View on Antidpressants

[Gina B]

Linda, I am not lying when I say this.

I have been depressed, with thoughts very difficult to control.

The last time it hit me was at one of the happiest times in my life. Life was going good, my spiritual health was great and I was happy in my church and no financial problems, nothing. One night I got "slammed" with thoughts of suicide, overwhelming, and it took me by shock.

I will never believe that it wasn't something in my brain that was going off. There is a history of manic depression in my family. I did not know that for a long time, but it was interesting to find out. There's also a history of migraines, which unfortunately, my middle daughter also has on occasion.

I'm as stubborn about anti-depressant medication as the next person. I took them for migraines for a while, ended up loving it because I had no more migraines, but I didn't realize how much it affected me until I went off them. (I ended up developing a reaction to them after about 8 months)
When I came off of them, I realized I hadn't been who I was. It changed my emotions, it changed how I thought, and that was a scary thing to realize.

However, if it comes to a choice of having uncontrollable urges to kill myself or going on medication, I'm going for the medication without any spiritual reservations. I've never taken them for depression, although the last bout of it had me close to going to the doctor for the perscription.

It's not a myth. I've felt it. It was real. It was frightening. I've struggled with it before, but this last time it really hit me that it wasn't just my life or feeling bad or sorry for myself or anything like that, because nothing was wrong.

The brain is complicated, but it's a part of your body and it does control emotions and in turn, thoughts. If you take a narcotic pain pill, it does nothing to the part of your body that's hurting. It blocks pain receptors that talk to your brain. Your brain then tells you there isn't pain, and you believe it.
Endorphins in your brain are released by your body that also give you feelings and thoughts. If you see something funny, they rise and make you feel happy.
If you get a rush of adrenaline, your brain tells you what to think.
If you eat too much sugar, you go on an emotional roller coaster.
The majority of females have felt the change in mental stability after having a child, or sometimes even with just normal body functions. Some more than others. Some get such a strong hormonal change that they are unable to control their tears or anger.

All kinds of things affect your reasoning skills, your emotions, and all that can change how you think or your ability to reason properly.

Your brain is real. Use anything that can alter it with extreme caution, but don't endanger your life or your ability to function in a useful manner by refusing to do what it takes to save your life and help you be able to remain independent as much as possible.

And please...I realize you don't think depression is real, and I probably didn't change your mind, but please...there are people out there that may end up killing themselves or may end up taking longer to get better than needed because of people strongly encouraging them to simply rely on God for healing when he provided us with the means to help ourselves. I'm sure he could, but he doesn't. We live with the effects of sin. Cancer, pain, depression, effects of sin.
God doesn't heal everyone by pointing at them. He gave us brains, doctors, reasoning for a purpose. Let them be used. The day will come when we will not need them. But until then, we need them. Luke didn't cease to be a doctor when Christ himself walked on earth. It's thought that he even *gasp* told Timothy to take a mind altering drug...wine.
Who are we to argue with scripture?

 

[Trotter]

Amen, Gina.

It's easy to sit back and judge the "weaknesses" of others. I have to admit I've played the Pharisee many times myself. But to see it, over and over, here on the BB makes me sad.

God is God. He created the world and all in it with but a thought and a word. While He walked the earth, He healed multitudes with a touch, a gesture, a word. And He stills performs miraculous healings today. but, not everyone who is need of healing receives this miraculous, instantaneous healing.

God gave man intelligence and wisdom. Even in Christ's day there were physicians. And man's knowledge of the body has increased exponentially in the intervening years. modern medicine has came a long way since the days of shamans. True, medicine is not an exact science, but it is an educated one.

When God chooses not to send a miracle of healing, what is one to do? "Well, obviously they just don't have faith in God..." seems to be the refrain in this thread.

God has given doctors the knowledge they need to help people get better. To heal them through medicines, surgery, and the natural bodily process.

Who are we to ignore the gifts that God has given?

 

[Gina B]

I read in Revelation the word 'sorcery', which is not speaking of witchcraft, but rather pharmaceutical; drugs. When one takes drugs that alter the mind and mental process, that one is practicing sorcery.

If you believe that chemical drugs can alter the mind, which you so strongly claim should only be controlled by God, why can you not comprehend that your body makes chemicals, and can make them in the wrong amounts or use them improperly, affecting the brain just as much as the ones man makes? Is your body wrong to be controlling your mind like that?

 

[standingfirminChrist]

True, the Lord did not heal everyone. As a matter of fact, He told Paul 'My Grace is sufficient,' Not 'Pills are sufficient'.

