but I think it makes an adequate point.

Take a piece of copy paper and draw a big circle in the middle. From left to right draw a horizontal line in the middle of the circle WITHOUT the line touching either side of the circle.

The horizontal line represents linear time. The far left side of the line is the creation of the heavens and the earth. The far right side of the line is the end of the age just before the beginning of the eternal state. Each and every human/cosmic event occupies a space on this linear line. The circle represents God. Notice how the circle encompasses the line on all sides. God is inside and outside time in space. God interacts with man within the sphere of the physical universe and within the bounds of physical law, but He is also outside that sphere since He is the one who created it; i.e. the creator is always greater than the creation. God sees all events within linear time as going to happen, happening, and happened; past, present, and future.

 

[mandym]

I've used the following demonstration to explain how God eclipses time and space and how His omniscience operates.

Which is something you can't know or even hold a reasonable opinion on. You are speaking above your pay grade so to speak.

 

[Herald]

Which is something you can't know or even hold a reasonable opinion on. You are speaking above your pay grade so to speak.

We can have a reasonable opinion, even about the mysteries of God, based on what is revealed to us in the Word of God. That is the role of a preacher; to teach the Word. Sometimes illustration is necessary to make a point clear. You didn't see in my explanation an attempt to explain how God is omniscient. I didn't claim to know how He is able to exist beyond the boundaries of the physical laws He created. We know these things are true because of Genesis 1:1.

As to speaking about my pay grade, I disagree. I am commanded to preach the Word. It's a cowardly pastor/elder who refuses to avoid the hard things of Scripture or it's mysteries. These things are responsibilities that are part of the pay grade of faithful ministers of the Word of God.

 

[humblethinker]

There are times when the Church must divide. Division doesn't mean that the individuals involved must be surly or hateful; it simply means that it's best if they separate for conscience sake.

Sometimes an individual Christian is forced by providence to attend a church in which they are in disagreement with on some doctrinal area. The Calvinist-Arminian debate may be one such area. It's best if that person remains silent on the issue and not seek to cause division; but if the opportunity presents itself to attend a like-minded church it would be best for all involved if he did so.

I appreciate your post. I feel you are absolutely correct. I have experienced what you have described when I decided to leave the church I was at. It was a very hard decision since I admired the new calvinist pastor greatly, having nothing but praise and and honor for him in all accounts of his testimony and all of my personal interactions with him. I wish him all success being that he is evangelistic in method. Who can argue with souls saved and changed lives bearing fruit? With him I believe I could have reasonably attempted to stay and serve in good conscience. However, I felt God's leading to another church and so silently and non-divisively I followed.

 

[Herald]

I appreciate your post. I feel you are absolutely correct. I have experienced what you have described when I decided to leave the church I was at. It was a very hard decision since I admired the new calvinist pastor greatly, having nothing but praise and and honor for him in all accounts of his testimony and all of my personal interactions with him. I wish him all success being that he is evangelistic in method. Who can argue with souls saved and changed lives bearing fruit? With him I believe I could have reasonably attempted to stay and serve in good conscience. However, I felt God's leading to another church and so silently and non-divisively I followed.

I respect what you did. Soli Deo Gloria!