 

[lgpruitt]

Once again SFIC, you are twisting the words of the bible to your liking.
I can respect that you are blind, or so you say. It could be a walking cane for all I know not a cane for feeling your way around. I'm not slamming any disabilities....as that's what this entire thread is about. When depressed...clinically for bi-polar, SAD, depression, etc.....the brain is not reacting properly. The synapsis (sp?) in the brain are not up-taking the lovely stuff (I know the words but don't care to spell this in the middle of the night) that we need to "feel normal"....whatever that is.

Jesus didn't speak of pills.....but he did speak of doctors. Mental illness is real...just as real as the flu or TB. People from older generations don't want to talk about it, or so I have encountered. Older generations were taught to tough it out.....suck it up and go on.

Again, agree to disagree. I've spent far too much time on this thread due to your responses to someone that probably needs help.

My wish for her...Godspeed. Good DR....follow his/her advice.....and go from there. Your doctor, God, and you know what you need. No one here can give you that.
:sleeping_2:

 

[DHK]

True, the Lord did not heal everyone. As a matter of fact, He told Paul 'My Grace is sufficient,' Not 'Pills are sufficient'.

But what did he tell Isaiah:
Isaiah 38:21 For Isaiah had said, Let them take a lump of figs, and lay it for a plaister upon the boil, and he shall recover.
The lump of figs put on the boil of Hezekiah acted as poulice, much like many mothers do today when a child has a bee sting. She makes a poultice, something that will draw the stinger out of the wound, just like the poultice drew the poison out of the boil.
BTW, Hezekiah was greatly depressed at this time. Was this remedy also to be considered as an “anti-depressant?”

What did he tell Jeremiah:
Jeremiah 8:22 Is there no balm in Gilead; is there no physician there? why then is not the health of the daughter of my people recovered?

balm--balsam; to be applied to the wounds of my people. Brought into Judea first from Arabia Felix, by the queen of Sheba, in Solomon's time [JOSEPHUS, Antiquities, 8.2]. The opobalsamum of PLINY; or else [BOCHART] the resin drawn from the terebinth. It abounded in Gilead, east of Jordan, where, in consequence, many "physicians" established themselves J.F.B.)

What does the Scripture say about Luke?
Colossians 4:14 Luke, the beloved physician, and Demas, greet you.
--Luke traveled with Paul and undoubteldly gave him much advice.

What did the Holy Spirit inspire Paul to write to Timothy?
Paul said to Timothy: “Take a little wine for thy stomach sake and thy oft infirmities. Whether you think the wine is alcoholic or non-alcoholic is irrelevelant at this point. Even grape juice had a medicinal affect on dyssentery, a common stomach disorder. There are different types of dyssentery. Whey we were overseas, my son, as a young child drank from a shallow well located close to the washrooms (pits in the ground). He aquired amoebic dyssentery—the worse kind. Amoebic dyssentery never really goes away. It can flare up at any time. Grape juice can’t cure dyssentery but it can alleviate the symptoms. Thus Paul said to Timothy to take it for thy stomach’s sake and thy oft infirmities.

What did Jesus say when relating the story of the Good Samaritan?
[FONT=&quot]The good Samaritan used wine and oil as a medicinal product to pour into the wounds of the beaten Jew on the road to Jericho. Wince there was used as a disinfectant to clean out the wounds.

The playing of a harp before Saul was able to cast the demon from him. Do you put your trust in a harp or in God? Do you put your trust in a pill or in God. This is the question you are (illogically) trying to force people to answer. According to your own logic you would conclude that David didn't have any faith in God, but only faith in a harp. Is this also your belief?
DHK
[/FONT]

 

[TheWinDork]

Shell, a while back Alex Jones did an interview with Gwen Olsen and Robert Manciero. Gwen Olsen is a former pharmaceutical drug rep who has written a book called Confessions of an RX Drug Pusher. Robert Manciero is a film maker, his latest work is called Prescription:Suicide. I am trying to make it available on Google Video right now, I would recommend anyone who is thinking about going on antidepressants listen to this woman's testimony.

Anyone that believes or puts any stock into what Alex Jones publishes, writes or even says, is suffering from a bad case of Cranial - Rectal Inversion.

-WTD

 

[webdog]

Lisa,

You are forgetting one thing. I have already said I cannot see through these glasses. If you look close at my avatar, you will see I have a white cane in my hand. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that I am blind. The glasses are just decoration at this point in my life.

What about the anti-depressants now? decoration?

What do you even need a white cane for? Is it an ornamental piece to go along with your outfit? Who gave you the cane, or suggested that you use it? STILL hypocritical, nonetheless...

 

[standingfirminChrist]

The white cane was given to me by a state O&M instructer at the Virginia Rehabilitation Center for the Blind. It was not given to me by a doctor. One does not need to be a doctor to realize that one who cannot walk down the street without tripping over a cement car stop, running into a telephone pole, or into the side of a charter bus to put two and two together and say, 'That man cannot see.' The white cane is used in place of my eyes. It is a normal Mahler Folding Cane /w carrying strap and nylon tip that has to be replaced every so often due to wear and tear.

 

[Magnetic Poles]

If you believe that chemical drugs can alter the mind, which you so strongly claim should only be controlled by God, why can you not comprehend that your body makes chemicals, and can make them in the wrong amounts or use them improperly, affecting the brain just as much as the ones man makes? Is your body wrong to be controlling your mind like that?

SFIC, I would still like to see your answer on Gina's question.

 

[DHK]

SFIC,
I believe the FDA, (and if not the equivalent board in Canada), has declared that the caffeine in coffee is a drug. One might say that it is a mind-altering drug. It is (in many cases) no different than an anti-depressant. You get up in the morning and you feel groggy (read depressed). What do you do about it? You make a cup of coffee or two. What is the effect? It is a stimulant. It causes you to be more alert. It is a drug that stimulates the brain (mind) to be more alert more awake, more active, in times when it is prone to be sleepy. Ask truck drivers who tend to consume more quanitiies than normal. It helps them on long hauls to keep them from falling asleep at the wheel. It is a stimulant.
Unfortunately some people get addicted to caffeine. Create a poll on the board and see. "Are you or have you ever been addicted to caffeine," and see how many positive answers you get just among our own members. It is an unregulated mindd-altering drug.
Knowing that informatioin, let me ask you the same question you keep asking of others:
Do you trust in coffee or do you trust in God (to keep you alert and awake)?
DHK

 

[His Blood Spoke My Name]

DHK,

I am not sure that coffee is a mind altering drug at all.

Many people, including dieticians claim it will keep you awake at night, or wake you up in the morning. Well, I must be the exception to the rule. I can drink a pot and go straight to bed and sleep like a baby.

I know one woman who claims if she drinks even one cup of coffee after twelve in the afternoon, it can even be 12:05 in the afternoon, that one cup of coffee will keep her from sleeping at night. I believe it is something else other than the coffee keeping her awake.

 

[Gina B]

Here's a link.
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/druginfo/uspdi/202105.html

BTW, my old neurologist prescribed caffeine for me. I took it in a pill form, combined with a pain killer, or would simply drink caffeine at the onset of a migraine to see if it would prevent it.

 

[DHK]

DHK,

I am not sure that coffee is a mind altering drug at all.

I suppose you have to come to a definition of "mind altering drug."
First, it is declared to be a drug.
Second, it does alter the mind enough to stimulate it to be more alert than it otherwise would be.
DHK

 

[His Blood Spoke My Name]

So I, and thousands of others are an exception to the rule?

 

[bapmom]

DHK,

I am not sure that coffee is a mind altering drug at all.

Many people, including dieticians claim it will keep you awake at night, or wake you up in the morning. Well, I must be the exception to the rule. I can drink a pot and go straight to bed and sleep like a baby.

I know one woman who claims if she drinks even one cup of coffee after twelve in the afternoon, it can even be 12:05 in the afternoon, that one cup of coffee will keep her from sleeping at night. I believe it is something else other than the coffee keeping her awake.

You ARE the exception to the rule. What you describe is called being "medically hyperactive". My husband also reacts to coffee this way. He reacts opposite to quite a few different medications as well. I can drink out of the same cup of coffee as my husband, and I will get jittery while my husband actually mellows out.
Please do not disbelieve this lady. The coffee does keep her awake. I react the same way to it. If I have caffeinated coffee after about 12noon then I am up late into the night.

 

[Brother Bob]

:laugh: :laugh: :applause: We all in bad shape you know it?:sleeping_2:

 

[webdog]

I suppose you have to come to a definition of "mind altering drug."
First, it is declared to be a drug.
Second, it does alter the mind enough to stimulate it to be more alert than it otherwise would be.
DHK

I remember reading that ounce for ounce, coffee affects the mind moreso than alcoholic drinks.

 

[DHK]

The point I am trying to make here is that there are some on the board, such as SFIC who say that all anti-depressants are wrong because they affect the mind. Anything that affects the mind is a spiritual problem and not a physical problem, and thus should be taken care of by going to the Lord. Thus anti-depressants are wrong. This is the position that has been taken.

If this is so, then anything caffeinated, like coffee is also wrong. Why? Because, like an anti-depressant it affects the mind. If the one who takes the anti-depressant has a spiritual problem, then logically all who take coffee have spritual problems as well. Would this be SFIC's position?
DHK

 

[His Blood Spoke My Name]

I would not classify coffee in the same grouping as anti-depressants. There have been many, many suicides of people who were given anti-depressants. I have not seen one recording of a suicide by someone who is drinking coffee.